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Sous vide for decarboxylation?

Discussion in 'Cooking With Cannabis' started by Tyleb173rd, Apr 22, 2016.

  1.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    I read on high times that someone did this at 200 degrees for an hour and converts 86% of the THC and at 100 minutes for 100% decarboxylation. Has anyone tried this before?
     
  2.  
    HeatlessBBQ

    HeatlessBBQ Well-Known Member

  3.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    It works? Do tell.....
     
  4.  
    Dan Drews

    Dan Drews Well-Known Member

    There have been a lot of similar tests. I prefer NOT to fully decarb my weed before baking for the simple reason that, after decarb, I infuse it into butter for an additional 3 hours at approx 200 - 212 degrees, then bake into brownies for another 30 minutes at 350 degrees. IMHO, if you fully decarb in the oven BEFORE infusing in butter, then baking into brownies - you run the risk of breaking down THC and degrading your buzz from your edibles.

    If you're making tinctures and won't be reheating cannabis infused oil or butter, then shoot for 100% decarb. Otherwise, decarb by baking @ 240 for 30 - 35 minutes prior to infusing your oil or butter.
     
    ThaMagnificent and tidybowl like this.
  5.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    Have you used the sous vide method?
     
  6.  
    qwizoking

    qwizoking Well-Known Member

    what is that

    sorry im not like a chef or something


    i typically double boil extract and watch it decarb, then dissolve into melted coconut oil. quick and easy with the least degradation
     
  7.  
    GrowinDad

    GrowinDad Well-Known Member

    Souz Vide would be basically like a hot oil or water bath. It is cooking something in a sealed bag in its own juices in hot water...

    I don't see why it wouldn't work...
     
    qwizoking likes this.
  8.  
    qwizoking

    qwizoking Well-Known Member

    oh ok..




    well then the only issue i have is the numbers.
    you wont get 86% conversion...
    more like 70 at that temp.. and time frame is questionable as well

    but yea i dont see why it wouldnt work
     
  9.  
    Genki88

    Genki88 Active Member

    With the sous vide, can you decarb at a lower temp but longer time for a higher % conversion??
     
  10.  
    qwizoking

    qwizoking Well-Known Member

    thats what happens regardless of method.
    low and slow..just like bbq

    try 160-170
    give you 10-15% more than 210

    cant get a whole lot better
     
    Genki88 likes this.
  11.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    I can't have the smell in the house. We have young kids who have young friends. We can't have parents stopping by and smelling a decarboxylation going on.
     
  12.  
    qwizoking

    qwizoking Well-Known Member

    there are many many methods to decarb
    shit if its a big deal throw a few mason jars of bud (im still confused if we're talking bud or concentrate)
    in your trunk while its parked outside. its hot enough here to decarb fairly quickly. could definitely get to 110-120° in there

    or wait... leave some in the top of yor closet idk, it will decarb while sealed... in 3-4months lol
    shit you can even decarb how we do most sensitive compounds, (no heat) and very quick/efficient
    http://www.organic-chemistry.org/synthesis/C1H/decarboxylations.shtm


    or cook it at night idk... figure it out bro
     
    ROOSTERMAN likes this.
  13.  
    Dan Drews

    Dan Drews Well-Known Member

    Even if you choose NOT to decarb, which you know will result in a lower potency edible, I'm assuming you're still planning on making cannabutter or some type of oil infusion. Both are going to smell pretty potent for the 2 - 3 hours you'll need to devote to the process. Are you planning on doing this outside the home somewhere?

    Sounds to me like decarbing may be the lesser or your worries.
     
  14.  
    DemonTrich

    DemonTrich Well-Known Member

    To dispose of any and all myths, If you bake something in a 350 oven, the food your baking WILL NEVER GET TO 350*... EVER! Example, ever read a recipe, it states cook for 45 mins at 350* and an internal temp at 160* (food safe temp for most meats). I am.a certified chef, 2 yr degree, 10 yrs kitchen experience, fine dining, and running the pass. 10 yrs food safety certification as well from.serve safe.
     
  15.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    CIA Grad here. 2001.
     
    DemonTrich likes this.
  16.  
    DemonTrich

    DemonTrich Well-Known Member

    Your gonna make me.feel.old you damn younging.

    93 grad here
     
    Tyleb173rd likes this.
  17.  
    Tyleb173rd

    Tyleb173rd Well-Known Member

    I also went to MCCC prior to going there.
     
