Will You Take The Vaccine?

Are you going to take the corona virus vaccine?

  • No.

  • Yes.


Results are only viewable after voting.

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
You seem to have all the answers. Just curious if the “red low vax states” are seeing any difference in numbers and deaths compared to “blue utopia” like California and New York?

Are there any numbers pointing to a second wave of deaths with the delta variant? As the virus mutates, does the fact it has become more contagious equate to it being more virulent?

this is the website I’ve used to see cases and deaths since last summer, and even though there seems to be an uptick in new cases, deaths are still extremely low. Mind you, per their numbers, covid killed just 2% of the 35 million + infected population in the US. (Although I would argue the actual infection rate has been much higher than reported numbers, since people without symptoms may not have been tested)


the way you come off is you are sort of wishing death upon people who think differently than you politically. Hopefully not though (not that politics are the end all to those vaccinated and those that are not)
Population trolling is bullshit.

How many people are in those two 'blue' states you listed vs those 'red'?

Republicans: Death Cult Trolls:
Screen Shot 2021-07-21 at 5.07.27 PM.png
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
You seem to have all the answers. Just curious if the “red low vax states” are seeing any difference in numbers and deaths compared to “blue utopia” like California and New York?

Are there any numbers pointing to a second wave of deaths with the delta variant? As the virus mutates, does the fact it has become more contagious equate to it being more virulent?

this is the website I’ve used to see cases and deaths since last summer, and even though there seems to be an uptick in new cases, deaths are still extremely low. Mind you, per their numbers, covid killed just 2% of the 35 million + infected population in the US. (Although I would argue the actual infection rate has been much higher than reported numbers, since people without symptoms may not have been tested)


the way you come off is you are sort of wishing death upon people who think differently than you politically. Hopefully not though (not that politics are the end all to those vaccinated and those that are not)
Deaths are low because the vast majority of the elderly are vaccinated and the hospitals are filling with younger people who have better prospects of survival.

I'm not wishing death on anybody, but those who refuse to get vaccinated are a menace to themselves and others. The bottom line is that no matter how red the state is or how stupid the governor, when the hospitals are full, everybody hits the panic button with masks and shutdowns. You seem ignorant of what is about to happen, but many republican politicians are seeing the writing on the wall and coming around, if only to escape blame. Foxnews seems to be undergoing a bit of a transformation on vaccinations too, the vaccinated preaching the antivaxxer message.

99% of the hospitalized are unvaccinated and a third of covid patients have long term issues or long covid syndrome, there are more consequences than death, you can be fucked for life. I might be nasty, but covid is worse.
 

nuskool89

Well-Known Member
Deaths are low because the vast majority of the elderly are vaccinated and the hospitals are filling with younger people who have better prospects of survival.

I'm not wishing death on anybody, but those who refuse to get vaccinated are a menace to themselves and others. The bottom line is that no matter how red the state is or how stupid the governor, when the hospitals are full, everybody hits the panic button with masks and shutdowns. You seem ignorant of what is about to happen, but many republican politicians are seeing the writing on the wall and coming around, if only to escape blame. Foxnews seems to be undergoing a bit of a transformation on vaccinations too, the vaccinated preaching the antivaxxer message.

99% of the hospitalized are unvaccinated and a third of covid patients have long term issues or long covid syndrome, there are more consequences than death, you can be fucked for life. I might be nasty, but covid is worse.

That was a very sensible response. Much appreciated

edit just got home from work: I disagree about being ignorant on the subject though* I think there will be a relative surge heading into fall, but the number of deaths will continue to fall as those infected and unvaccinated will be younger and younger. I asked if the Delta was more virulent because you may have seen data pointing to that (I have not)

There is misinformation floating around saying “Covid is much less deadly now, ” which is one end of the spectrum in conspiracy (I guess the far right end?) but I also cannot sign on to alarmism equating delta to “sudden death” for the unvaccinated, and the need of masking up/locking down to protect the entire population, if the chance of death to someone infected is the same as prior variants.
 
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printer

Well-Known Member
I disagree about being ignorant on the subject though*

I asked if the Delta was more virulent because you may have seen data pointing to that (I have not)

...if the chance of death to someone infected is the same as prior variants.
So wait, you are saying you are not ignorant of the subject and yet you do not know about the delta variant being three times as contagious as the alpha? Even with articles in the news daily? Government information, independent organizations?

