organic dwc+drip using compost tea

Hello everyone

Im interested of organic grow and to be more precise I wanna use compost tea as fertilizer. My plan is to set up bioponics dwc+drip system. Basically bio-buckets without waterfall and grow buckets, just using one res (dwc).

Setup:
55 liter reservoir + 70 liter backup reservoir (main servoir will be topped from backup res with using siphon pump, I only add water to backup res)
1000l/h water pump + venturi (same pump recirculates (for aeration) the water on main reservoir + pumps the water to drip system.
lavarock as grow medium and for bio filter.

My tap water is close to ph8. Plan is to use ascorbic acid (vitamine c) to break down chlorine and to help lower the ph of the water. Bio filter will be lavarock inside cloth or filter bag. To get biotope up and running I will add kelp and carbs (probably brown sugar) to the res.

My plan is to use only compost tea as fertilizer. I was planning to use worm castings, bat guano, compost (horse and chicken manure based), egg shells, oatmeal etc. Compost tea bag will be "sitting" passively on the main res for weeks hopefully fertilizing my plants.. I know compost tea is normally used to gain beneficial bacteria and fungi to the soil, but why cannot it be used as fertilizer too ?

Anyone tried anything similar to this setup ? I have been trying to find out if anyone has made anything like this.. Many have been planning to do something like this but I cannot find any grow journals.

Any tips/help ? Should I use biosevia and/or biobizz fish-mix ? Am I missing something crucial ? Any help/thoughts are welcome. If you have tried this kinda setup let me know how it turned out and what kinda problems did you had ?

ps. sorry about my bad english.

Hmmm, I might venture that you may have micro nute problems. Si is something I might be a little concerned about (along with a cpl of others).
I never use B sugar or add any extra carbs other then brewing with molasses. The other thing is as a tea. Your solution would continue to "work" with the needed air bubbling till the carbs in the molasses were used up by the living bio's.....related to the method you choose.

You should note too, that Kelp does NOT increase or promote increased living bio's in your brewing tea's. In fact, adding kelp in any form, to the mix to be brewed. REDUCE'S the living bio's by as much as around 40%! Best to add Kelp extracts to the teas after their brewed for the highest living bio counts! Another problem I see is that most bio's need something to "perch" or better yet live ON! Root based bio's may survive. Maybe some that might be able to settle on bucket walls....The "filters" would most likely collect the those that could survive there. Interesting to maybe run a few and attempt to do it/dial it in if it works.

Can the idea you propose work? Maybe but, I think dialing it in would take a long time and a lot of patience. Concentrations and ratio's are going to be the biggest problem.
Doing it with a balanced and formulated organic packaged nutrient would be a better choice in the long run for me. I might experiment with 1 or 2 DWC pots and your idea along side the others, so I would have a finished product at every run till I perfected the idea!


Good luck and keep us informed!

Dr. Who said:

Hmmm, I might venture that you may have micro nute problems. Si is something I might be a little concerned about (along with a cpl of others).
I never use B sugar or add any extra carbs other then brewing with molasses. The other thing is as a tea. Your solution would continue to "work" with the needed air bubbling till the carbs in the molasses were used up by the living bio's.....related to the method you choose.

You should note too, that Kelp does NOT increase or promote increased living bio's in your brewing tea's. In fact, adding kelp in any form, to the mix to be brewed. REDUCE'S the living bio's by as much as around 40%! Best to add Kelp extracts to the teas after their brewed for the highest living bio counts! Another problem I see is that most bio's need something to "perch" or better yet live ON! Root based bio's may survive. Maybe some that might be able to settle on bucket walls....The "filters" would most likely collect the those that could survive there. Interesting to maybe run a few and attempt to do it/dial it in if it works.

Can the idea you propose work? Maybe but, I think dialing it in would take a long time and a lot of patience. Concentrations and ratio's are going to be the biggest problem.
Doing it with a balanced and formulated organic packaged nutrient would be a better choice in the long run for me. I might experiment with 1 or 2 DWC pots and your idea along side the others, so I would have a finished product at every run till I perfected the idea!


Good luck and keep us informed!

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Thank you for super fast reply..

May I ask, what is best way to increase living bios in my res?

Of course more sugars is added to keep bacteria alive. Can I use tea bags for sugars?

You were worried about micro nutes.. I was planning to use shilajit/leonardite/humate powder on my tea bag as fertilezer. Hope it is enough

I know ratios will be hard to find but Im sure it can be done..

1: Ah, what res? The one you propose or one you have now.....Anything "working" in a res is not the best idea. Adding sugars can start a fermentation. Again, not the best Idea. Of course the amount of sugars used directly relate to the risk factor. Molasses directly used in any hydro res is a bad idea!

