Jacks 321 issues

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MVincent420

Active Member
Hey there rollitup family!

I'm hoping to get some help. I just started running Jack's 321. Here's a little bit about my grow:

4x4 tent with a Blackdog Phytomax 2 800. Peak temperature inside the tent is 85°F (recommended by Blackdog). RH is right around 45%. I run DWC in single 5 gallon igloo coolers. Each cooler has two cylindrical airstones and visually, there are PLENTY of bubbles. The rez temp is right around 68-70°, but sometimes they rize closer to 73°. My PH is right around 5.8 and I will lower it again once it hits about 6.3. I started out measuring the nutrients for 3 gallons and everything was running smoothly. On Sunday, I did a rez change and measured it for 4 gallons and this is where my issues began. I started seeing drooping of the leaves and slight yellowing on the bottom. The roots have slowly started turning a little beige, but there is beautiful new white roots growing as well. I use hydroguard so I'm not sure what's causing the slow browning of the roots. My PPM is reading at 820, using tap water that measures a little high at 420. Over the last couple of days, I've noticed that the PH shoots from 5.8 to roughly 6.7 over a 24 hour period.

I've got two other plants in the same tent but using FloraNova and they are looking beautiful. These have maintained a PH of 5.8-6.

Any insight on what could be causing this issue is greatly appreciated!!20210812_203730.jpg20210812_203733.jpg20210812_203720.jpg20210812_203742.jpg
 
Failmore

Failmore

Well-Known Member
They look very dark but that may be the light. Got any natural light pics

Most people would say your tap is to heavy, may need to invest in a filter.
 
Rdubz

Rdubz

Well-Known Member
45% RH too low get it to upper 55-60% also can u tell me in EC what your tap is and also what’s in your Rez , there is always too much confusion with PPM there are different conversions, but from the sound of it 420 ppm if your using the x500 scale it’s very high I would invest in a RO filter .

Edit - for me it’s all about process of elimination if u can get closer to zero with your water when you start u can eliminate that as a problem
 
M

MVincent420

Active Member
Rdubz said:
45% RH too low get it to upper 55-60% also can u tell me in EC what your tap is and also what’s in your Rez , there is always too much confusion with PPM there are different conversions, but from the sound of it 420 ppm if your using the x500 scale it’s very high I would invest in a RO filter .

Edit - for me it’s all about process of elimination if u can get closer to zero with your water when you start u can eliminate that as a problem
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I don't have an EC meter, but my PPM meter is in fact the x500 scale. I agree that my tap is running a little high but why isn't it effecting the two plants running with FloraNova?? Those are looking beaitfiul; roots and all. I just completed a successful grow with the entire FloraNova series, but wanted a nutrient that was a little more simplistic and then I ran into this issue with Jack's 321
 
M

MVincent420

Active Member
Failmore said:
They look very dark but that may be the light. Got any natural light pics

Most people would say your tap is to heavy, may need to invest in a filter.
Click to expand...
The leaves are a rather deep green compared to the ones under the FloraNova line which are coming along quite nicely. This is my second grow in this tent with the same tap water and the only ones I'm having issues with are the two under Jack's with this current grow
 
Mikenike

Mikenike

Well-Known Member
If the issues started when you upped your nutes then I’d start by going back to measuring for 3 gallons again, maybe even slightly lower ppms than that. The clear tubing is also problematic, if you don’t have algae yet right now then you will get some eventually with light getting inside your buckets. This may also be of use for you.
692B61A4-4F19-42BC-9AE3-0A71CFAB352D.jpeg
 
M

MVincent420

Active Member
Mikenike said:
If the issues started when you upped your nutes then I’d start by going back to measuring for 3 gallons again, maybe even slightly lower ppms than that. The clear tubing is also problematic, if you don’t have algae yet right now then you will get some eventually with light getting inside your buckets. This may also be of use for you.
View attachment 4966955
Click to expand...
So I'm quite confident that I figured out the issue. As you can tell from the original pictures, I've done some modifications to the lids of the coolers, to better suit what I'm trying to achieve (individual scrogs that can be be removed from the tent during nutrient change). Well unbeknownst to me, but by removing the inner layer of the lid, it allowed enough light in to fuck up my roots. I was looking at them one day and just happened to lift the lid high enough to see algae and I knew what needed to be corrected. I have since put black tape over the lids to rectify the issue. One plant has already bounced back and I'm seeing slight improvement on the smaller one. I dont believe the tubing will cause an issue, as I've got two other one's going that are looking beautiful; roots and all but I covered those with black tape just to be sure.The chart that you provided is going to be a game changer for me, so thank you for that! And thank you for the input in general!
 