  18.  
    DemonTrich

    DemonTrich Well-Known Member

    Florida here
     
  19.  
    Fogdog

    Fogdog Well-Known Member

    I've used oven method for a few batches -- 2 hr @240F. I like the smell but wow, the whole house. Def not stealth. So, I gave sous vide decarboxylation a try based upon this article:

    http://marijuanagrowershq.com/decarboxylation-marijuana-alchemy/

    In the article linked above, 1 hr 40 minutes at about 200F (93 C)

    Sample 3 at 1 hour and 40 minutes was 100% decarboxylated. It appears this would to be a sufficient time and temperature to decarboxylate cannabis with the sous-vide method. Further experiments could reduce this time but batch size, density and starting THC level could also require adjustments. Unless you are going to have your batch lab tested I would not cut down the time or temperature

    Also checked kinetics of decarb:

    http://cannakb.com/assets/articles/Vaporizer and Other/Decarboxylation of D9thc kenetics and molecular modeling.pdf

    Figure 5 in the above link shows 1 hour at 95 C wouldn't be long enough. Plugging numbers into the rate equation confirms that 93 C for 2 hrs should be more than enough time to decarb my weed nearly 100%.

    So, that's what I've tried. (Spoiler alert) I get similar or better results using sous vide compared to oven decarb. Based upon my personal response to canna oil made from my home grown.

    Some notes on technique:
    • Material: small buds from trimming, 1 ounce, "Mastodon" from Oregon Green Seed. Pretty strong smoke, didn't submit for analysis
    • Pre-process: scissors to finely chop bud into rice grain-sized bits
    • Vacuum packed 1-ounce chopped bud in "boil in bag" with three butter knives for ballast.
    Vaccum sealer: https://www.sorbentsystems.com/sinbosealer.html
    • Brought large pot of water to near boil. Checked temperature and submerged bag when pot was "simmer temp", 205 F
    • Placed a Japanese "drop lid" to partially cover the surface of the hot water. If fully covered, the water temp would have climbed to nearly 212 and I wanted to keep temp to just below that. An Otoshi-Buta or drop lid can be purchased from Amazon among other places or in a good Asian market.
    • upload_2017-4-8_14-21-16.jpeg
    • Used a digital thermometer to track temperature. Maintained 203 F +/- 5 F
    • Total time of treatment: 2 hours
    Notes:
    • 3 butter knives aren't enough ballast. I had to add external weights and used the drop lid to help keep the package under water.
    • Air gained in the package during the treatment. The package was pretty much sucked tightly around the chopped weed but during time, a bubble grew, making it hard to keep the bag submerged.
    • The weed got a little damp. Water wasn't leaking through the heat seal. It's my guess that the bag transmits water vapor at near boiling temps. The weed wasn't wet, just a little more moist after processing.
    • No odor in the house. Weed smelled good but it did take on some of the tea-like smell that it has when baked in the oven.

    Making canna-oil:
    • 1 ounce weed to 1 pound coconut oil
    • Place weed, oil and water to cover into a pot that fits inside a cheap Presto deep fat fryer. Placed a lid on this pot
    • Add enough water to the deep fat fryer to float the small pot. Place a lid on the fat fryer.
    • Heat to 190 F, monitor temp closely at first and adjust as needed.
    • Stir occasionally
    • Once the contents of the inner pot reach 190 F, start timer. Cook for 2 hours. (190 F +/- 5 F for 2 hrs)
    • Pour contents into large French press (coffee french press) and push plunger to squeeze out solids.
    • Transfer solids from french press to a double sheet of cheese cloth. Squeeze remaining liquid from solid into main batch. Lick fingers.
    • Pour off water and oil into a 8x8x2 into glass baking dish. Put into fridge and allow to cool until oil is hard. Place in freezer for a short time if the cake isn't hard enough to lift cleanly off.
    • Once oil hardens, lift off from water, discard water.
    • Place square oil cake onto cutting board, cut into quarters, package and freeze until needed
    Making canna coins:
    • Melt 1/4 pound canna oil
    • Use silicone candy mold. Mine makes small round flat disks I call "coins".
    • 1 tsp per coin.
    • Once tray is full, place in freezer several hours until coins freeze solid and hard.
    • Pop out coins, place in baggy, put into freezer and enjoy with hot milk.

    Result/conclusion:

    When I compare oven decarbed canna oil vs the sous vide decarbed canna oil, I find the sous vide coins to be stronger in effect. For me, a lightweight for sure, one coin makes for a pleasant 6 hr buzz. Two coins get me baked. Sous vide coins more so than oven baked but the difference isn't huge.

    I'll post more when I learn more. One thing I'll do next time is place twice as much ballast in the bag before vac-sealing it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
    CaptainCAVEMAN and fearnoevil like this.
  20.  
    bmgnoot

    bmgnoot Well-Known Member

    best way to decarb is in the oven at 240º TRIPLE bagged in turkey bags...this helps reabsorb the terpenes that would otherwise be lost....very important for obvious reasons! you'll notice it doesnt smell much or at all while decarbing. tumble every 10 minutes for uhh ithnk 40 is the sweet spot? 30-60 minutes anyway..leave it sealed for a tleast 30 minutes while it cools down. this tip came from a buddy of mine who works* in the kitchen for a very large chain of dispensaries in the state. they drop a ton of money on research and top of the line blah blah big money blah blah.

    THIS COULD OF COURSE ALL BE RUBBISH ™©

    *co-manages
     
    ThaMagnificent, Fogdog and fearnoevil like this.

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