Super soil question

JBonez420

Well-Known Member
Hi all, first time really delving into organics, I`ve been researching and a lot of people have been using subcool`s super soil recipe. But buildasoil broke the ingredients down and ran down why some are not really needed. such as adding mycorrhiza to help the cooking process, adding it to only the 1/4 of the container, stuff like that.

So my first question would be would it help or be a waste to add some mycorrhiza during the cooking process or would it be a waste? Is Subs recipe a little outdated?
The second would be during the cooking process; I understand that you should have it in a bin with the lid on to contain the heat and the like, but does it need to be 100% air tight, or would you like a little air exchange?

Thank you all for your time! :weed:
 

green_machine_two9er

Well-Known Member
Lots of ways to make a good soil. Ss, revs or the “coots”. I prefer the coots mix. Easiest for long term use. Snd best bang for the buck compared to buying bagged soils as a base. Much cheaper to make your own “base”

cooking container should 100% not be air tight! You need exchange. Buy covering lightly is common to keep moistures high and get good mycelium flush.

Adding mycos during cook? That seems like a waste of time. But to each their own. Can’t hurt I’m sure.
 

JBonez420

Well-Known Member
Lots of ways to make a good soil. Ss, revs or the “coots”. I prefer the coots mix. Easiest for long term use. Snd best bang for the buck compared to buying bagged soils as a base. Much cheaper to make your own “base”

cooking container should 100% not be air tight! You need exchange. Buy covering lightly is common to keep moistures high and get good mycelium flush.

Adding mycos during cook? That seems like a waste of time. But to each their own. Can’t hurt I’m sure.
Bro ty for the quick reply with good info! Really want to be starting soon(at least the cook, lol) and don't feel like waiting around, you the man! Going to give Coots and Revs a quick go-over!!
 

ComfortCreator

Well-Known Member
Mycos are needed. If you use worm castings you get a lot there. It never hurts to add them.

The whole idea is the bacteria need to begin breaking down the amendments so they are readily available to the plants. The cooking process is to let the mycos and other bacteria work....so yes if you cook you are doing it with bacteria from whatever source. Mycos are cheap in powder form.

You need the air to exchange every once in a while, so whether it is sealed and you open it periodically, or you leave it slightly vented...both work.
 

JBonez420

Well-Known Member
Mycos are needed. If you use worm castings you get a lot there. It never hurts to add them.

The whole idea is the bacteria need to begin breaking down the amendments so they are readily available to the plants. The cooking process is to let the mycos and other bacteria work....so yes if you cook you are doing it with bacteria from whatever source. Mycos are cheap in powder form.

You need the air to exchange every once in a while, so whether it is sealed and you open it periodically, or you leave it slightly vented...both work.
Mycos are definitely needed even for the initial cook? Interesting, I've heard of people using arguments that yeah the beneficials are in the soil source you're using as well like you say for castings so there is no need to add them in the initial cook.
 

m4s73r

Well-Known Member
Mycos are definitely needed even for the initial cook? Interesting, I've heard of people using arguments that yeah the beneficials are in the soil source you're using as well like you say for castings so there is no need to add them in the initial cook.
Ive never bought mycos separately. Even when i mix up a fresh batch of soil. Besides, most promix, peat moss has Mycorrhizae already in it. If you really want to jump up the mycos in the soil, plant clover. get some roots in it. Clover can grow for the 30 days while you cook.
 

JBonez420

Well-Known Member
Ive never bought mycos separately. Even when i mix up a fresh batch of soil. Besides, most promix, peat moss has Mycorrhizae already in it. If you really want to jump up the mycos in the soil, plant clover. get some roots in it. Clover can grow for the 30 days while you cook.
Thank you for the info sir, usually I will buy promix hp but they were sold out this time so I had to go with Sunshine #4
 

Richard Drysift

Well-Known Member
Healthy compost like ewc usually contains a good amount of fungi but it never hurts to add granular. It’s not as critical to have added myco fungi in your soil as it is cooking as it is to have it in the root zone at transplant. I add granular mycorrhizae at each transplant but only then. Would not necessarily call it a waste to add myco to the soil before there are plants growing in it but it’s probably overkill.
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
Healthy compost like ewc usually contains a good amount of fungi but it never hurts to add granular. It’s not as critical to have added myco fungi in your soil as it is cooking as it is to have it in the root zone at transplant. I add granular mycorrhizae at each transplant but only then. Would not necessarily call it a waste to add myco to the soil before there are plants growing in it but it’s probably overkill.
I agree, definitely borderline waste, adding mycos to soil is purely gimmicky IMO. Unless the mycos is making direct contact with the roots then it will do nothing. The only exception to this would be if your soil has been alive and undisturbed for long enough for the mycorrhizae to have successfully colonized the soil with their own "web" so to speak. Eventually, you won't need mycos anymore, as you'll have loads of mycos webs in the soil.


