Home Built NFT/Aero Hybrid System

Having moved from a breadbox apartment to a house in order to expand. I needed something new besides bubbler buckets. AFOAF showed me the way. He had been using NFT systems, but he kept getting that common problem where the plants at the top of the slope were sucking all the nutes out of the flow and choking the plants lower down on the totem pole. To combat that problem he installed 1" PVC pipe along the inside corner of the channel in order to provide a steady stream of nutrient rich water directly to each root zone. The 1" pvc just had holes drilled in along it's length to let the water stream out. I had wondered what would happen if each of those holes was plugged with an aeroponics spray head.

In order to cut costs, I decided to go with 5 ft lengths of 4" PVC pipe and instead of using 1" pvc to plumb the inside of the channel I went with 1/2" PVC tubing. I ran the tubing through the pipe and drilled 10 holes and installed aeroponics sprayers in each hole. I attached a 3 way T at the top of the slope inside each channel to give the intial water flow with the rest flowing down the tube to the spray heads.. Each 5 ft tube is drilled to hold 5 plants, and there are 4 tubes altogether leading to a grand total of 20 plants in a 5x5ft area under a 1000w HPS bulb. The flow is fantastic with a very nice film flowing down the channel and the aero sprayers creating a very fine mist to keep the roots moist so I guess it's a kind of hybrid system. I don't know. But the plants seem happy right now.

In order to achieve a steady harvest. I am staggering each channel. 5 clones go in on day 1, followed 20 days later by anotehr 5 clones, 20 days after that 5 more clones go in and so on until I am harvesting 5 plants every 20 days or so, depending on factors.

I will be alternating between two strains. Gorilla Glue #4 and Girl Scout Cookies x White Widow.

I'm hoping that this will finally put me on the track to a steady supply and no more droughts between grows.
20170131_150629.jpg
 
View attachment 3890483 Keep us posted, I ran spray heads for two runs but had a few issues so reverted back to F/D.
Possibly pass on to me these potential issues? I'm under a bit of crunch with this one and it absolutely cannot go wrong. So if there are potential issues please, by all means let me get some warning first. lol

I always used bubbler buckets, this is my first NFT system and I'm pretty much just winging it.
 

TheChemist77

Well-Known Member
nice build,, i built somthing similar, used 4inch pvc 6pcs 5 ft long conected altogether with t's and 4 90's.. i have a 400gph pump that runs through then drains back into the rez, i use 3inch net pots w/ rockwool,,by the end of each run tubes are full of roots,,but never clogs.. been using it for 2 years on and off,, i alternate between it and a 4ftx6ft flood n drain table,, yields are the same,,i cant decide between the two so i use both..

https://www.rollitup.org/t/chemist77-315-watt-cdl-grow.880895/page-13
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
Possibly pass on to me these potential issues? I'm under a bit of crunch with this one and it absolutely cannot go wrong. So if there are potential issues please, by all means let me get some warning first. lol

I always used bubbler buckets, this is my first NFT system and I'm pretty much just winging it.
I wasn't running tubes, cut the holes in em but never turned on the water. I do run covered trays and had a hard time getting past the tubes not plugging up but ^^^^ seems to not have an issue. My biggest issue the first time I ran the spray nozzles was them plugging but I ran 18 with 6 plants so even a few plugging was not a huge deal and they were somewhat accessible. The next hurdle was rot, the root chamber got hot so covered the lid with a foam backer board for bathroom walls, works great, tubes shouldn't be an issue. I started to use hydroguard as well and chill the res to 66. Just have access to the sprayers and you should be fine. Keep me posted as I'm curious and still have the tubes lol. I'm actually thinking of drain to waste buckets next so I can move plants around as needed more easily. And yes roots are my nemesis, they seem to go everywhere I don't want them lol.
 

The_Enthusiast

Active Member
That what are you saying - nutrient/oxygen deficiency is quite common in NFT.

Try this (i do it) build a dam on the end of the system - something like this:
pp dam.png
You can build it by welding or gluing it to a small section of a tube that can be rotated later so you can drain your system. (if you understand what I am trying to say)

With this system there is no or little nutrient/oxygen deficiency - I used to run it in a vertical system for over than 20 meters before returning to reservoir.
 