The chances of death are the same. Just with three times more people getting infected there will be three times more deaths. The infections and deaths would be much more higher but half the population has taken themselves out of the hit list as they are vaccinated. And if you understand the concept of compound interest and how it makes you wealthy you should understand that the increase (and decrease) in percentage of infected people follows a compounded rate.

 

printer

Well-Known Member

View attachment 4948630
They said that the vaccine will not stop you from getting the virus. Just that your immune system will be able to fight it off without you needing to go to the hospital. Face it, the only way to protect the non-vaccinated is by everyone wearing masks social distancing, no schools, no football games, no political rallies...
 

printer

Well-Known Member
Cape Cod COVID-19 cluster grows to more than 130 infected, prompting renewed mitigation efforts

At the height of its tourist season in the summer months, Provincetown’s population swells from 3,000 year-round residents, to over 60,000 people, according to state data.

We have a lot of visitors in Town, and given the volume, it's inevitable that cases will continue to pop up over the summer," Morse said last week, after the first cases were reported.

Morse reported most individuals are experiencing "mild symptoms." According to medical experts, fully vaccinated individuals are far less likely to become severely ill, and hospitalized, if infected with COVID-19.

Nina Hargus, and her husband, Stan, of Sudbury, Massachusetts, were among the influx of tourists who enjoyed the busy Fourth of July weekend in Provincetown.

“It really felt like a pre-COVID Fourth of July in Provincetown,” Hargus said. “Restaurants and bars were packed. The streets were filled with pedestrians, we saw very few masks, and no social distancing.”

In light of the outbreak, officials in Provincetown have issued a new mask advisory, in which masks are now advised indoors where social distancing cannot be achieved. All unvaccinated individuals, including children under the age of 12, are required to wear masks both outdoors in crowded areas where social distancing cannot be achieved and in public indoor spaces.

Local officials are also now "strongly advising" venues with high density, where social distancing is not achievable, to enforce vaccine verification prior to admittance.
 

Dreaming1

Well-Known Member
I took it. Makes triangle hand sign, waits for new world order to start... Nothing yet. I'm still hopeful for super powers or anything really. OK has had to come up with novel ways to vaccinate the hesitant/stupid. Free meth or opiate dose with vaccine shot. We just mix up a cocktail. Some people are getting vaccinated 3-4 times in a day now.
 

printer

Well-Known Member
Massachusetts reports 716 new COVID-19 breakthrough cases in vaccinated individuals

Massachusetts public health officials reported 716 new COVID-19 breakthrough cases in fully vaccinated individuals in the past week, data from the Department of Public Health shows.

A breakthrough case is when an individual tests positive for COVID-19 after they've been fully vaccinated against the disease.

Numbers from the Massachusetts Department of Public Health show there have been 5,166 cases of COVID-19 in fully vaccinated individuals as of July 17, a significant increase from the 4,450 reported one week earlier.

As of Tuesday, the DPH reported 1,649 new positive COVID-19 cases between July 10 and July 16.

When analyzing the number of overall COVID-19 cases reported by the DPH between July 10 and July 16, the breakthrough cases account for 43.4 percent of all new COVID-19 cases.

Massachusetts doctors say the biggest cause is the arrival of the COVID-19 delta variant, which is twice as infectious than the original virus.

"We also know that people who have the Delta variant actually have 1,000 times the amount of virus in their nose, in their bodies," Dr. Katherine Gergen Barnett with Boston Medical Center said.

Officials in Provincetown have traced at least 132 COVID-19 cases from July 1 to July 16 back to the Cape Cod community, saying that a vast majority of them have been among vaccinated individuals.

Massachusetts hospitals have seen increasing hospitalizations over the past 10 days, but the 7-day average of hospitalizations is only up approximately 20 patients versus the low hit on July 9.

The town issued a public health advisory on Monday asks people to wear masks indoors, regardless of vaccination status and requiring some businesses to request proof of vaccination before allowing people to enter.
 

printer

Well-Known Member
Nearly all recent COVID hospitalizations at UMass Medical Center, other Massachusetts hospitals are unvaccinated, data shows
The coronavirus pandemic has for months been receding in Massachusetts, but people continue to be diagnosed and treated for COVID-19 in state hospitals, even after becoming fully vaccinated, according to data shared by several Massachusetts hospitals.

But the vast majority of new hospitalizations involving COVID-positive patients are among unvaccinated patients, according to the data.

Across all UMass Memorial Health hospitals, for example, roughly 3.2% of all patients hospitalized between March 1 and June 14 who were COVID-positive were diagnosed after becoming fully vaccinated, according to UMass data. And of those fully vaccinated patients, 1.4% were hospitalized specifically because, or with a primary diagnosis of, COVID-19, UMass officials said.

