MI new era cannabis regulations

chemphlegm said:

I think some will do it right and others will fail. No reason to believe they'll all suck. most will desire to shine in their arena. Growing knowledge isnt magic anymore, we have access to infinite information. Everyone could know how to dry if they read a book, shared common sense for instance. Big tobacco has seemingly convinced billions to use their corporate tobacco rather than grow their own, which is legal.
some corps make good products while others not so much.
I hope they do it right for patients' sake

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If that were the case, then everyone would have good weed. Not everything can be learned from a book. You can get an idea of how to dry and cure from a book, but it takes an experienced palate as well as sense of smell, sight, and feel. That's where experience comes in. You can't get personal with a commercially grown amount of bud. It will take lots of climate control equipment to get it close without having someone with real experience checking every bud constantly.

I agree, but what makes us think these money bags wont hire experienced individuals as well as employ proper equipment?

for example there are many different grades of tobacco, nasty tasting cheap shit and premium cigars costing big bucks to the run of the mill marlboro maybe. all their users are happy to choose whatever it is they favor that day, or can afford. Theres enough room for those tobacco producers that dont dry correclty, sell nasty tasting product, fertilize too much or whatever, to continue to profit in the market for decades now. The smoke shops are chocked full of choices ranging from cheap to expensive to low quality/high quality for that reason. why wont marijuana be similar? sure there will be learning curves for these types . I've seen and sampled the buds from some dispensaries, and those are from the "boutique" growers and some sucked, some good. sucky ones stopped showing up, stopped selling, good ones ramped up their supply. still, sucky ones exist for those needing that option.

Dont cha think everyones tolerance and taste went through the roof since medical and a little later recreational mj swept over America?

Most money bags do hire experienced growers and still come up short. I do believe commercial grows can get a higher quality but I don't think most of them do it. They grow to get the most yield so they can maximize their profits by selling it for cheap and undercutting their competition. Like the tobacco, alcohol and pretty much every other industry there will be different standards for quality. There will be people who don't mind buying the cheapest stuff, people who buy it for the packaging and people who want a local product. Anyways I do believe that these large scale grows will never come close to someone who has a smaller garden and tends to the plant with tlc. That's just how I feel, maybe my opinion is skewed because I don't want to see this industry go to the people who throw money at it when there's growers who do this for their patients, passion, livelihood, etc.

since1991 said:

Dont cha think everyones tolerance and taste went through the roof since medical and a little later recreational mj swept over America?

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not everyones. garbage weed is abound, selling like crazy, and seems to be the norm for alot of patients that finally find me. read the forums here even , lotta bs growers with small boutique gardens using turf treatments, consuming moldy buds and worse.

Thats horrible. Its not hard to grow the good stuff. Genetics and the right environment is 80% of it. A good grower just lets the plant do its thing after that. Harvest when ripe...Get yer drying and a nice cure going. I dont see the big deal. I will admit. Alot of so called growers feed too much. Chop too early...and rush the drying and curing process. And thier rooms are subpar...usually too warm and humid.

since1991 said:

Thats horrible. Its not hard to grow the good stuff. Genetics and the right environment is 80% of it. A good grower just lets the plant do its thing after that. Harvest when ripe...Get yer drying and a nice cure going. I dont see the big deal. I will admit. Alot of so called growers feed too much. Chop too early...and rush the drying and curing process. And thier rooms are subpar...usually too warm and humid.

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Right On !!

just read the forums for a real life peek at what these growers are believing, the advice they take, the advice they give even sometimes.
. alot of growers start on a shoe string, with shit info and supplies often. they trip over dollars to pick up nickels. They back pedal and ruin plants, then to top it off they give smoke reports telling how much the strain sucks, how wrong the breeder flower time was, how it tastes like hay, doesnt burn right, wont dry good taped to a grow bulb, shits crazy. wash, rinse, repeat. Whenever someone sees a yellow leaf they flock to the chart of shit to add . No matter that their nutrient supply is a complete system, no matter a dying old bottom leaf, they have to add, then comes more issues.

I got really frikken lucky, in high school I learned to read books. I read a couple grow books, equipped my room, set the controls and have not changed any of them since 08. First harvest was awesome, last one was better for the wicked cool stateside breeders and these damned chemdogs

peace

There's a lot of good info and good growers on here but a lot of bad as well. I really enjoy coming on here and seeing what's new with growers, even if it's gets redundant. People really need to gather as much info as possible to collectively form their opinion because of the broad spectrum of opinions. As for me I enjoy switching things up, even if it costs a little extra money. I mean that's what comes along with a hobby. When I try something new I tend to run into problems and I am glad to have this resource. In the end nothing beats experience. It just another game of trial and error.

It's patience that separates great grows and cures from poor ones.

Every step needs slowed down compared to a cash crop.

Patience with slower longer veg. Patience to not over feed and watch the plants health closely. Patience to let the plants ripen fully. Patience to hand trim for quality. Patience to slow dry and cure long.

When it's business and only for money all these steps end up getting rushed sooner or later to pay the bills.

chemphlegm said:

my registered growing patient will be able to procure a cutting from me, if they have grow rights and are legally permitted to possess a cutting, without falling under this seed to sale corporate structure?

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Let's presume all is as you said. Let us also presume no one is around to 'see' it. being he is your Registry Connected Patient, it should be ok.
BUT... knowing government here, It may be questionable as that cutting came from a different patients plant. So that may be seen as an illegal transfer.

So far, that would be allowed as part of the MMM Act and the modifications made by 4210, 4827 (Seed to Jail Tracking) is not relevant. Or we hope anyways. This is where I have to mention the other side of the sword. LEO will expect tags. When they run across a CG moving a plant, or a patient taking a plant home, they ll expect to see a tag. No tag will be "Suspicious Activity". Suspicious Activity will mean an open investigation, which will likely need to also include the domicile, for a warrantless 'compliance check' to ensure you are not just a black market druggy taking advantage. Or your CG isn't because of that extremely suspicious untagged plant.