I wasn't running tubes, cut the holes in em but never turned on the water. I do run covered trays and had a hard time getting past the tubes not plugging up but ^^^^ seems to not have an issue. My biggest issue the first time I ran the spray nozzles was them plugging but I ran 18 with 6 plants so even a few plugging was not a huge deal and they were somewhat accessible. The next hurdle was rot, the root chamber got hot so covered the lid with a foam backer board for bathroom walls, works great, tubes shouldn't be an issue. I started to use hydroguard as well and chill the res to 66. Just have access to the sprayers and you should be fine. Keep me posted as I'm curious and still have the tubes lol. I'm actually thinking of drain to waste buckets next so I can move plants around as needed more easily. And yes roots are my nemesis, they seem to go everywhere I don't want them lol.
Root Rot is a big reason why I decided to go with NFT. My bucket bubblers became so much work that I couldn't keep up with the changes as often as I should have and root rot set in. I fixed the problem but it cut my yield in half.

Sub culture B is miracle stuff as far as I'm concerned. Those little bacteria are wonder workers against mold, fungus,etc.
 
That what are you saying - nutrient/oxygen deficiency is quite common in NFT.

Try this (i do it) build a dam on the end of the system - something like this:
View attachment 3891285
You can build it by welding or gluing it to a small section of a tube that can be rotated later so you can drain your system. (if you understand what I am trying to say)

With this system there is no or little nutrient/oxygen deficiency - I used to run it in a vertical system for over than 20 meters before returning to reservoir.
I've read about this. I think they call it "Deep Flow" technique. I didn't think about a dam though. I'm not sure I will need one but I will keep it in mind for sure.
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
Root Rot is a big reason why I decided to go with NFT. My bucket bubblers became so much work that I couldn't keep up with the changes as often as I should have and root rot set in. I fixed the problem but it cut my yield in half.

Sub culture B is miracle stuff as far as I'm concerned. Those little bacteria are wonder workers against mold, fungus,etc.
I thought sprayers would be great but nope lol, still got the rot and yup took me a month and half to get back on track and save the grow. I Should have just started over but I'm stubborn lol.
 

The_Enthusiast

Active Member
I've read about this. I think they call it "Deep Flow" technique. I didn't think about a dam though. I'm not sure I will need one but I will keep it in mind for sure.
Some call it High Flow Deep Water Culture (I like that name more).

The solution is only aerated on the waterfall of dam and little waterfall back to reservoir - no air pumps or anything....
I'm hoping to buy a Dissolved Oxygen meter and ORP meter to see if a "small dam" is good enough to keep solution well aerated.
On side note i finished about 10 batches (77 days each) in this time of system - no root rot...
 

Aeroknow

Well-Known Member
Some call it High Flow Deep Water Culture (I like that name more).

The solution is only aerated on the waterfall of dam and little waterfall back to reservoir - no air pumps or anything....
I'm hoping to buy a Dissolved Oxygen meter and ORP meter to see if a "small dam" is good enough to keep solution well aerated.
On side note i finished about 10 batches (77 days each) in this time of system - no root rot...
My tubes were built with a 1/2" spray manifold on the upper inside of the tubes. The pisser holes big enough for a metal coat hanger to clear potential plugs(it can happen over time). 350-400 gph per 8.5'-9' of tube, there's def aeration going on where the pisser stream hits.
I always built our tubes with a drain with riser in it, never thought to do a dam. We start off the nute solution right at the very bottom of net basket and then when the roots drop, in a couple days, pull the riser and replace with a shorter one, or ditch it all together. Damn I miss my tubes, must start building them again.
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
I just don't get how the roots aren't blocking the flow in a tube :(. By the end of a 12 week (appr.) run my root mat is massive in my trays and until adding a silk screen on my riser/drain I had to pull roots out every week.
 

