Have any of you DIY COB Growers finished a crop under 1000W DE HPS? - POLL

Some of the most beautiful flowers out of a garden of mine have come under LEDs, hands down I will never fly another conventional HID.

You'd literally have to refuse to see the clear advantage with efficiencies and possibilities to find conventional HID to be outperforming LED, the only thing they have going for them is that they still work just as great as they always have and that they can be purchased for less than current LED offerings, but that will change within a few years for sure.

Enigma said:

2007? Back then LED wasn't nearly as advanced as they are now and I have yet to see any evidence that shows LED outperforms HID, otherwise I would have built a panel based on knna's detailed explanation of LED and the drivers.

They make great veg and clone lamps, thry are also great for micro/stealth grows.

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led passed hps in yields about 2 years ago. i agree that 2007 LEDs werent that good.

i still have yet to see a 1.5GPW hps run (that would be 4 units per gavita - people are usually ecstatic when they get 3)

Stephenj37826 said:

Oh and if you say I can't replace the DEs with 550 watts well sit back and enjoy the show. 2.8+ umol/j coming up.

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If this is true and you then you really have something. Current DE lights up 24-25 square feet, If done with 550 watts and really yielded what DE is currently yielding it would be huge. You should assign a grower to this project and really see. Can we see a pic of the lamp in question?

Enigma said:

I have yet to see any LED panel compete with any HID of any design or wattage.

From what I've seen, from what knna explained in great detail, LED fixtures are not powerful enough to replace a HID. They are, however, perfect for vegetative growth and cloning.

If you cannot circumvent the heat a HID produces, the cost is too high to operate or your space is too small then LED is your best option to flower.

If you can run a HID, run one.

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So what you're saying is led is more efficient but can't produce the same yield so by your logic a 1000w led panel would produce less weed than a 1000w hid fixture despite being more efficient.

Don't you realize just how incredible retarded that sounds

CobKits said:

i still have yet to see a 1.5GPW hps run (that would be 4 units per gavita - people are usually ecstatic when they get 3)

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And the light your claiming does what yield in what foot print with how many watts?

i can consistently get over 1000g from 725W wall watts in 22.5 SF with a not-too-fancy cob rig

CobKits said:

i can consistently get over 1000g from 725W wall watts in 22.5 SF with a not-too-fancy cob rig

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The whole site knows your full of shit when you say nothing about strain and nothing about length of veg. No doubt people could achieve that i think, but you are not. Show us your pics and how you are achieving that? Not your Glue tent either, some real grower stuff. We have seen the pics of 900 watts of cob doing that, show us your 700 watts in less foot print.

those were multiple runs of sours with about a 4 week veg.ill pm you. sorry if its not a"real grow" in your eyes as i said its only 725W and i only need so many meds. i think were kinda beyond proving the viability of cobs at this point remember the efficiency has improved well over 10% and fallen dramatically in cost since cobs were matching HPS years ago. If HPS works for you thats great, ive seen a lot of rooms bigger than mine and 2 - 2.5 units per gavita (1150W at the wall) is about the average. i know some guys that get 3 but they veg to 3-4 feet first.

its hard not to take statements like "No doubt people could achieve that i think, but you are not." personally, sounds like you have an axe to grind, ive always been pretty polite to you and im not on here claiming im some master grower who gets 2gpw. you can find dozens and dozens of examples of people pulling ~1.5 GPW from cobs over the last year around here. again i have never heard of a 4 unit gavita run so as they say, pics or it didnt happen

Enigma said:

I have yet to see any LED panel compete with any HID of any design or wattage.

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i can buy that. most 'panels' cant do it, you need an array. also if youre limiting yourself to most of the commercial offerings over the last few years you would definitely come up short

as far as mainstream commercial panels out in last 5 years most are lacking. BML/fluence is probably the exception but again thats a whole different animal than a high-powered cob array. its easy for people to try a 2012-2013 commercial panel, have awful results and throw the entire LED industry out with the bathwater. cobs really didnt exist back then apart from the real early adopters.

that would be like dismissing the entire class of HID fixtures after trying to grow with a 70W HPS wallpack.

it seems like the main argument for HPS is still "well all the big operations are still using them so......"

