lucas question

im4satori

Well-Known Member
fyi
im a big fan of the 50/50 maxi grow maxibloom ratios for bloom
the numbers look great

perfect 2:1:3 ratio npk and perfect K:Ca:Mg caution ratios

in a soil grow this formula might work well for both veg and bloom

I am not at all a fan of the maxibloom alone
 

TheChemist77

Well-Known Member
my tap water is 60ppm and a ph of 7. ive never had a need for cal/mag,, i wonder if thats just for r/o water?
i grow in rock wool, not soil and gh maxi series grows really great, i tested nutrients for a few years, then additives and boosters, you would be hard to find a better cost per yield nutrient, maxi always came out on top.. the gh flora series i got same results, very good but a higher cost per run.. as for additives and bloom boosters most are a waste of money,, i like the powder kool bloom as it pushes plants to ripen,, in tests w/ and w/out k bloom in the last 2 weeks of bloom,, plants with kool bloom finish 5-7 days sooner than plants w/out yield are roughly the same.. i like silica in place of ph up, but i use very little, a gallon lasts me about 2 years,, i also like plant life super b+ for veg and clones its a kelp base and seems to really help getting roots established w seedlings and clones it also seems to keep the overall vigour of plants up.. no droopy leaves...
 

im4satori

Well-Known Member
my tap water is 60ppm and a ph of 7. ive never had a need for cal/mag,, i wonder if thats just for r/o water?
i grow in rock wool, not soil and gh maxi series grows really great, i tested nutrients for a few years, then additives and boosters, you would be hard to find a better cost per yield nutrient, maxi always came out on top.. the gh flora series i got same results, very good but a higher cost per run.. as for additives and bloom boosters most are a waste of money,, i like the powder kool bloom as it pushes plants to ripen,, in tests w/ and w/out k bloom in the last 2 weeks of bloom,, plants with kool bloom finish 5-7 days sooner than plants w/out yield are roughly the same.. i like silica in place of ph up, but i use very little, a gallon lasts me about 2 years,, i also like plant life super b+ for veg and clones its a kelp base and seems to really help getting roots established w seedlings and clones it also seems to keep the overall vigour of plants up.. no droopy leaves...
the calmag amount will change depending on your source water

the maxi isn't in need of much its already very close to having enough calcium and magnesium so if theres even 10ppm calcium in your source water youll be ok and with in the margin of error
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
All that is way too complicated. After the stretch is over I just started using a Lucas type feed using AN 3 - part nutes. I drop the Grow and am using just the Micro and Bloom in a 1:2 ratio along with Big Bud which is 0-15-35 with 10% S and 20 amino acids and ascorbic and citric acids. My goto bloom booster.

your ppm meter doesn't read actual ppm (yes its stupid and confusing) as in elemental ppm
your meter reads electrical conductivity aka E.C.
when a meter says ppm its actually reading EC and converting the EC to a larger number that they call ppm which isn't really ppm

omg this is starting to sound like a john oliver show lol

for this reason an EC meter is better and more accurate to measure with and speak about than a ppm meter

if your meter will switch over to read EC then do that... if your meter only reads ppm, when it brakes buy one that reads EC instead
Actually a PPM or TDS meter just reports the EC reading in a different scale like the freezing temp of pure water is 32F or 0C. Exactly the same temp just different ways of expressing that temp.

The problem with using ppm is that there are 3 different scales used depending on maker and how they base their readings. I use a Hanna so if I tell a guy to aim for 1000ppm and he uses a pen made by Truncheon he will only be at 730ppm if measured by my pen and be more than 25% lower than he wants. Conversely if he tells me to aim for a thousand according to his pen and I don't know he's using a different scale and I do with using my pen I'll be at 1400ppm and overshoot by 40%.

As long as we know that translation is needed we can use a simple chart like this one to make sure we are speaking the same language and everything works out fine. This chart is the size of a full sheet of paper and ready to print out.