It’s not clear how sick these patients — those admitted with symptomatic COVID after becoming fully vaccinated — are, whether they require intensive care or intubation, only that their infections are exceedingly rare as Massachusetts tops more than 4 million fully vaccinated residents.

These cases of post-vaccine infections are so-called “breakthrough” cases. These cases are identified in people who test positive for COVID two or more weeks after their second dose of either the Moderna or the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, or two or more weeks after the one-dose Johnson & Johnson shot.

There have been more than 3,700 cases of breakthrough COVID-19 in Massachusetts, according to state data available as recently as June 12. But because the vaccines are extremely effective at preventing severe disease or hospitalization, fewer cases, or COVID-positive test results, are going to be reported, experts have said. It’s likely fully vaccinated people won’t have symptoms even if they do carry the virus, and research suggests that most breakthrough cases will be mild in nature.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention announced last month that it will no longer be monitoring all reported COVID-19 vaccine breakthrough infections, “only those among patients who are hospitalized or die.“

“The national surveillance system relies on passive and voluntary reporting, and data might not be complete or representative,” the CDC says. “Many persons with vaccine breakthrough infections, especially those who are asymptomatic or who experience mild illness, might not seek testing.”

MassLive reached out to hospitals across the state to get a sense of how common breakthrough cases and hospitalizations are. Some hospitals tracking them were willing to share their data when asked while others, like Baystate Health, cited Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, or HIPAA, concerns.

In the eastern part of the state, Tufts Medical Center reports only eight fully vaccinated hospital admissions involving patients who tested positive for COVID-19 to date. Their first fully vaccinated inpatient was admitted in April, according to Jeremy Lechan, a spokesperson for Tufts Medical Center.

And between April and June 15, the Boston hospital reported 109 COVID-positive admissions, according to Lechan.

So the fully vaccinated patients make up just 7% of patients hospitalized with a positive COVID test,” Lechan wrote in an email. “However, it is important to note that most of those 8 fully vaccinated patients were not admitted for COVID-19 — they were either asymptomatic for COVID, were admitted for other medical issues and just happened to test positive for COVID-19 while admitted and/or ended up with a false positive test.”

“So in reality, the number of fully vaccinated inpatients we have had who were admitted for an actual case of COVID-19 is much lower than 8,”
Lechan added.

Data from Massachusetts General Hospital, the state’s largest medical facility, and other Mass General Brigham hospitals were not immediately available.
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
Vaccine fears fuel exodus from Winkler area
Low German-speaking Mennonite families fleeing jobs, homes for Mexico, Central America nations

Prompted both by fears of safety of the vaccines and worries that governments will soon require them to show proof of vaccination to travel, more than 100 Low German-speaking Mennonites from southern Manitoba have left the country in the last three months, with more likely to follow, a Winkler immigration consultant said.

"In the last three months, people are scattering out of Manitoba," said Bolivian-born Mary Friesen, who has lived in Canada for 21 years. "They are trying to get out of Manitoba as fast as possible."

Friesen knows of 18 families, most with at least four children, who have moved to Mexico, Paraguay or Bolivia from Winkler or the nearby municipalities of Stanley and Rhineland.

Recent government campaigns encouraging people to get vaccinated against COVID-19 have prompted the exodus, says Friesen, with people leaving jobs and homes behind in order to cross the border before proof of vaccination becomes a requirement of travel.

"The reason to leave is they are afraid of the vaccine itself and they don’t want the vaccine," she says.

Conservative Low German-speaking people — known as Dietsche (pronounced Deet-sha) — make up as much as one-quarter of the estimated 25,000 people living in Winkler and the surrounding Stanley municipality, says a longtime community worker with that population.

"You can’t throw a stone without hitting someone with a connection to Mexico," said Tina Fehr Kehler, estimating 75 families move to the area annually. Kehler says this is not necessarily a homogenous group of Mennonites who all attend the same church, but a looser association of people who have roots in Latin America and often are dual citizens of Canada and countries such as Mexico, Paraguay, Bolivia or Belize.

Often characterized as transnational Mennonites, this is a population that already moves frequently between Canada and Latin American countries for economic or family reasons, but pandemic restrictions in Canada may have made life here untenable for some, said Ben Nobbs-Thiessen, chair of Mennonite Studies at the University of Winnipeg.

