Recycled Organic Living Soil (ROLS) and No Till Thread

Discussion in 'Organics' started by headtreep, Mar 21, 2013.

  1.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Hey guys I just happened to lose my list from the last time I remixed my soil! So I went off the top of my head! If you guys don't mind did I forget anything or mess up on the amounts! My soil is around 6 cu ft in a big tote! This list is how much total I put of each amendment in the 6 cu ft of soil! Plz keep in mind this isn't new soil I have reamended this soil about 3 times already (over the past few years) so this is more of a touch up if you guys know what I mean!
    Thanks for all your help u guys are the best!

    6 cu. Ft of soil!!!!!!

    1 bag .5 cu. ft. ewc.(homemade)
    1 bag .5 cu. ft. Compost(local)
    Small bag of extra rice hauls for extra aeration.

    Bio live 2c
    Neem meal. 2c
    Alfalfa meal. 3c
    Kelp meal. 4c
    Fish bone meal 3c
    Bone meal. 1c
    Blood meal 1c

    Crab shells 3c
    Oyster shells. 2C

    Gypsum 1c
    Azomite 1c
    Basalt 1c

    Gro Kashi 3c
    Incet frass. 2c

    I also have laying around dolomite lime, soft rock phosphate, and diatomaceous earth! I didn't add them this round but they have been added in the past I didn't see a need to keep adding them bc Im sure they are still in the soil bc things like dolomite take years to fully break down! Atleast that is what I was taught if I'm wrong anywhere throughout this please correct me ready to Learn more than I knew yesterday! Thanks everyone!!!!

    Edit; I've mixed these up and brewing a good compost tea to mix it down with and begin my 1-2 month cook! I've also threw in a few quarts of expanded em1 to boost the soil life will it cooks!
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
    DREGER likes this.
  2.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Heyyyyy my comment started page 420!!!!

    EVERYBODY BURN ONE!!!!!!!
     
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  3.  
    hillbill

    hillbill Well-Known Member

    I checked my watched threads and clicked on your post on page 420. Took it as a sign. Good morning Space Monkey f2!
     
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  4.  
    ShLUbY

    ShLUbY Well-Known Member

    mix seems very nitrogen and phos heavy and not really much in terms of potassium... greensand? langbeinite? either of these would be good additions to your mix and help you out in flower. you'll still get good flowers with this mix, but speaking from experience, a mix lacking in K lacks in potential yield. yeah theres K in kelp.... but it's 1% by weight... and 4 cups of kelp doesn't weigh very much compared to the weight of your other ingredients (great source of lots of micronutrients though!). next time, look at all your NPKs, and line them up in vertical columns on paper, and see if you are lacking or overdoing in one area. (if you expand the quote above, i have done this for you) and remember these things are not additive... they are % weight by volume.

    also, in acidic conditions (which is what you want)... dolomite can break down quite easily.... not over years unless it is really chunky, which most are quite micronized. I've experienced this myself many times. but you have dolo in the bagged soil (assuming 6cu.ft. of soil means something that came premixed already like promix, sunshine, or FFOF or something), and also OSF in the mix, so you'll be fine. no need to add dolo to this recipe.
     
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  5.  
    hillbill

    hillbill Well-Known Member

    I find wood ashes and charcoal bits from burned trees very nice if you have access. Kmag for a quick fix also and it has sulphur. Kelp in the mix has some and also has many micros and minerals. Molasses gets overlooked all the time for K.
     
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  6.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    OK thanks a ton I will order both lamgebanite and greensand both have been on my list for while just haven't ordered then! That also explains a lot bc I am having a k deficiency right now I thought the k was covered by the fish bone meal and the soft rock phosphate! U guess I was wrong bc this makes perfect scence now thank you a ton! One more question in my 6 cu ft of soil should I do one cup of each or 2!
     
  7.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    And yes I forgot to add tons of molasses does get added to my soil through teas! I usually do a tea at least once every two weeks and it always has a healthy supply of molasses in it!
     
  8.  
    ShLUbY

    ShLUbY Well-Known Member

    a good baseline is using a 1/2 cup per cubic foot of soil for each amendment, and then tweak there as you see fit after a couple grows.

    so your mix in particular, i would eliminate the bone meal and just use fishbone meal, the blood meal is really soluble and doesn't persist long in the soil, and the azomite is quite similar to basalt, but i prefer basalt because it's less powdered and more sand like (the brand i use is anyway). then run each of the others at 1/2c per cu.ft. (except the OSF id run at 1/4c since you are using bagged soil that likely contains dolo.) . You were smart and kinda went light on everything which is good since you have a few redundant inputs. just something to consider when you have to buy some replacements :) diversity is good though, and there is nothing wrong with that, just means you have to have more shit on hand lol.

    as for the minerals I suggested, you could do both, and run them each at 1/4 cup per cu. ft. but that means you have to buy two things instead of one, or you could just get the langbeinite OR the greensand and run it at 1/2 cup per cu.ft. for a baseline and tweak as necessary.