The_Enthusiast

Active Member
I just don't get how the roots aren't blocking the flow in a tube :(. By the end of a 12 week (appr.) run my root mat is massive in my trays and until adding a silk screen on my riser/drain I had to pull roots out every week.
I do SOG and only veg for a 1-2 week after rooting - the root mass is big but nothing special. The plants are about 1.0 - 1.2m and yield about 25-30g dry per plant. (the tubes are 11 cm diameter and dam is about 7cm high.

Maybe you veg more...
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
I do SOG and only veg for a 1-2 week after rooting - the root mass is big but nothing special. The plants are about 1.0 - 1.2m and yield about 25-30g dry per plant. (the tubes are 11 cm diameter and dam is about 7cm high.

Maybe you veg more...
Usually 21 days from seed and 14 from rooted clone. IMG_0624.JPGThese are clones that are 4 days in net pots after rooting in root riot pods. This is the same roots 15 days later IMG_0956.JPG
 

The_Enthusiast

Active Member
Mine 2 week VEG and AFTER HARVEST (11 weeks) their root is about 3-5x bigger than your second picture. But the beauty of DWC is - it doesn't matter - no nut or oxygen deficiency...

The nutrient solution goes through roots - i don't see a problem there
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
I can't find a pic of the root mat at finish but the mat is typically 4-5" thick over the bottom. I still have issues with roots going places their not supposed to but pretty much have it solved after 3 years of tweeking shit. I was a failure at DWC and ended up with root soup, not pretty although separate buckets would be nice. I keep looking at my tubes sitting in the corner but things seem to be working well so as they say ...... my setup is basically the same just wider when using the trays lol. and sometimes I leave the pump on but really don't see much difference between flooded 24/7 or timed floods.
 

Aeroknow

Well-Known Member
I just don't get how the roots aren't blocking the flow in a tube :(. By the end of a 12 week (appr.) run my root mat is massive in my trays and until adding a silk screen on my riser/drain I had to pull roots out every week.
Always used 6" pipe for the tubes and i used 1-1/2" pipe for a drain. I tried 2" but was zero difference so always stuck with the 1-1/2. Yeah roots would grow through and down into the rez, which we would just tare off, or even leave be lol.
Like the other dude, we didn't veg long at all. For years and years, zero veg! :hump: rooted cut right into the tubes and right into flower:-) we averaged around 1.5 zips per plant and was one plant per sqft, 8 plants per 8.5' tube. Now that was with big ass yielders from back in the day. As soon as OG came out and gdp, the yields from the tubes went down.

My tubes fricken killed it man. I stopped building them because my setups were getting larger and larger. Too many plants. But as soon as plant counts don't matter at all, i'm going back to them for sure. Never have I seen another setup including dwc, that matches the growth rate.
 
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Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
Well I do keep looking at them and they are all ready to go lol. I used 6" square fence post but we have slim duct at work that is flat on top and round in the bottom, they come in two pieces and the top just snaps in place, 10' lengths, figure they would work really well, may have to try :). I'm trying to get a bunch of squares pails and do a drain to waste next using drip and hydroton as medium. I need to be able to move individual plants around to get perpetual as space is lacking. If I don't get things going soon I will be waiting till spring and head outdoors :). We don't have plant counts here, one is illegal so I typically plant 15 outdoors now, used to do lots, biggest was 1500 20 years ago ;).
 
Well the good news is that the plants seem to be recovering from their root pathogen incident. They are thriving again and while the brown roots are still there, they are rapidly overwhelmed by fresh new growth. So the plants are fighting it off much better now that I have changed things. I froze a couple 2 litre bottles of water and alternate them once a day and that keeps my rez nice and cold at 65 degrees. Before it was getting quite warm. I honestly never realized how complicated running an NFT system would get.

Anyway, I have serious technical questions:

How much flow should I have? I have read article after article and none seem to fit what I am doing. Some have said use big pumps with high flow rates, others have said tiny pumps with just a trickle. Some are made with round pipes, some aren't. It's really confusing.

Right now I have 2 tubes running on a single 10 gallon rez with an ECO264 water pump. I'm not sure if I should invest the 50 bucks in a much bigger pump or not to really force that water through. Opinons?
 
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