"We’ve all lived through a year of intense restrictions," he said, adding that public-health measures may be less in places like Mexico or Bolivia, where many Mennonites live in colonies away from the rest of the population. "The restrictions don’t mean the same thing in a colony in Bolivia."
In Manitoba, some Dietsche are identifiable by their appearance, with women generally wearing black kerchiefs, below-the-knee dark floral patterned dresses and socks with sandals. Men often wear Western style shirts, jeans and cowboy boots. Kehler said this group would minimize contact with the broader society, take direction from their church leaders and avoid higher education.

Kehler said people in this group also have a stoic perspective, resulting in less fear of becoming sick or even dying from COVID-19, if they accept the premise that it exists, said Kehler. "Suffering is part of life, that’s just accepted," she said.

Instead of viewing the vaccine as a life-saving public health measure, Friesen said many Dietsche see the government vaccination efforts as a means to control them. They have a complicated relationship with government that goes back decades, with the Dietsche willing to file income tax returns in order to collect child tax benefits and GST rebates but less willing to comply with other duties of citizenship, she said.

"They want some things from the government if it benefits them. When it comes to voting or vaccination or the things the government wants them to do, then it’s a no," said Friesen. The distrust of government among the Dietsche goes back at least a century, says Selkirk lawyer Blake Hamm, who assists them with legal issues around resettlement in Canada.

Many of their ancestors moved to southern Manitoba from Ukraine in large Mennonite migrations beginning in 1874. Nearly five decades later, after the federal government reneged on their promise to allow Mennonites to control their children’s education, thousands of Low German speaking Mennonites moved to Mexico or South America. The following generations kept up contacts across the borders and maintained their Canadian citizenship, giving them the freedom to move back to Canada over the last few decades, said Hamm.
https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/arts-and-life/life/faith/vaccine-fears-fuel-exodus-from-winkler-area-574868352.html

"There’s this relatively recent history of less than 100 years of people persecuted in Canada by different levels of government in Canada," says Hamm, referring to fines and confiscated farm equipment when Mennonites didn’t comply with the new education requirement.

Kehler suggested low vaccine uptake in this particular community is more of an issue of trust rather than language or science. Although suspicious of outsiders, she said most people in the Dietsche community own cellphones and share information through What’sApp, where they circulate videos perpetuating their biases.

"Right now there’s more fear about the vaccine (and) that it’s more dangerous than COVID-19," Kehler said of rumours circulating that vaccinated people will die in two or three years.

Didn’t a few run a drug smuggling ring from Mexico to here a few years back?
 

PJ Diaz

Well-Known Member
Across all UMass Memorial Health hospitals, for example, roughly 3.2% of all patients hospitalized between March 1 and June 14 who were COVID-positive were diagnosed after becoming fully vaccinated, according to UMass data.
Kinda weird timeline to use, since it's quite lopsided in terms of general covid rates and vaccination rates. March and April shouldn't even be considered, since few were even fully vaccinated during that time (only around 30% vaxxed on May 1st), but those months also had much higher covid rates than May and June. Based on that, the numbers seem skewed, and don't reflect any current reality.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member


I mean why would a hospital putting out some early numbers on June 22, 2021 be using numbers for the couple months prior that were the only ones that people were fully vaccinated?

Screen Shot 2021-07-22 at 6.31.17 AM.png
 

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
That was a very sensible response. Much appreciated

edit just got home from work: I disagree about being ignorant on the subject though* I think there will be a relative surge heading into fall, but the number of deaths will continue to fall as those infected and unvaccinated will be younger and younger. I asked if the Delta was more virulent because you may have seen data pointing to that (I have not)

There is misinformation floating around saying “Covid is much less deadly now, ” which is one end of the spectrum in conspiracy (I guess the far right end?) but I also cannot sign on to alarmism equating delta to “sudden death” for the unvaccinated, and the need of masking up/locking down to protect the entire population, if the chance of death to someone infected is the same as prior variants.
I still wear a mask (fully vaccinated) when in public even as far as when I pull up to the drive thru window. I do it incase the persons I’m in contact with are not vaccinated for what ever reason. There will come a point (I’m only so accommodating) where I will stop and at that point you had better have been intelligent enough to get the shot. It’s all on you at that point. If for some reason some are unable to tolerate the shot then they will, unfortunately, have to mask up to mitigate the chance they will get it. Times have changed in the world and are not getting better IMO, to the point I’ve stopped telling the kids to have kids, it’s not an easy decision anymore :(.
 

CunningCanuk

Well-Known Member
Yeah, let’s follow the British government. They’ve done such a stellar job with the pandemic so far.

