First time DIY LED grow

PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Nutes & H2O2

I did not see how many gallons/liters your rez is, but you want ~ 4 gallons/~16 liters per plant to maintain pH stability as well as to offset water uptake- which results in increased ppms.

Plants need far fewer nutes with hydro. This is somewhat strain dependent, but ~ 1100 max t peak flower, then back off

You should not need any H2O2 in the rez. It's a band-aid. Solve the problem, which is usually circulation/aeration and temps

What H2O2 are you using? Drug store variety have stabilizers which could have a neg effect when using large quantities. You can solve both with a small ~ 160 gph pump like the Active Aqua 160. simply put a curved fitting so that the water sprays back into the rez

When plants hit ~ 4 weeks of flower, their needs change dramatically in support of bud development. Consequently, they dump a shit load of crap down the main stem and into the roots. The more plants feeding off the recirculating rez, the faster and more toxic the rez becomes.

Consider swapping to Hydroponic- Research VEG+BLOOM

BTW, love your DIY led fixture
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
There are 5 plants in 35G of water, so it looks like I did good with that part.

650ppm seems to be as high as I was comfortable going before I started seeing first signs of nute burn. I read DWC needs less nutes so I figured 650 was high enough. Should I try and push it higher after a full rez change?

The H2O2 was just an after thought that I thought may be a good preventative measure and raise oxygen at the same time. I am not sure what the ORP value should be in DWC. In aquariums we try and keep it around 420 (yes, really), and the 2 methods we raise ORP on aquariums is either H2O2 or O3 (ozone). Since my ozone generator is used on my aquarium and I had a bottle of H2O2 I thought what the heck. It is the 3% drug store type, and 5ml per gallon doesn't seem like much from what I have read. It won't fix anything (algae issues, which I don't have), but will help raise ORP levels a little.

I like your idea of the pump.. I have plenty of those laying around. I could easily use the drain line on the container and connect it to a pump and have it dump back into the res.. that will do much more good than the H2O2. I hadn't even thought of doing that, so thanks for that idea!

I didn't know about the rez becoming toxic around this time, so I will definitely do a full res change. Very much appreciate that bit of info. Should I change my nutes to a 1:2:3 ratio like the bottles day? 1 grow, 2 micro, 3 bloom + cal-mag? I am thinking I should.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
CaliJoe said:
There are 5 plants in 35G of water, so it looks like I did good with that part.

650ppm seems to be as high as I was comfortable going before I started seeing first signs of nute burn. I read DWC needs less nutes so I figured 650 was high enough. Should I try and push it higher after a full rez change?

The H2O2 was just an after thought that I thought may be a good preventative measure and raise oxygen at the same time. I am not sure what the ORP value should be in DWC. In aquariums we try and keep it around 420 (yes, really), and the 2 methods we raise ORP on aquariums is either H2O2 or O3 (ozone). Since my ozone generator is used on my aquarium and I had a bottle of H2O2 I thought what the heck. It is the 3% drug store type, and 5ml per gallon doesn't seem like much from what I have read. It won't fix anything (algae issues, which I don't have), but will help raise ORP levels a little.

I like your idea of the pump.. I have plenty of those laying around. I could easily use the drain line on the container and connect it to a pump and have it dump back into the res.. that will do much more good than the H2O2. I hadn't even thought of doing that, so thanks for that idea!

I didn't know about the rez becoming toxic around this time, so I will definitely do a full res change. Very much appreciate that bit of info. Should I change my nutes to a 1:2:3 ratio like the bottles day? 1 grow, 2 micro, 3 bloom + cal-mag? I am thinking I should.
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You are welcome, but I must thank you! You got me to rethink how to max my own 3g rezs- you gotta come by my thread and see the pics!

Make sure you check pH and ppms every 2 days, as they will be sucking up a lot more water, which will concentrate the nutes

As for ppm 650 is low for max budding. Push upward until you see a tiny bit of leaf tip burn, then back off. I mix 1000-1100 for a week or two after the 2nd week of buds then back down.

NPK ratios- well first you need a lot more than NPK, but plants need more N than most people think, which is one reason why I switched to V+B, also because they keep P low and K high. I would shoot for ~ 3:2:5
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Did a full rez change yesterday and added 3:2:5 of GH + cal-mag. Ran out of bloom nutes and didn't want to mess up the ratio so was only able to get the PPM up to 700. Getting more nutes today. Also needed to add 100 drops of pH up to raise the pH to 6.0 after adding everything. Added 2 more fans for the exhaust so now there is 600 CFM venting outdoors and 250 CFM coming in. So far humidity is still high, but much more stable at 62 (62 used to be the low but it would still rise to over 70 throughout the day). Humidity outside has been in the 80-90 range the last week during the evenings which is making things difficult. We were debating intaking air from outside but with such high humidity it seems counter productive so we are pulling air from inside the garage. Crossing my fingers everything will be good.