Mycos in amendment mixes make a little more sense, as many of these bags recommend putting 1-2 tbsp of the mix into holes prior to transplanting. As a result, the mycos in these amendment mixes are actually viable, as the mycos in these blends come into direct contact with the roots.

Even so, the mycos in soil/blends won't be nearly as much as what you'd get from a dedicated bag of Mycorrhizae specifically. Unfortunately, adding mycos into these soils/mixes is purely a marketing scheme that prays on ignorance.

Mycos can be had for between $10-$20, and it lasts a long time. Having mycos is absolutely mandatory, especially if you're starting in a new soil that hasn't developed life yet.

Mycos acts like a bridge, or a mediator of sorts between the plant's roots and the various microbes in the soil. Without mycos, that "bridge" is missing, and it will take weeks, if not months, until this "bridge" develops naturally in the soil (depending on the quality and age of your soil).

Mycorrhizae, like most everything else in organics, becomes superfluous once the no-till soil web has lived long enough. Eventually, you won't need to use mycos on your roots because your soil web will already be filled with mycos ready and waiting to attach to the next set of roots.

Until our soil has been "alive" for 6+ months, we will certainly benefit from using mycos. In fact, until the soil has been alive for this long, using mycos on the roots is absolutely mandatory.

Roots don't just spread out in search of water, they also spread out in search of microbes to form a symbiotic relationship with. Depending on the soil quality, this could take days, weeks, or even months. Again, dependent on the soil quality and microbe population. By applying mycos directly to the roots, now the plant does not have to search for this symbiotic relationship, and can immediately focus its energy on more productive matters.
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
Hi all, first time really delving into organics, I`ve been researching and a lot of people have been using subcool`s super soil recipe. But buildasoil broke the ingredients down and ran down why some are not really needed. such as adding mycorrhiza to help the cooking process, adding it to only the 1/4 of the container, stuff like that.

So my first question would be would it help or be a waste to add some mycorrhiza during the cooking process or would it be a waste? Is Subs recipe a little outdated?
The second would be during the cooking process; I understand that you should have it in a bin with the lid on to contain the heat and the like, but does it need to be 100% air tight, or would you like a little air exchange?

Thank you all for your time! :weed:
Hey OP, answered the mycos question above for you. Unless the mycos makes direct contact with the roots, it won't really do shit for you.



As for the cooking process, retaining that heat isn't absolutely mandatory, it just helps things break down faster. That "heat" is the result of the composting process, the hotter it is, the more you have decomposing in the soil you're "cooking".

I stopped using the bin after my first two batches of super soil. You need to mix the soil daily, to provide sufficient oxygen to the soil. The problem with the bin, even if you leave the top off, the soil is still likely to go anaerobic on the bottom of the bin. You'll know if its gone anaerobic, it'll smell like shit.

You absolutely do not want the soil going anaerobic. Sure, its easy to fix the problem, but time consuming. You'll add an extra 2+ weeks to the cooking time, because now enough oxygen needs to be re-introduced until the anaerobic bacteria have died off. Secondly, you'll have lost tons of nitrogen, as those anaerobic assholes have converted your Nitrogen amendments in your soil into ammonium gas. As a result, the bulk of the N you put into the super soil is not in your super soil anymore, but is now long gone somewhere in the atmosphere.

I found it easiest to just dump all the shit on the ground and leave it cooking there. Soil never went anaerobic this way, and no more dumping and refilling trash cans every day. Only reason I covered it with a tarp was due to cats, otherwise I'd have just left it uncovered. Definitely don't put it in a bin. Extra work at best, and anaerobic conditions at worst.

Sub's supersoil is pretty similar to caring for a compost pile. You keep it moist, and you "turn" it at least once a day. Repeat until everything has broken down sufficiently. For sub's soil, this takes 30 days at a minimum, but much like dry aging a steak, 45-60 days will provide the best results.
 

JBonez420

Well-Known Member
Sir I cannot thank you enough for both of your detailed posts to help a noob out, this will make things go that much more smoothly for me in the long run!!!!!! :D Much respect love and happy growing to all thank you all!!
 
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