Vero 29 B or C?

KushyMcKush

KushyMcKush

Well-Known Member
Hey, Im looking to do a cheap build to add to my other led bars. I have an extra hlg-320-1400 and was thinking of runnimg either 3 of the vero 29 C (69v) or 4 of the B's (52v). The room is only 53" wide and I have bars of 4 cobs each on either side, so spread is not a major concern. Mainly just straight lumen output to fill this extra space. From a quick look at the data sheet it looks like Tge difference would be pretty negligable but I may be missing something.

Spreading these out and going between them.
IMG_1331.JPG
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
you want cheap, you want B's. Cs are a little better but maybe not worth the extra $10. luminus cxm22 run right with the Bs and are even cheaper
 
KushyMcKush

KushyMcKush

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
you want cheap, you want B's. Cs are a little better but maybe not worth the extra $10. luminus cxm22 run right with the Bs and are even cheaper
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Ive never really looked into luminous, Ill check them out. I was kind of leaning towards the B's. Would be less $$ in sinks. Do you carry vero? I didnt see them on your site.
Another question, is 1400ma going to be a good intensity? Thats going to be pretty intense on a 50v chip right?
 
Hybridway

Hybridway

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
75W aint all that.

now 1400 mA on a veroC is over 100W and then youre into active cooling
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Hey Cobby, I'm not very hip to all these voltages on the new cobs n stuff. If the C is over 100w @ 1400ma, does that mean it's running @ 50% it's total capacity?
I know, prob. a stupid question.
I want to build something but want to run 100w a cob & still be around 52% efficient.
The voltage talk just started this year & I'm a lil behind. Thnx!!
It was just drive currents last year w/ the Crees.
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
Hybridway said:
Hey Cobby, I'm not very hip to all these voltages on the new cobs n stuff. If the C is over 100w @ 1400ma, does that mean it's running @ 50% it's total capacity?
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its all relative. BC and D are all teh same package size, so even tho the C has more dies, the heat still has to go somewhere

citi 1825 gen6 is in that range. simulator says >160 lm/W for 3000k 80 at 100W
 
Hybridway

Hybridway

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
its all relative. BC and D are all teh same package size, so even tho the C has more dies, the heat still has to go somewhere

citi 1825 gen6 is in that range. simulator says >160 lm/W for 3000k 80 at 100W
Click to expand...
Wow! Thnx!
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
hybrid, remember that all cobs are made up of 3V dies in arrays

a citi 1212 has 12 strings of 12 dies in series each string of 12 dies is 36V. 12 strings them in parallel just reduces the current per string and thus current per die.

an 1818 has 18 strings of 18 and is thus ~52V (really closer to 50, as with all the extra dies, current per die is lower and the volltage is thus lower

a 3618 has 18 strings of 36 > 36 dies= ~100V

so like a cree has same die number for both 36 and 72V, theyre jsut wired differently

in the veros the C actually has more dies on a chip than a D
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
Hybridway said:
Wow! Thnx!
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i think for costs being equal (i.e efficiency relative to wattage) less dies on a given package sizeare the way to go

1818 have a lot more dies than a 1212, but for the price of 2 1818 you can get 3 1212 and you just increased your heat transfer surface by 50% (and got better coverafe
 
Hybridway

Hybridway

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
hybrid, remember that all cobs are made up of 3V dies in arrays

a citi 1212 has 12 strings of 12 dies in series each string of 12 dies is 36V. 12 strings them in parallel just reduces the current per string and thus current per die.

an 1818 has 18 strings of 18 and is thus ~52V (really closer to 50, as with all the extra dies, current per die is lower and the volltage is thus lower

a 3618 has 18 strings of 36 > 36 dies= ~100V

so like a cree has same die number for both 36 and 72V, theyre jsut wired differently

in the veros the C actually has more dies on a chip than a D
Click to expand...
Great explanation. Thank you! Starting to get it now. Lol! Better late then never.
If cost wasn't an issue, then the bigger chips would be the way to go right?
So, are any of these 200w Chips that can be ran @ 100?
 
P

Photon Flinger

Well-Known Member
If you really want some hyper efficient light, run the Cs at 20w each. ~240lm/w for 3000k.

Keeping things simple, Vero C is about 27.50 USD from FE, so you get 20 of them costing around $600 shipped. 400w of drivers for another $100-150, or go cheap but effective for $45. 1/8th aluminum sheet, 2' x1.5' about $15. Miscellaneous items add another $25 so for $685+ you can throw down more than enough light that will last for years if not the rest of your lifetime. It is cooled passively and you can easily swap in and out different colors witht he SE connectors.

And who is going to care about 400w? That is piddly for consumption.
 
Hybridway

Hybridway

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
Wondering where you saw 240lm/W @ 20W for Vero29 Gen7 C. Datasheet shows 185lm/W @ 57W, should be ~ 215-220lm/W at 20W, which is awesome though.

If you run a CXB3590 3500K DB at 10W you could get in the 245lm/W range (on paper)
Click to expand...
Do you know what a top-bin, 3500k 3590 is @ 100w? Thought it was 48%. Thnx!
 
P

Photon Flinger

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
Wondering where you saw 240lm/W @ 20W for Vero29 Gen7 C. Datasheet shows 185lm/W @ 57W, should be ~ 215-220lm/W at 20W, which is awesome though.

If you run a CXB3590 3500K DB at 10W you could get in the 245lm/W range (on paper)
Click to expand...
Vero 29 SE C 3000k 80 CRI , 300ma, 19.2w, 242lm/w with a case temp of 25 according to the product simulator. +/- 7% performance margin of error so it is somewhat of a wash. Still puts it in the 60-80% efficiency range which is the goal.

And yeah, it is pretty awesome. Using PWM dc to drive the cobs is even more awesome though.
 
Halfandhalf

Halfandhalf

Well-Known Member
KushyMcKush said:
Hey, Im looking to do a cheap build to add to my other led bars. I have an extra hlg-320-1400 and was thinking of runnimg either 3 of the vero 29 C (69v) or 4 of the B's (52v). The room is only 53" wide and I have bars of 4 cobs each on either side, so spread is not a major concern. Mainly just straight lumen output to fill this extra space. From a quick look at the data sheet it looks like Tge difference would be pretty negligable but I may be missing something.

Spreading these out and going between them.
Click to expand...
What heatsink is that Kushy? Are you using vero's on them?
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
Hybridway said:
Do you know what a top-bin, 3500k 3590 is @ 100w? Thought it was 48%. Thnx!
Click to expand...
id guess 42-45% at chip level with DB bins. really dependent on your cooling. PCT says 132 lumens/watt at 100W for DB @ 85C Tj > 40.7%

Photon Flinger said:
Vero 29 SE C 3000k 80 CRI , 300ma, 19.2w, 242lm/w with a case temp of 25 according to the product simulator.
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thats bogus. same simulator will give you over 300 lm/W at low currents. at 19.2W youre more in the 180-190 lm/W range with a vero C

real hard to get over 190 with any COB. veros are good chips but theyre not magical
 
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CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
Wondering where you saw 240lm/W @ 20W for Vero29 Gen7 C. Datasheet shows 185lm/W @ 57W, should be ~ 215-220lm/W at 20W, which is awesome though.

If you run a CXB3590 3500K DB at 10W you could get in the 245lm/W range (on paper)
Click to expand...
i just dont see that happening. 200 would be great, 210 would be outstanding
 
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