Anyone ever dose NPK separately, specifically K? I have a huge bottle of Potassium supplement for my aquarium that I doubt I will ever use, so if plants need more K I can dose that independently if I know how much. I also have a potassium test kit so I can get a reading of K levels before and after dosing if I can find proper numbers to shoot for.
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Maybe it is the 35G of water. I was used to 5G bucket before, and 10 drops would scare me as well. I used to add 3-5 drops max in a 5G bucket when I used to grow. After mixing nutes the pH was 5.2. The bottle does look really old as well even though we just bought it, and may be more diluted than what you and I are used to seeing.
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Pics from today.. starting to get frosty on the leaves, went from smooth fan leaves to bumpy near the base overnight and it is smelling so good today. Played around with fans some more, changing voltages and currents to try and make them as efficient as I can and also keep the noise down, as the box was starting to get too loud.

Full box, can't see crap, I know.


Lights off for a quick pic


Lights on
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
The 35G explains it. Why so big?

I see you have a big ass tote. Me too, but I use mine as a tray with an outboard rez (post #11).

CaliJoe said:
Maybe it is the 35G of water. I was used to 5G bucket before, and 10 drops would scare me as well. I used to add 3-5 drops max in a 5G bucket when I used to grow. After mixing nutes the pH was 5.2. The bottle does look really old as well even though we just bought it, and may be more diluted than what you and I are used to seeing.
Click to expand...
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
There is a saying in the aquarium hobby which goes 'The solution to pollution is dilution', basically the more water volume the longer it takes for toxins to build up. That was my thinking for such a large tote, more water = more stability (but also means more nutes, so it is a trade off). If I was more experienced I would feel more comfortable in a smaller container and we will probably go that route once we have a better feel for it all. Since this is our first grow in this box and under LEDs, we will be happy just to have something half way decent come out of it. We already know yield is going to be basically nothing this time, but the hope for the first grow is just to get all the bugs worked out of our methods. If we get 5oz total we will be 'over the moon' so to speak because it will be a break even point from what my friend has spent for the box vs having to buy it at clubs, and then everything after that puts him in the black. Realistically from what I am seeing now I don't think we will even get that, I am guessing between 2-3oz for the first grow, but the second grow I am hoping for at least 8oz, 3rd grow, 12, and 4th grow hopefully we have everything dialed in and can break the 1lb mark.

We have already decided the next round we will only be using 3 plants. 5 turned out to be to many in the little space. After seeing others on here be able to get 1lb out of a single plant, I think us being able to get that out of 3 shouldn't be to hard, especially if we do a scrog correctly and get everything else dialed in.

And the pH up does seem 'full strength'. We changed out the rez's on the veg plants yesterday and it only took 3 drops in 3G of water to go from 5.2 to 6.0, so it was the 35G of water that caused us to use so much pH up in that container.
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Day 37 of flowering.. I will have better pictures next update (turn off the fans). They are now starting to put on some weight (little buds, but are rock hard) and soooo many crystals. Wish I had the time to take better pictures but it was just a stop in, check parameters and top off water, and leave type of visit.







 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
It's probably too late this grow, but next go-round remove ~ 30% of the largest fan leaves from a couple plants to increase penetration. OR, add some supplemental side lighting lighting below the canopy
 
Bumping Spheda

Bumping Spheda

Well-Known Member
I'm guessing that little thermoelectric dehumidifier wasn't doing much so you bought all the Damp Rid? How much water is that little guy pulling, do you think?
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
The dehumidifier works as good as it possibly can, filling up the container every 2 days (which is about a 1/3 of a gallon), and the damp rid also pulls out a lot (using up the white crystals and filling with water every 5 days). I finally 'solved' the humidity problem for good yesterday for my friend... I took the meter. LOL. He was always freaking out about it being high and no matter what we can't get it below 50, but when humidity outside is in the 90s for 12 hours a day and we are pulling in air from outside, there is only so much the little dehumidifiers can do. I told him short of using a 400w dehumidifier and putting the fans on a humidity controller, it isn't something solvable, so live with it just like everyone else in the neighborhood that has outdoor grows.

PetFlora, we already removed 90% of the leaves.. far to many. I warned my friend about over pruning because I did that myself in the past and got terrible yields from doing it... well.. he got his head in there and starting pulling leaves off and when he finally pulled his head out 90% of the leaves were gone. He is now kicking himself over it because he did exactly what I told him not to do. Round 2 is going to be a million times better just from the stuff we learned this round.
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Updated pics..

Veg side... 4 of them are over 2' tall already, vegging way to long but they should weave very nicely in the screen for the next scrog. All different strains. 3 are going into the next round... not sure what to do with the 4th. There is XXX OG in the front, Headband in the back left, Blueberry Kush in the back middle, and Platinum OG Kush in the back right. 2 babies up front are newly rooted clones we took of the plants in the flower side right before we started flowering. The 2 we just put in are girlscout cookie and master kush.


And the flower side


Master Kush bud


Skywalker OG bud
 
CaliJoe

CaliJoe

Member
Day 44 of Flower. Few 'red' pictures from today and a picture of the power consumption for the entire closet with all lights and fans on.







 
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