2: See above

3: what you list is a source for Humic/Fulvic acids. NOT a viable source for micro nutes....I am going to guess you want to stay away from liquid additives? If not a problem - Earth Juice Microblast would be what your looking for.....If not, I would start by trying kelp meal in the mix....Even though it may reduce living bio counts - your still going to do ok for your intended purpose....OR adding a Kelp extract to the res as a whole (liquid again AND my choice - you would have to add periodically) would work also...

4: Yeeaahh, that's going to be a "fun" problem to overcome as far as over or under feeding and in each nutrient in balance with the others too.

Good luck

ledder said:

Hello everyone

Im interested of organic grow and to be more precise I wanna use compost tea as fertilizer. My plan is to set up bioponics dwc+drip system. Basically bio-buckets without waterfall and grow buckets, just using one res (dwc).


My plan is to use only compost tea as fertilizer. I was planning to use worm castings, bat guano, compost (horse and chicken manure based), egg shells, oatmeal etc. Compost tea bag will be "sitting" passively on the main res for weeks hopefully fertilizing my plants.. I know compost tea is normally used to gain beneficial bacteria and fungi to the soil, but why cannot it be used as fertilizer too ?

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I have zero experience doing this type of thing personally but all the people I know that try and mix hydroponics with live/solid organic nutrients run into issues with everything clogged and all sorts of other microbial issues, algae, and slime..
and to answer your question compost tea and nutrient teas are different, the simple answer to your question is that compost or worm casting on their own don't have enough macro or even micro value to fully sustain a grow.
but what you are making isn't a compost tea, that's a nutrient tea.
more specifically a nutrient tea with some castings in it.
not saying that's a bad thing at all, just different, and if you were seeking a AACT you'd want just the castings and molasses.
also egg shells aren't soluble in a tea either, if you want a good source of soluble calcium comfrey is AWESOME for that, but again, it will make things all funky in there...
but when it comes to hydroponics, I simply am not experienced enough in that aspect, I've been a soil guy for far too long, haven't done any hydro grows since the Clinton administration

greasemonkeymann said:

I have zero experience doing this type of thing personally but all the people I know that try and mix hydroponics with live/solid organic nutrients run into issues with everything clogged and all sorts of other microbial issues, algae, and slime..

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Do you happen to know is any of these try outs documented in any way ? I would like to read journals of these try outs. I would like know if these try outs were truly "bioponics" kinda solution or just hydroponics mixed with live/solid organic nutrients without good healthy biotope. I would so much like to know what kinda bio-filter did they use and what nutrients did they feed to the beneficial bacteria.

ledder said:

Do you happen to know is any of these try outs documented in any way ? I would like to read journals of these try outs. I would like know if these try outs were truly "bioponics" kinda solution or just hydroponics mixed with live/solid organic nutrients without good healthy biotope. I would so much like to know what kinda bio-filter did they use and what nutrients did they feed to the beneficial bacteria.

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nah man, I wish I did, but it was only from my hydro friends that wanted the best of both worlds, I wasn't there when they did it, just heard of the clusterfuck afterwards
just not sure of the advantage of it all though, you'll want the microbial life in your growing media to be there in order to get the bio-solids even bio-available, not to mention organic nutrients are almost always acidic in nature, so that will jack your ph.

Dr. Who said:

Another problem I see is that most bio's need something to "perch" or better yet live ON! Root based bio's may survive. Maybe some that might be able to settle on bucket walls....The "filters" would most likely collect the those that could survive there. Interesting to maybe run a few and attempt to do it/dial it in if it works.

Click to expand...

I can start the biotope with using this biobizz alg-a-mic. Water flow made by the water pump (+venturi) has to be directed from bottom to surface to gain maximum aeration. Water pump makes the water move circurlaly on the reservoir. Bio-filter will be placed right on the water flow route. Best place would (I assume) be where the water is most aerated. Idea is to make whole water pass through the bio-filter. Bio-filter full of lavarocks is perfect place for beneficial bacteria to grow. I might even put little tea bags full of carbs (sugar) inside the bio-filter (food for bacteria). I should run this set up for two weeks so the biotope can grow up. Foam should be good indicator of healthy bacteria. After this I was planning to start using compost tea bags. This bag containing all the stuff I mentioned earlier and it is mostly aimed for the "bennies" and for the mycorrhizal fungi. After this the "bioponics" is ready for cultivation.

