Aeroponic cloning problems

I'm using stinkbuds cloning units. I've never had problems before. I had 100 percent clone rates. Now, it seems every time I clone, plants start dying. I thought it was the heat. With temps never going past 82 degrees, they still die. They get all slimey and the stems get really soft and the plant dies. Anybody else have problems with this?
 

MacGuyver4.2.0

Well-Known Member
Crackersmacker-

Your temps are TOO high, esp for clones! Cuttings have no established root sytem and this is where converted energy for the plant is stored. With nowhere to store energy, the plant is forced to grow roots... if it can. This is a double shock impact for the plant. It has to rob energy from the few leaves there and try to regrow its root system. Do you have a temp scale for your cloning tub? If the water temp is over 72 degrees it is too hot! With air temps of over 80 degreees I can almost bet you your water temps are too hot. Ideal water temps are between 68-72 degrees and your air temps should be no more than 75 degrees if at all possible. I also run Stinkbuds units and found that it is a great system for a base, but you have to do some tweaking. Here's some general cloing info from the people who do it best- EZClone

Lighting​
The preferred lighting to use is a 2 or 4 foot dual fluorescent fixture. The 40 watt bulbs work best and
this is a sufficient amount of light for the delicate cuttings. A 2 foot fixture works well over our 30 cutting
unit and a 4 foot fixture supplies adequate coverage over our 60 and 120 cutting units. The light should
be securely suspended over the unit and should be placed about 8-12 inches above the top of the
cuttings.​
Filling Reservoir, Additives, and PH​
Next, with the manifold properly attached to the water pump and placed in the center of the reservoir,
fill the reservoir with tap water or another source of quality water. Fill the unit until the water is just
touching the very bottom of the misters, making sure not to cover them. This will ensure that there is
the largest volume of water in the reservoir possible without hindering the operation of the manifold.
Remember, the more water that’s in the unit, the cooler the water will remain, and the more stable the
ph level will be.
Note: Avoid using (distilled) water! It causes lack of progress and could prevent roots from
forming at all. However, Reverse Osmosis water is usually fine. If you feel that the tap water in
your area is too high in certain mineral content or has excessive chlorine, it’s ok to use an RO
system, but tap water in most areas is usually sufficient.
Next, I add my solutions. The first one is Dyna Gro’s – ProTekt. This is a silica based solution that
strengthens the cuttings from the inside out. It assists in building stronger cell walls, preventing the
formation of bacteria and invading fungi, and helps with overall health and vigor. I add it at dilution rate
of 1 teaspoon per gallon. In a large 120 cutting unit, this equates to be approximately 20 teaspoons. In
a 60 cutting unit, it equates to 10 teaspoons, and in a 30 cutting unit, it equates to be about 5 teaspoons.
Next, I add Dyna Gro’s – KLN. This is added at the same dilution rate, 1 teaspoon per gallon. KLN is a
liquid rooting hormone and is also full of vitamins and minerals.
After my solutions are added, I’ll adjust the PH. Tap water is usually PH adjusted somewhere close to
neutral or just above 7.0. After adding the Pro Tekt, it usually always causes an increase in PH, so the
PH needs to be lowered with a PH down buffering solution. I’ve also noticed that even without additives
of any kind, the PH of tap water will have a tendency to rise over the course of 24-48 hours. To
compensate for this, I adjust my initial PH down to approximately 5.2 because I know the PH will slowly
rise somewhere close to between 5.8 and 6.3. This is an acceptable range for getting quality results. I
keep the closest eye on my PH during this time period between 24-48 hrs. If the PH needs to be
adjusted again later on, do so, but it usually stables out after the first couple adjustments. If you are not
sure if you’ve got an accurate PH reading, I highly recommend getting a quality digital PH meter. You
should be using one of these for your feeding solutions in all stages of growth anyway.
Note: The additives I choose to use for the cloning process are NOT high in macronutrients. In
other words, I am not adding nutrients that will feed the plants with high NPK levels. (N=Nitrogen,
P=Phosphorus, and K=Potassium) Regular plant nutrients should be saved until the cuttings
have developed an adequate root system. I know that some people choose to clone with light
amounts of these nutrients, but in my experience, it takes the cutting longer to develop roots.
The reason a cutting is growing roots to begin with is because it’s in survival mode. It’s searching
for food. So, by adding nutrients to a cutting before it has developed a root structure or “a mouth”
if you will, it’s completely defeating the purpose. Save your nutrients until the plant needs them!​
