Discussion in 'Hydroponics / Aeroponics' started by fatman7574, May 28, 2010.
Are there any reactions that take place, or is it just mixing salts?
YES. Primarily with calcium nitrate vs Epsom salt and other stuff. Mix your calcium nitrate separately and pour it into your nutrient reservoir first. This dilutes it so it doesn't cause flocculation with sulfur.
Mix your sulfates and micros in a second pail and you should be good. This is how I've been doing it for years, with very consistent results.
So if you keep them separate(part A and B) and only mix in the reservoir, there wouldn't be any reaction(precipitation)? My main question is can you dial down one of the ingredients independently, or do you need to worry about keeping ratios proper for a reaction to take place stoichiometrically[sic]?
I've only known of fatman by reputation. I've seen his formulas and I wasn't sure I liked them- but then I chalked it up to a lack of understanding on my part. Now I'm content using dry nutes from an agricultural supplier; their hydroponic mix, plus calcium nitrate, epsom salt and MKP. And generally nothing else but pH balancing.
For those who don't want to mix their own micros, this is where I got mine; Hydro-gardens.com
It's a solution strength issue. Changing ratios isn't going to trigger it.
Some chems are incompatable in concentrated (stock) solutions, the main thing is not to put calcium with sulphates or phosphates. The other thing is nutrient balance, if you go overboard on an element you can/will affect the others. Calcium (Ca) and phosphorus (P) are the main ones as they affect more elements than most.
Take a look at Mulders chart of nutrient interaction to get an idea of how they interact
Hydrobuddy does a pretty good job at telling you which salts should be in A and which should be in B. For the most part, you have to keep the calcium nitrate separate from sulfate and phosphate salts (or acids).
Basically put the iron DTPA and calcium nitrate and potassium nitrate in one part, while putting all the salts with sulfate and phosphate in the other part.
While I'm sure this is great for do it yourselfers, the point I'd like to make in contrast starts with the mixes I bought;
1. Their mix, which includes some of everything and all of the micros.
2. Calcium nitrate nutrient salt
3. MKP (monopotassium phosphate) nutrient salt
4. Magnesium sulfate (heptahydrate), aka epsom salt
With the above I can do both veg and bloom and I have a lot of flexibility in terms of ratios I can make. Plus, rock bottom pricing. It isn't total control but it's very convenient; just make a stock solution of the mix and give it a stir before drawing from it.
I saw a great page that also says you should put half your potassium nitrate in A and half in B because it is the limiting factor as far as how concentrated you can make a stock solution. I can't find the link at the moment though, need to find my phone.
You can put potassium nitrate in either A or B. You could put some in each if you were having problems getting the potassium nitrate into the A mix.
While I've not grown any pot with hydroponic, I do do veggies and usually
go through 1,000Lt a week in run to waste in coir filled poly bags. I have
switched from a 3 part(A-B-C) to a 4 part mix with the potassium sulphate
in the "D" mix is only for fruiting.
I did use a 2 part for about 8 years and had no problems with the salt/metals
in a 10L of the A & B concentrations. The waste is used in other parts of the
I have too much time on my hands until the next batch of clones is ready(i'm working on getting my own source..) I'll be using GH for a while, but does this recipe look reasonable? I made it from with hydrobuddy using recommendations on riu and other websites. Do most recipes have an acceptable pH(5.5-6.5) when mixed up or is there always additional pH adjusting for each res fill?
N: P : K 3.04: 1 :3.23
Part A = 1 Gal, Part B = 1 gal
A - Calcium Nitrate (Tetrahydrate) 223.065
A - Potassium Nitrate 95.001
A - Ammonium Nitrate 40.002
A - Iron EDTA 5.824
B - Potassium Monobasic Phosphate 43.3
B - Magnesium Sulfate (Heptahydrate) 125
B - Ammonium Monobasic Phosphate 20.001
B - Manganese Sulfate (Monohydrate) 0.582
B - Boric Acid 1.083
B - Zinc Sulfate (Dihydrate) 0.114
B - Copper Sulfate (pentahydrate) 0.074
B - Ammonium Orthomolybdate 0.039
(100x) dilution PPM
N (NO3-) 110.21
N (NH4+) 11.998
Total: 471.5 ppm
EC 1 mS/cm
So, this look worth trying down the road?
Si ppm recommendation? I hear it's good for plant structural strength.
Geez, remind me to tell your boss to find you something to DO! LOL
I've been told that a n NPK ratio of 3-2-4 is the goal to shoot for in bloom. It's worked well for me.
To simplify, one could use;
2g/gal Calcium nitrate
1.5g/gal Epsom salt
2g/gal 'Hi K' 5-11-26 hydroponic mix from Hydro-gardens.com, made into a stock solution and stirred before decanting the required amount
These four components also provide the veg mix, making plant nutrition very simple to maintain. Since its complete with micros and all, its likely to be a less expensive option for you.
Hydro-gardens.com is located just northeast of Colorado Springs. It would be a relatively short drive for you to go and pick some up in person. If you're lucky, the owner might come out and talk to you about our industry, like he did with me.
I've played with silica in hydro, and all it did Fuck my pH all to hell. I've taken to using it in a foliar spray at about 1Tbs/gallon to raise leaf surface oh and combat powdery mildew. It's okay, but Green Cure works better.
I will check them out, very close to my house. I hadn't seen any local sources for this stuff, so thanks. I will wait though and use up this GH. Need to get system dialed in first, and noob chemistry is one variable too many.
You may find, as I did, that the dry nutrient package I just suggested is as simple or even more so than the bottles.
where is this guy
whats the password to his excel PremixPPM3b1.xls??
Separate names with a comma.