PPM-EC-CF.jpg

There is a good article here that goes thru it all in more detail if you want to read more about it. The author prefers everyone uses EC too but there's nothing wrong with using PPM as long as you are aware of the differences and compensate for them.

:peace:
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
For some reason nothing happens when I use the Edit button and I forgot to put in the link to the article so HERE it is.

I think that chart is smaller than I thought but still handy to have.
 

JDMase

Well-Known Member
I too stand by the lucas formula, but wanted to know how to improve it for floranova users? Should I also mix the grow and bloom for a better NPK ratio?
 

im4satori

Well-Known Member
I too stand by the lucas formula, but wanted to know how to improve it for floranova users? Should I also mix the grow and bloom for a better NPK ratio?
no

the flora nova bloom is meant to be used alone and already has proper ratios
it doesn't require anything more

its not lucas
its closet to what I mix (2:1:3) but with more P
 

im4satori

Well-Known Member
7mls flora nova + 30mls silica blast

would yield

N74
P65
K140
Si150
buy the time you ph adjust with phosphoric acid your P would go up considerably to qualify as a true lucas ratio
but the ph would be so very high with that much silica blast and that's A LOT of Si

I wouldn't mix it with that much silica blast but it does show you can easily add silica blast to the flora nova without throwing out the potassium ,calcium, magnesium caution since theres plenty of calcium and magnesium in it

so to the point with the flora nova you can add as much silica blast (up to 30mls per gallon) without issue, provided you can manage the ph rise
 

TheChemist77

Well-Known Member
i was told jacks classic citrus 20-10-20 at 1/4 tsp per gallon is like the lucas formula.. i bought a lb of jacks citrus and a lb of potassium sulfate 0-0-50,, for veg 1/4tsp of jacks alone,, bloom 1/4tsp of jacks + 1/4tsp of potassium per gallon.. ive tried it in veg but havnt used it in bloom yet...
 

im4satori

Well-Known Member
i was told jacks classic citrus 20-10-20 at 1/4 tsp per gallon is like the lucas formula.. i bought a lb of jacks citrus and a lb of potassium sulfate 0-0-50,, for veg 1/4tsp of jacks alone,, bloom 1/4tsp of jacks + 1/4tsp of potassium per gallon.. ive tried it in veg but havnt used it in bloom yet...
that is some very hot fertlizer
and that's a lot of potassium
if your going to us it would weigh it
and only if you grow in soil and ph adjust with phosphoric acid
I would advise mixing it at

per gallon
bloom
2grams jack 20-10-20
0.5 grams potassium sulfate

yields
N106
P23
K145

veg2.5 grams jack

yeilds
N132
P29
K110

personally

I would also consider mixing it like this for bloom
using mono potassium phosphate mkp

2grams jacks
1gram mkp

yields

N106
P83
K162

which is very close to lucas but with the extra N it needs
 

TheChemist77

Well-Known Member
that is some very hot fertlizer
and that's a lot of potassium
if your going to us it would weigh it
and only if you grow in soil and ph adjust with phosphoric acid
I would advise mixing it at

per gallon
bloom
2grams jack 20-10-20
0.5 grams potassium sulfate

yields
N106
P23
K145

veg2.5 grams jack

yeilds
N132
P29
K110

personally

I would also consider mixing it like this for bloom
using mono potassium phosphate mkp

2grams jacks
1gram mkp

yields

N106
P83
K162

which is very close to lucas but with the extra N it needs


thanks for the info,, im in hydro and ph is high,7 after mix,, i ad ph down to 5.6 and it rizes slowly to 6.2 over 3 days.. by 3 days i have to top off rez and redue ph... that is why i really like gh maxi,, it mixes and puts my ph to perfect at 1 tsp per gallon,,, i rearly ever need to check my ph using it...very simple
 

im4satori

Well-Known Member
it can work fine for hydro

but youll want to mix it more precisely by measuring it it grams.weight

if you over do the potassium sulfate even by a small % amount it can greatly change your mix... potassium sulfate has 50+% potassium so a small bit goes a long way

at least that's my opinion, just an opinion
 
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