Fixing root rot: Hydroguard v Southern Ag Garden Friendly Fungicide

Discussion in 'Marijuana Plant Problems' started by Father Ramirez, Aug 28, 2017.

    Father Ramirez

    Father Ramirez Well-Known Member

    I am addressing root problems in my first ever hydro grow and seek counsel from those more experienced please.
    These two products are similarly priced, have the identical active ingredient, but at very different strengths according to their labels. So different that I question if one of them has their numbers mixed up.

    Hydroguard: bacillus amylolquefaciens 0.038%
    inert ingredients 99.962%
    Recommended usage: 2ml/gal

    Southern Ag: bacillus amylolquefaciens 98.85%
    inert ingredients 1.15%
    Recommended usage: 5ml/gal

    If Southern Ag's numbers are correct, it's roughly 50 times a better value than Hydroguard. And then the dosage sounds wrong!? Who has experience with either or both of these products, and what can you offer to clear this up? Thanks.

    GreenLogician Well-Known Member

    Yep there's a lot of discussion about this out there, but I haven't heard back about results.
    On the dosage though, maybe Hydroguard's recommended usage is configured for hydroponics reservoirs, while GF fungicide had other uses in mind?
    vostok likes this.

    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    I messaged the sales reps and they told me it's not to be used in dwc systems. I'd upload a picture but is not working. I spoke with a Florida sales rep
    vostok and GreenLogician like this.

    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    These are quotes from a booklet they sent me though.

    Drench application: Mix 0.5 to 4.5 pints of Double NickelTM LC per 100 gallons of water and apply as a drench or coarse spray to soil or other growing media in pots, ats, plugs, trays, or planting beds, for control or suppression of soilborne diseases of seedlings, cuttings, bedding plants, and transplants (including vegetables and other transplanted food crops). Make rst applica- tion at or immediately before seeding, sticking, germination, or transplanting. Repeat applications every 14-28 days as needed. Transplants can be treated immediately before transplanting into eld soils to protect against damping- off and other diseases that reduce plant establishment.

    Chemigation: Mix 0.5 to 4.5 pints of Double NickelTM LC per 100 gallons of water and apply via drip, handheld, or sprinkler irrigation systems. Refer to “Chemigation Instructions” for more details.

    As well though there Is a table to I can't upload listing diseases it fights and root rot is definitely on there.
    But then...

    General information:
    Apply this product only through drip (trickle) irrigation (including micro-irrigation through spaghetti tubes or individual tubes) or sprinkler irrigation (including impact or microsprinklers, microjet, overhead boom, water gun, solid set, lateral move, end tow, side-roll, center pivot, or hand move, including mist-type systems); or with hand-held calibrated irrigation equipment (such as a hand-held wand with injector). Do not apply this product through any other type of irrigation system.
    Crop injury or lack of effectiveness can result from non-uniform distribution of treated water.

    It can probably be used in soil and as a dollar spray. Maybe someone will come by who has Experiance. I'll test it since I already have it when I transplant my next batch of clones. Here's the soil and foliage application info. It says as well it can be used for dampening off. 13$ for 16oz is worth a few test.

    Foliar application: For control of diseases on foliage, owers, fruit, or other above- ground parts of plants: Mix Double NickelTM LC in water and apply as a spray at a rate of 0.5 to 6 quarts of Double NickelTM LC per acre in suf cient water to achieve thorough coverage of the crop canopy with minimal runoff. Begin applications at crop emergence, transplanting, or when conditions are conducive to development of dis- ease. Repeat application every 3 to 10 days, or as needed, for as long as conditions favor disease development. Lower rates (0.5 to 3 quarts per acre) may be applied under light disease pressure, to smaller (e.g. newly-emerged) plants, or when Double NickelTM LC is used in a tank mix with other fungicides whose labels allow such use. Under moderate to severe disease pressure, or when environmental conditions and plant stage are conducive to rapid disease development, use higher label rates (3-6 quarts/acre), apply more frequently (every 3-7 days), and mix or rotate Double Nick- elTM LC with other fungicides for improved performance.

    Soil application: For control of soilborne diseases infecting seeds, seedlings, roots, crown, stems, or other plant parts below ground or in contact with soil: Apply Double NickelTM LC at 0.5 to 4.5 pints per acre. Mix the required amount in suf cient water to apply by one of the following methods:
    • Soil drench applied to transplants in ats or pots in the greenhouse or nursery any time prior to transplanting (see additional drench instructions under “Nurseries, greenhouses, shade houses, and ornamental plants” below).
    • Soil drench at transplanting, using a “water wheel” injector, spray nozzles/hoses, or other method to drench each root ball and/or planting hole.