Timmahh said:

Let's presume all is as you said. Let us also presume no one is around to 'see' it. being he is your Registry Connected Patient, it should be ok.
BUT... knowing government here, It may be questionable as that cutting came from a different patients plant. So that may be seen as an illegal transfer.

So far, that would be allowed as part of the MMM Act and the modifications made by 4210, 4827 (Seed to Jail Tracking) is not relevant. Or we hope anyways. This is where I have to mention the other side of the sword. LEO will expect tags. When they run across a CG moving a plant, or a patient taking a plant home, they ll expect to see a tag. No tag will be "Suspicious Activity". Suspicious Activity will mean an open investigation, which will likely need to also include the domicile, for a warrantless 'compliance check' to ensure you are not just a black market druggy taking advantage. Or your CG isn't because of that extremely suspicious untagged plant.

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anything is possible aye?
black market druggy types, farmers market types, dispensary sellers and suppliers.. they be really worried about these new rules for sure. Us legal caregivers who only supply oil and buds have no changes. If there are changes for caregivers/patients, please quote them specifically, sans the Blueman fantasies.

Nothing changed for the worse for patients and caregivers using the original model.

To believe that LEO will be educated on the new rules (or rather, to give a shit) any more than they
were to the original language is a fools errand imho.
History has show us that LEO will do what necessary to find pt/ cg in non compliance, it's their bread and butter.

sure, but does it mean a new law was put into place forcing cg/patients to have a manifesto onboard if they're not selling medibles/and/or dealing with the commercial entities?

pergamum362 said:

Nothing changed for the worse for patients and caregivers using the original model.

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I know right, now we can have oodles of oil ! no more overage concerns, no more denying the sick the best meds, no more kids stolen by cps for legal oil !!!

I dont see what the fuss about the manifesto is. A few patients have voiced thier concern over thier information being on a piece of paper, but the reality is, that same information is on the back of your caregivers card, which is shown anytime he/she must prove he is operating within the scope of the law. Kind of makes that argument a moot point..its already there..and vice versa for the caregiver. I.e if you have a patient that ventures into a dispensary from time to time, that dispensary already has your informarion on record...wether or not you yourself use the shop.

chemphlegm said:

I know right, now we can have oodles of oil ! no more overage concerns, no more denying the sick the best meds, no more kids stolen by cps for legal oil !!!

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wrong. Rules have yet to be Promulgated. You all seem to forget this part.
The Rules haven't been made, let alone announced for you to 'comply' with.

The rules will be made up of a 9 person panel, 8 LEO and 1 Public representatives.
I am sure they'll be very concerned with the 4th and 5th uS Amendments, and the MMM Act. No Doubt they'll be very concerned to ensure you are not a dirty druggy taking advantage.

There are equivalence amounts that must be strictly followed if one it to not run afoul of the 2.5 oz limit.

Any Infused liquid (note:this is not the oil itself, but an emulsion/mixture with a percentage of oil included into the liquid (percentages to be in rules promulgated) like a soda pop, bbq sauce, ice cream syrup ect) has an equivalency ratio of 36oz of liquid equals 1 ounce of 'Usable Marihuana'.
Pure Oil is what legislature called 'Gaseous Product'. Hash, Pure extract, Wax, ect will be labeled as Gaseous Product.
Gaseous Product has an equivalency of 7 grams equals 1 Ounce of Usable Marihuana.

One is allowed 2.5 ounces of "Usable Marihauna". so 7 x 2.5 is 17.5 grams. So if you have 17.5 grams of wax/hash/pure-extract, you are at your 2.5 ounce usable limits. Anything over 2.5 ounces of usable marihuana, and you are no longer under section 4 protection.

The new language was very clear on the Manifesto language. Must Be Properly Filled Out. But Properly has yet to be defined by the state supreme court (Meaning someone has to be arrested and have the financial wherewithal to fight it all to way to the State Supreme Court). nor have the rules been promulgated as to what pertains to properly filled out.

Perhaps LEO themselves will start seeing this bs but I doubt it as their paycheck right now depends on them not seeing it.

You can think these new "Legislative" rules are there to keep you safe and from running afoul of "The Law", but rest assured, more rules will only make more criminals.

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The easy way to remember the new equivalency amounts is like this.

7grams of pure extract/hash can go into 16 oz of solid medibles, or 36 oz of infused liquids. Considering they are using a 7gram equivalency, assuming this is of pure oil/extract as being equal to one ounce of dry 'usable marihuana', it is a safe 'ASSUMPTION' that 7 grams of oil in one lb of brownie, or 36 oz of Soda Pop is an allowable infusion percentage. At least until rules are promulgated.

Of course, that is also ASSUMING the 7-gram gaseous equivalency is indeed pure oil/wax/hash and not yet another 'infusion' percentage for something like a E cig juice, and therefore, rules have yet to be 'Promulgated'.


So let me ask the question this way...

Which part of 4210, 4209, and 4827 have totally usurped the MMM Act as it was passed it into Law in 2008 is still escaping you?

no manifesto needs to be present when caregivers deliver buds to their registered patients, thats it man, did you miss that part?

I have looked and read but can someone link me to this "manifesto".

All I see for patients and caregivers is we need to label our concentrates when transporting and keep to the new weight laws.

It said to label equivalent weight and who made the concentrate or edible. And it said to keep it in a case in the trunk or out of reach of driver just like if we transport buds.

As far as I read all other changes or laws are for commercial medical transport and sale.

Am I missing info?

I really just want to know the law. I am aware of our criminal justice system.