Bio-filter located right on the path of the water flow will "swallow" all organic matter for bennies to break 'em down all the way down so the plant can use it as nutrient. Mycorrhizal fungi (planning to get it from oatmeal) will protects the roots of the plant and there should not be any root rot. Lavarocks releases small amounts of silicate to water and it prevents root rot too.

Now that water is being filtered/cleared from any unwanted biomass and the plant has win-win symbiosis with fungis is time to start figuring out how to feed the plant. Im pretty sure I can make nutrient tee bag with using egg shells (powdered), himalayan salt, fish emulsion/hydrolysate, rotten vegetables, grass clippings, rotten leafs, etc. Anyone tried anything like this ? And of course there is organic nutrients too, but I try to avoid premixed nutrients. If I place this little nutrient bag on the same water flow where my bio-filter is located.. Just next to it.. In theory this should "feed" the bio-filter which breaks them all down for the plant. Nutrients on the nutrients tee bag should be powder like substance. It breaks down faster. Smaller peaces the better.

I have heard that ppl have made this kinda systems and they have worked well, but I havent seen any journals nowhere.

greasemonkeymann said:

just not sure of the advantage of it all though, you'll want the microbial life in your growing media to be there in order to get the bio-solids even bio-available, not to mention organic nutrients are almost always acidic in nature, so that will jack your ph.

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The advantage is huge. Bennies act like water cleaner. They break down all the biomass in the reservoir, breaks down nutrients for the plant, gives protection for the roots (actually its the fungi that protects the roots) and it makes ph more stable.

I have heard the same about organic nutrients. I was planning not to use them. In bioponic system ph is not playing as big role as it is playing on normal hydroponics systems. Biotope keeps the ph fairly stable.

As I said.. Im planning to try this.. Nothing is confirmed yet.. But all tips/hints/critics/suggestions are welcome.

I have even heard that many growers who use this kinda method can go without changing the reservoir water. Some growers wont change the water even between crops. Well in theory, why should one change the purified water with healthy bacterias in it ? This is the main reason why Im trying this method. No more water changes all the time.. Lots of savings when no need to change the water and nutrients..

I honestly know nothing about organic hydro, but I've read that frass can be used somehow.

If you don't mind me asking, where have you been sourcing the info you've got up to now?
It seems an interesting idea and I'd like to learn more.

Keep us updated as to how you get on

I play with a liter per plant top dress style to get the goodness of tea into my soup. No problems the girls love it. You'll want a solid solution that is tried and proven when your ready for the next level my friend. I do a fungal tea btw.

DonBrennon said:

I honestly know nothing about organic hydro, but I've read that frass can be used somehow.

If you don't mind me asking, where have you been sourcing the info you've got up to now?
It seems an interesting idea and I'd like to learn more.

Keep us updated as to how you get on

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Thank for participating.. The main idea is from this thread:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=8182
This idea of mine is simplified version of this BigTokes idea. I wanna reduce the change of water leaks and I wanna make this as simple as possible.

I have been studying this matter on other forums (chili + cannabis) too but they are in my native language so no point of posting those links to here. But basically I have introduced the main theory (very little details) couple posts earlier.

Everything is almost set up already. I just have to do some other stuff first. I will post my findings and results to here when I get this up and running. Maybe on next week I will start testing this system.. and by testing I mean I will fill up the res and try to introduce the benies to it.

Lead botanist!

pinner420 said:

Lead botanist!

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Nice.. you even have your own workers to do your teas for you .

Post some pictures when you get set up...very interested to see what you come up with.

pinner420 said:

I do a fungal tea btw.

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Would you be kind and let us others know your recipe for gungal tea ?

Here ya go

ledder said:

The advantage is huge. Bennies act like water cleaner. They break down all the biomass in the reservoir, breaks down nutrients for the plant, gives protection for the roots (actually its the fungi that protects the roots) and it makes ph more stable.

I have heard the same about organic nutrients. I was planning not to use them. In bioponic system ph is not playing as big role as it is playing on normal hydroponics systems. Biotope keeps the ph fairly stable.

As I said.. Im planning to try this.. Nothing is confirmed yet.. But all tips/hints/critics/suggestions are welcome.

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I see what you are saying, not sure how much microbes will control ph though, it's normally the root exudates that do that, but in a hydroponic media I don't know how that works.
I'm not throwing shade on you man, just not sure if it'll work as well as a traditional humus based organic media, CEC, being aerobic, and having surface are in the media that can be exposed to the exudates and mychorrizae.
like I said, I DON'T know how it'd work.
give it a shot and lets see

I run ionic nutes and do the tea top dress 3 days before weekly solution change out. I only run it part time as for the reasons Greasemonkeyman eluded to.