M

MVincent420

Active Member
lusidghost said:
That's a unique setup. I think you're overfeeding them. They are dark green and super bushy.
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Yeah, I'm a DIY'er lol basically what I wanted to achieve, were individual scrogs that could be removed without disrupting anything. Once I flip to flower and the stretching stops, I'll lower the top portion of it and it'll be adjustable.

The bushiness, is due to my aggressive topping. Height is an issue for me, so I like to keep them as short as possible. With that being said, I've NEVER been able to get rid of the dark green on any grow I've done, regardless of how much I feed them or how little for that matter and I can't figure out why.
 
MustGro

MustGro

Well-Known Member
Glad they’re doing better @MVincent420 . I‘m a FloraNova grower and I‘m wondering how you like the new label floranova? I ran one veg and a bit of flower on the new label and switched to the jack’s 321 line. I had a hard time getting my PPM’s up where they were with the old label. Always 250 - 300 ppm (.5 - .6ec) lower. I switched in my signature grow and it worked nice for a first run. I dropped my ph to low 5’s (thought iron def before I caught the chiller heat) and they drank twice the ppms they usually did in 24 hours and burnt their tips the next day. Sucked..
I called Jack’s up and they recommended a ph of 5.8 all the way through. They also said to run the recommended dose of their nutes. I was up as high as 970 ppm (1.95 EC) without any big issues at the peak in flower. I can’t get higher ppm than that at their recommended dose and the rep said they have 250 - 300 ppm in their feed charts for people with harder water, like you. You should be a little over their numbers with 420 source water If you’re running their recommended dose. I’m running under 400 ppm (.8ec) my last bit of veg here and they’re real healthy at that level. I’m gonna sneak it up a couple of hundred ppm’s up to week 5 and then slowly drop it on the way out. I doubt I’ll have to run more than 2/3rds of the recommended dose to keep my plants healthy. The Jack’s is good stuff, a bit of a tip burner, but real good. Economical too; I ran an 11 week flower for about $15 in nutes.
 
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M

MVincent420

Active Member
MustGro said:
Glad they’re doing better @MVincent420 . I‘m a FloraNova grower and I‘m wondering how you like the new label floranova? I ran one veg and a bit of flower on the new label and switched to the jack’s 321 line. I had a hard time getting my PPM’s up where they were with the old label. Always 250 - 300 ppm (.5 - .6ec) lower. I switched in my signature grow and it worked nice for a first run. I dropped my ph to low 5’s (thought iron def before I caught the chiller heat) and they drank twice the ppms they usually did in 24 hours and burnt their tips the next day. Sucked..
I called Jack’s up and they recommended a ph of 5.8 all the way through. They also said to run the recommended dose of their nutes. I was up as high as 970 ppm (1.95 EC) without any big issues at the peak in flower. I can’t get higher ppm than that at their recommended dose and the rep said they have 250 - 300 ppm in their feed charts for people with harder water, like you. You should be a little over their numbers with 420 source water If you’re running their recommended dose. I’m running under 400 ppm (.8ec) my last bit of veg here and they’re real healthy at that level. I’m gonna sneak it up a couple of hundred ppm’s up to week 5 and then slowly drop it on the way out. I doubt I’ll have to run more than 2/3rds of the recommended dose to keep my plants healthy. The Jack’s is good stuff, a bit of a tip burner, but real good. Economical too; I ran an 11 week flower for about $15 in nutes.
Click to expand...
So I finished my first grow (first one in almost a decade), using the entire floranova line. If I wouldn't have made newbie mistakes throughout veg and flower I would've made out with blackdogs average yield for this light, which is 2 lbs. So all in all, I was pleased with what I got out of it, but I also felt like I was just throwing money away, with how many additives they have. During this current grow, I decided to do a side by side with the floranova and jacks 321. I havent run into any issues with the nova group, but with that said, after the 2 under jacks have bounced back, there's not much of a difference regarding size. It's super simplistic and you can't beat the cost. I have a strong feeling, that when it's all said and done, I'll switch over. I havent had the best of luck with their customer service though. With my hours, email is the best means of communication and 4 of mine have went unanswered. But now that I've got things under control, I don't think I'll need to reach out to them
 
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