    I think if you add either of those two minerals, you will have a pretty complete soil and should have a run with no issues.
     
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  9.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Thanks a lot buddy you have been a ton of help! I will leave out the bone meal! And langebanite and greensand are now on the way! Thanks again!
     
  10.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    CM180417-191152001.jpg
    I dId what you said and your completely right! My npk values don't add up very evenly and it makes since why I'm seeing a slight k deficiency in one of my girls!!!
    Like I said greensand and langebanite are in the mail as we speak! And I will cut out bone meal! But to be honest I think my nitrogen looks a lilittle low as well do u agree or not? I was thinking maybe a a cup per my 6 cu ft of feather meal might help! But I don't wanna over do it! But like you said a very diverse soil life is my goal!!!
     
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  11.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Here's a better pic! CM180417-191802003.jpg
     
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  12.  
    ShLUbY

    ShLUbY Well-Known Member

    i have never, and i mean never, had an N def in my living soil, and I use basically the same components that you do, minus the bone meal, and blood meal. i run all components at 1/2c per cu.ft. (though i'm experimenting with a mix at 2/3 cup to see if i can push the mix harder). So i don't think you need the feather meal at all bud.
     
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  13.  
    Crab Pot

    Crab Pot Well-Known Member

    I agree with you and I would also leave out the blood and bone meal. There are much better options.

    @Greenthumbs256 when you look at one of the most popular notill recipes, Coots mix. It only has 1.5 cups per cu. ft. of nute amendments in it and you really wouldn’t want more than that from experience. I understand that a lot of growers do add more but it’s not ideal, cannabis really thrives in a lower NPK environment. I wouldn’t add more than 3/4 cup per cu. ft. nutes (your list has well over 3 cups/cu.ft) between cycles and often less, sometimes much less. One can always top dress later. I learned from experience that less is best, add too much and it can be difficult to get the soil back in balance. If it’s convenient, you may also want to consider a soil test. It may be worth it to you, getting the soil dialed in and it’s amazing, you’ll get top notch results, yield, quality and ease of grow.

    -Coots mix-
    Crab meal 1/2 cup per/cu.ft.
    Kelp meal 1/2 cup per/cu.ft.
    Neem Seed meal 1/2 cup/cu.ft.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
  14.  
    ShLUbY

    ShLUbY Well-Known Member

    respectfully, i have to disagree. i knew what my strains were capable of producing, and i found this mix to be lacking when i saw the results of several runs. by adding the fishbone meal and greensand i saw noticeable results immediately in yield weight with the same quality. coots mix lacks potassium IMO (some have pointed out that he uses the malted barley to make up for this, i did not use it), which i correlated with the lower yields than i was used to. never experienced nutrient burn or imbalances when adding these ingredients at these concentrations, and plants faded as normal (i even started topdressing at week 3 to carry them longer). I think anything above 4 cups is going to be too hot... and between 3 and 4 is pushing it. I'm testing a coots mix + biolive and greensand at 2/3 cup per cu.ft. right now. will definitely document the results in my grow thread. Personally, i think his mix is going to do fine as long as the blood meal doesn't delay flowering from having too much N. but if you look at the amount... its 1 cup in 6 cu.ft... hardly anything really. 2.5TBSP per cu.ft.
     
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  15.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Shluby is correct I'm using between 1-4 cups (depending what) total in 6 cu.ft. of soil! So I'm actually around 1 cup or less per cu. Ft.

    Edit and I do agree less is more and that's just what I've done! and honest mistake buddy, Im sorry I tried to be clear about the amounts were for 6 cu. ft. in my original post here! But thanks for the input!
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
    ShLUbY likes this.
  16.  
    ShLUbY

    ShLUbY Well-Known Member

    no man, you are definitely in the 3 cups per cu.ft. range, if not a little bit more when it comes to NPK ingredients. just with alfalfa, fishbone, crab meal, and bokashi, you are at 2 cups per cu.ft right there haha.

    and i wouldn't necessarily say im "correct" but I do believe that the coots mix is outdated. can you grow the dank with it? Yes. Can you get more out of your plants with a few modifications to the mix? Definitely.
     
  17.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Also what's your guys take on bio live! And I will put the blood and bone meal on the back shelf to collect some dust from now on lol! 1300260-DTE_Bio-Live_300x264.jpg
     
  18.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Well then would u suggest I cut back on some ingredients! I can also cut the mix I just made with an extra bag of compost and ewc!
     
  19.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    I guess where I'm going wrong; I'm looking at each ingredient as something different but in reality I should be adding some of the ingredient amounts as one? Is that what your saying?
     
  20.  
    Greenthumbs256

    Greenthumbs256 Well-Known Member

    Tell me this in my tote I mix around 6 cu ft. At a time! Should I be somewhere around 1c per cu ft total of certain groups of amendments together? Like alfalfa and kelp mixed would be 3 cups of each(for 6 cu ft) or would I add them all up together so it would only be on average 1 whole cup of each for my entire 6 cu ft tote
     

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