Taking Cuttings and Unit Insertion​
Next, I start taking cuttings from my Mother or Donor plant. I prefer to take them directly from the Mom
right before I’m ready to insert them into the unit. On the average, I take a 4 or 5 inch cutting and leave
2 to 4 leaves on the top. If the leaves are small, I don’t trim them. If they are medium to large, I will trim
half of each leaf off. The reason for this is because the cutting only requires a small leaf area to absorb
a sufficient amount of light to keep it alive. Also, because the cutting does not have a root structure yet,
the leaves are sustained by the amount of moisture that is held in the stem. If the leaves are smaller,
the cutting does not have to work as hard to supply moisture to the leaves, which allows the cutting to
focus its energy on “producing roots”. It also has the added benefit of reducing the overall amount of
leaf area on the top of the Cloner. This prevents some leaves from getting covered by others and
makes for an overall friendlier environment.
As I take each cutting, I will cut it from the Mom with either a sharp razor blade or a quality pair of
trimming shears. Make sure the cutting utensil is clean. It can be sterilized with isopropyl alcohol, a
lighter, or both. I prefer both. I have heard multiple times that it’s necessary for the cutting to be taken
at a 45 degree angle. This is completely false. It does not matter. Just make sure the cut is clean and
the bottom of the cutting is not mangled. Roots will form along the wall of the stem.
Also, I use EZ-CLONE Rooting Gel. After taking each cutting, I place the cutting inside the jar of gel and
let it sit there until I have taken approximately 8 cuttings. This means I have 8 cuttings soaking up the
gel. I pull them out one at a time, insert each cutting into a New Neoprene Collar and place the collar
into the unit. In a 120 unit, there are 15 rows of 8. This is why I take 8 cuttings at a time. I prefer to fill
up a row, take 8 more cuttings, fill up another row, and continue that pattern until the lid is full.
Although the neoprene collars can be reused, I highly recommend using new collars every time you
clone instead of trying to clean the previously used ones. When the collars are used, they can get slime
in the pores, cracks, and creases from various types of additives and I think it’s a bit difficult to
guarantee they get totally clean. I would rather spend the few bucks for new collars and not have to
worry about potentially getting any bad bacteria due the old collars not being cleaned properly.
It is also important to let you know that I do not turn the water pump on until I have the entire unit full of
cuttings and have ph balanced the water. It usually takes about an hour to take 120 cuttings and insert
them into the lid. During this time, the cuttings are still absorbing the gel and an hour is not too long to
wait before turning on the water pump. The clones usually will not wilt within this hour time period, but
if you do get some minor wilting, after you plug the pump in, the clones will perk right back up.​
Water Temperature and Water Chillers​
IMPORTANT!!​
- Ok, now it’s time for water temperature. As with most aeroponic and hydroponic
systems, the EZ-CLONE was designed to be used indoors or in a temperature controlled environment.
When I was creating and first started using the EZ-CLONE, I noticed that if my water temperature was
getting over 80 degrees in the reservoir, the cuttings were prone to developing harmful bacteria. This
was usually in the form of a grayish-brown slime, and if not treated quickly, would kill all of my cuttings.
That being said, it didn’t take me very long to figure out that during warm periods of the year, I had to
keep the unit in an air-conditioned room or find another way of keeping my water at a suitable
temperature. My focus was keeping my water as close to 70 degrees as possible. This is where I was
seeing the best results and as long as I was cleaning the unit properly in between uses, my results were
very good, usually between 95-100%.
In an attempt to further the output of the cloning system during hot times of the year and achieve more
consistent results, I decided to try using a Water Chiller. These allow you to cool the water down
considerably without having to place the Cloner in an air-conditioned room. I thought about how much
energy was consumed by running an air conditioner in comparison to the amount of energy used by the
Water Chiller. Although a good quality Water Chiller is a few hundred bucks, it does use considerably
less electricity and it applies the cold water directly to the unit as opposed to trying to cool the air around
it. The amount of money that you save in air conditioning costs pays for the Water Chiller in no time at
all. It’s well worth the investment!
Anyway, I now use a Water Chiller instead of air conditioning. I set the Chiller temperature at 68
degrees and I get better results than I’ve ever seen. The cuttings root within 5-7 days, look absolutely
beautiful, and are able to be pulled from the unit in 10-14 days with about 100% success.