      Soil or seedline drench, or banded spray (in-furrow) at planting. See the section on “Banded (in-furrow) application” below for additional instructions.
      • Follow-up (post-planting) preventative applications can be made every 2-4 weeks by one or more of the following methods, if needed:
        • Drip (trickle) or any type of sprinkler irrigation, any time after planting or transplant-

        Spray directly on soil surface and/or lower plant parts. If targeting root dis-

        ease, follow immediately with suf cient overhead sprinkler irrigation to move Double

        NickelTM LC to the root zone.
        • Injection directly into the rooting zone using shanks or similar equipment.

        Lower rates (0.5 to 2 pints of Double NickelTM LC per acre) may be applied under light disease pressure, to smaller plants, or when Double NickelTM LC is used in a tank mix with other fungicides whose labels allow such use. Under moderate to severe disease pressure, or when environmental conditions and plant stage are conducive to rapid disease development, use higher label rates (2 - 4.5 pints per acre), apply more frequently (every 2 weeks), and mix or rotate Double NickelTM LC with other fungicides for improved performance.

    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    An amazon comment said yes mix a rate of 1:20 water then add that at 1 ml per gallon.
    Jypsy Dog likes this.

    rkymtnman Well-Known Member

    I've been using it in GH waterfarms for 2 grows now. works fine in dwc.

    @Jypsy Dog turned me on to it. i think he's using it in coco if i'm not mistaken and works fine for him too.

    i add about 2mL per waterfarm 2x a week if i remember
    Jypsy Dog likes this.

    GreenLogician Well-Known Member

    Speaking of Southern Ag, they also make some well priced Spinosad and Pyrethrum concentrates :)

    rkymtnman Well-Known Member

    i use their surfactant when i spray for noxious weeds in the yard. cheapest brand i've found by far.
    GreenLogician likes this.

    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    Go to Amazon Read The Comments and you will get several people using similar methods to use this sucessfully as a hydroguard alternative.

    rkymtnman Well-Known Member

    see post 6 in this thread.

    it's not an alternative, it's the same strain of good bacteria just way more concentrated
    Jypsy Dog

    Jypsy Dog Well-Known Member


    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    Didn't catch it for some reason. Most conversions were (1:20= 1ml per gallon solution or 20ml to 1 gallon = 2ml a gallon solution.)

    2.Cor4.16 Active Member

    Meaning if you mix 1 ml of to 20 ml water that can be used @ 1 ml per gallon so 1 ml of should cover 21 gallons of water.
    GreenLogician and Jypsy Dog like this.
    Stink Bug

    Stink Bug Well-Known Member

    No matter which one you use. After treating the current rot problem you may need to lower your res temps some to prevent reoccurrence.
    Roger A. Shrubber likes this.
    Jypsy Dog

    Jypsy Dog Well-Known Member

    My outdoor solutions go above 90. Never had a RR issue.
    rkymtnman likes this.

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    @Jypsy Dog

    Do you guys still run the souther ag?

    Stumbled on this thread looking for hydroguard substitues they have some on sale at the shop but still like 2 times more expensive and im pretty sure its on sale cause its getting old lol

    Also is the southern ag ok in rdwc?
    Im using RAW nutrients in one system.
    And full sythectic with bleach in another.

    so id like to find something thay helps keep stuff clean without running sterile
    Thanks sorry didnt wana make another thread on it

    GBAUTO Well-Known Member

    Should be fine. Looks like the only thing that should be done before use is to dilute 20:1 with water. I have a small bottle that I'll begin using in a few weeks when the Hydroguard runs out.
    Cold$moke likes this.

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    Yea the hydro store has jugs of it on sale but
    I think its because its past its date

    So i really didnt buy a whole gallon if its "dead" or will have a super short life shelf life

    Do you run organics with the hydroguard?

    GBAUTO Well-Known Member

    I don't-Flora trio. I think that Botanicare said that even a year past the date should be viable. Still makes more sense to use the Southern Ag.
    Cold$moke likes this.

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    Cool hopefully the others will chime in.

    Ill check the dates at the shop tomorrow.

    He said they would sell the gallon for 40$

    I might be able to talk him down some more

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