The majority of the cars on the road are still used cars that are less efficient and more costly to operate than newer models, that doesnt mean you should go out and buy an old car if efficiency is your goal (it isnt for everybody, same with lights). at least old cars have resale value, old light fixtures not so much. its much easier to keep your warehouse going than it is to scrap everything and buy new fixtures that are going to take you 2-3 years or more to pay off.

i will concede that currently for a given dollar budget you can light up a lot more space with HPS quicker and cheaper than off-the shelf commercial fixtures but the operating costs catch up quick. there will come a time where margins are so thin that these operating costs will become a reality for the large producers

a mongo frog said:

The whole site knows your full of shit when you say nothing about strain and nothing about length of veg. No doubt people could achieve that i think, but you are not. Show us your pics and how you are achieving that? Not your Glue tent either, some real grower stuff. We have seen the pics of 900 watts of cob doing that, show us your 700 watts in less foot print.

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Don't bother dude i'm done asking for sources they are just talking hypothetical with no evidence, 550w to replace a DE light...not going to happen. Honestly not worth the time they are just gonna come up with some more stuff they can't backup , more outrageous claims and hypothetical situations that never apply to the real world.

The only thing i care about is results, they post none.

CobKits said:

i can consistently get over 1000g from 725W wall watts in 22.5 SF with a not-too-fancy cob rig

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CobKits said:

those were multiple runs of sours with about a 4 week veg.ill pm you. sorry if its not a"real grow" in your eyes as i said its only 725W and i only need so many meds. i think were kinda beyond proving the viability of cobs at this point remember the efficiency has improved well over 10% and fallen dramatically in cost since cobs were matching HPS years ago. If HPS works for you thats great, ive seen a lot of rooms bigger than mine and 2 - 2.5 units per gavita (1150W at the wall) is about the average. i know some guys that get 3 but they veg to 3-4 feet first.

its hard not to take statements like "No doubt people could achieve that i think, but you are not." personally, sounds like you have an axe to grind, ive always been pretty polite to you and im not on here claiming im some master grower who gets 2gpw. you can find dozens and dozens of examples of people pulling ~1.5 GPW from cobs over the last year around here. again i have never heard of a 4 unit gavita run so as they say, pics or it didnt happen

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Read your own words.

But they are replacing HID, how are your LED grows falling short compared to your conventional HIDs?

a mongo frog said:

If this is true and you then you really have something. Current DE lights up 24-25 square feet, If done with 550 watts and really yielded what DE is currently yielding it would be huge. You should assign a grower to this project and really see. Can we see a pic of the lamp in question?

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I've contacted a YouTube grower suggested here in this forum to do an unbiased test run. I honestly want the facts. If for some reason it doesn't cut the mustard I want to know why and fix it lol. Here is growmau5 yield in a 4x4 with QBs at 2.4 umol/j..... 1.69 gpw for an impressive 2.67units (1203g) in a 4x4 area.

That's with s5 flux bin and A1 voltage bin. Current QBs output around 10% more than the model he uses. The HLG-550 Elite uses a yet to be released QB that has more LEDs of a different spectrum. We will have sphere data soon on these and should be 2.8 umol/j system level.....

So mongo what are you looking for in yield to match DE? 2.5 units (AKA 1GPW)? Give us a benchmark

Enigma said:

2007? Back then LED wasn't nearly as advanced as they are now and I have yet to see any evidence that shows LED outperforms HID, otherwise I would have built a panel based on knna's detailed explanation of LED and the drivers.

They make great veg and clone lamps, thry are also great for micro/stealth grows.

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Of course when I said 2007 I was exaggerating for effect since you were talking nonsense. about 2015 is when they began to equal hid. (like cobby said). Cree is ( if their press release is credible) is coming out with a big advance in mid power leds, which will be cheaper, more efficient and enabling mixing spectrums easier. That, if true should put the last nail in the coffin for Hid.

LOL, did you hear that dispensaries have a LED grown shelf, the bud has magical unicorn farts.
same led fanboys, same old song!!!

hey i was using ufos in 2007 lol

The LEDs in 2006 were full of shit, to get an "equivalent" 400MH it was nearly $1500-2k and nowhere even close to being an actual equivalent.

Not the same at all today by any measure. Keep replacing glass ever year, nobody will be mad at you except the green activists.

I hear people talk about LED, I read what people write about LED, but I have yet to see any evidence that they are superior other than a higher PAR compared to HID. From what I've seen, LED are great for veg and clone as well as micro/stealth grows. The spectrum really enhances the bud look and trichromatic production, but the lack of yield and lengthy flowering time disuades me.

Hey, if CREE has a new product that finally matches HPS pound for pound (I'm not worried about g/W as I'm not worried about operational costs or lack of grow space) I will jump right on that fucking bandwagon.

Until then, I have been thinking about supplementing a HPS with ultraviolet LED. I think that would be work the trichrome production in the last three weeks of flower or so.

Lack of yield is a misinformed assumption.

Most of my strains look like they could come down at 56 under COBs, I run to 70 and that's pushing many of them.