Daily Maintenance​
One of the most valuable benefits of using the EZ-CLONE is that it is designed to plug in and let it do
its thing. My time is very valuable and I wanted something to work “for me” not the other way around.
My experience with conventional methods of cloning (putting the cuttings into various mediums and
under humidity domes) was less than successful. Results were sporadic and I never liked the fact that
the cuttings had to be babysat and sprayed with water regularly to keep them from drying out. I’m
always proud when people tell me that they filled up their EZ-CLONE, went on vacation, and when they
came back, had beautiful healthy roots. THAT is what the product is designed to do!​
Transplanting​
Another major benefit to the EZ-CLONE is that your cuttings are developing roots aeroponically and are
not surrounded by any particular growing medium before they’re ready to transplant. This allows you to
remove the cuttings from the unit and the freedom to place them into soil, soilless mixes, rockwool,
hydroton (clay rocks), coco fiber, pure organic mixes, or to go straight into larger aeroponic or
hydroponic systems. It’s very versatile.​
Humidity Domes???​
The EZ-CLONE was originally created without a humidity dome specifically because it is NOT
necessary. Conventional methods of cloning require domes to keep the medium and clones from drying
out too quickly. They also require the grower to keep a constant eye on the cuttings to make sure they
don't wilt and die. The inner workings of an EZ-CLONE provide the perfect environment for rapid root
growth. Because the EZ-CLONE gives the cuttings a constant aeroponic mist of solution from inside the
unit, being concerned with the cuttings drying out is never an issue. Also, when cuttings are rooted
under domes and the domes are removed for transplanting, the cuttings go through a period of shock
and can often die. Another benefit to cloning without a humidity dome is that it allows the cuttings to
transpire and breathe naturally and much more efficiently. This drastically reduces the chance of
creating “too much” humidity and attracting harmful airborne fungi such as powdery mildew. The
companies out there who have attempted to copy our design and include a humidity dome are simply
trying to fool the end consumer into believing that the dome is necessary. Leave the domes off! It’s
better for the plants.​
 
I Have Been Using the Turbo Kloner For About 8 Days and have come across several issues that i could use some clarification on. First What is The Correct Amount Of Solution that is needed for General Hydroponics 3 part System for the proper PPM range. Also What is the best method of chilling this unit because using frozen water bottles sux and if i leave for more than 3 hrs Water Temp gets to 80.
 
scratch the 3 part solution been using clonex 10ml per liter as told to. But PPMs were in the 900's. i have it on 10 ml per gallon now and PPM is around 330 is that to Low? WHere should my PPM be around?
 
anyone know why my newley rooting clone leafs are curling up and turning black. in aeroponic's machine, 24 light cycle. no nutes at all. 3 of 11. thinking maybe light to close. any helpbwould be great. first time using clone machine.
 

Dumme

Well-Known Member
I Have Been Using the Turbo Kloner For About 8 Days and have come across several issues that i could use some clarification on. First What is The Correct Amount Of Solution that is needed for General Hydroponics 3 part System for the proper PPM range. Also What is the best method of chilling this unit because using frozen water bottles sux and if i leave for more than 3 hrs Water Temp gets to 80.
None! Just pH the water and let it do its thing. I'm guessing you have a T-24. I done recommend anything less than a T-96.

DIY your own. You'll come out much cheaper with a bigger reservoir and more sites; and with a big res, you're less likely to over heat and less bad bacterial matter.
 
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CocoCola

Well-Known Member
It does'n't matter the cloner. Hit up PermaClone...even if you don't use their cloning collars they'll guide you to the best clones you have ever seen and help you steirlize a cloner you think is no longer working.

www.permaclone.com

Check out their blog articles:

https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/the-3-reasons-clones-fail

https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/advanced-cloning-tips-tricks

https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/sterilizable-collars-permaclone-has-your-answers

https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/hydoponics-water-quality-and-water-treatment-a-must-read
 

CocoCola

Well-Known Member
Bringing up 3, 4, 5 year old threads to spam the forums with your permaclone crap, sweet brah
Good advice is good advice.

What does spam mean, anyhow? I feel like spam is that email or pop-up that doesn't pertain to ANYTHING I'm doing. At least my posts are apropos within the confine of where I post.

Thanks for being friendly, though.
 
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