Delta is coming for you Peej. It’s just a matter of time. Hopefully you’ll be one of the lucky ones.
 

printer

Well-Known Member
Nearly all recent COVID hospitalizations at UMass Medical Center, other Massachusetts hospitals are unvaccinated, data shows
The coronavirus pandemic has for months been receding in Massachusetts, but people continue to be diagnosed and treated for COVID-19 in state hospitals, even after becoming fully vaccinated, according to data shared by several Massachusetts hospitals.

But the vast majority of new hospitalizations involving COVID-positive patients are among unvaccinated patients, according to the data.

Across all UMass Memorial Health hospitals, for example, roughly 3.2% of all patients hospitalized between March 1 and June 14 who were COVID-positive were diagnosed after becoming fully vaccinated, according to UMass data. And of those fully vaccinated patients, 1.4% were hospitalized specifically because, or with a primary diagnosis of, COVID-19, UMass officials said.


It’s not clear how sick these patients — those admitted with symptomatic COVID after becoming fully vaccinated — are, whether they require intensive care or intubation, only that their infections are exceedingly rare as Massachusetts tops more than 4 million fully vaccinated residents.


These cases of post-vaccine infections are so-called “breakthrough” cases. These cases are identified in people who test positive for COVID two or more weeks after their second dose of either the Moderna or the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, or two or more weeks after the one-dose Johnson & Johnson shot.


There have been more than 3,700 cases of breakthrough COVID-19 in Massachusetts, according to state data available as recently as June 12. But because the vaccines are extremely effective at preventing severe disease or hospitalization, fewer cases, or COVID-positive test results, are going to be reported, experts have said. It’s likely fully vaccinated people won’t have symptoms even if they do carry the virus, and research suggests that most breakthrough cases will be mild in nature.


The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention announced last month that it will no longer be monitoring all reported COVID-19 vaccine breakthrough infections, “only those among patients who are hospitalized or die.“


“The national surveillance system relies on passive and voluntary reporting, and data might not be complete or representative,” the CDC says. “Many persons with vaccine breakthrough infections, especially those who are asymptomatic or who experience mild illness, might not seek testing.”


MassLive reached out to hospitals across the state to get a sense of how common breakthrough cases and hospitalizations are. Some hospitals tracking them were willing to share their data when asked while others, like Baystate Health, cited Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, or HIPAA, concerns.


In the eastern part of the state, Tufts Medical Center reports only eight fully vaccinated hospital admissions involving patients who tested positive for COVID-19 to date. Their first fully vaccinated inpatient was admitted in April, according to Jeremy Lechan, a spokesperson for Tufts Medical Center.


And between April and June 15, the Boston hospital reported 109 COVID-positive admissions, according to Lechan.


“So the fully vaccinated patients make up just 7% of patients hospitalized with a positive COVID test,” Lechan wrote in an email. “However, it is important to note that most of those 8 fully vaccinated patients were not admitted for COVID-19 — they were either asymptomatic for COVID, were admitted for other medical issues and just happened to test positive for COVID-19 while admitted and/or ended up with a false positive test.”


“So in reality, the number of fully vaccinated inpatients we have had who were admitted for an actual case of COVID-19 is much lower than 8,” Lechan added.


Data from Massachusetts General Hospital, the state’s largest medical facility, and other Mass General Brigham hospitals were not immediately available.


Kinda weird timeline to use, since it's quite lopsided in terms of general covid rates and vaccination rates. March and April shouldn't even be considered, since few were even fully vaccinated during that time (only around 30% vaxxed on May 1st), but those months also had much higher covid rates than May and June. Based on that, the numbers seem skewed, and don't reflect any current reality.
I would have written the article a little different. But that still does not change reality.
 

nuskool89

Well-Known Member
So wait, you are saying you are not ignorant of the subject and yet you do not know about the delta variant being three times as contagious as the alpha? Even with articles in the news daily? Government information, independent organizations?

The chances of death are the same. Just with three times more people getting infected there will be three times more deaths. The infections and deaths would be much more higher but half the population has taken themselves out of the hit list as they are vaccinated. And if you understand the concept of compound interest and how it makes you wealthy you should understand that the increase (and decrease) in percentage of infected people follows a compounded rate.

The fact it’s more contagious has nothing to do with how virulent it is. You’re so caught up in being right you’re missing the point. If the majority of the population above 45 is vaccinated, even if people are getting infected it doesn’t translate to more deaths. You can’t fake the reality that the younger you are the less serious covid is. It’s staggering how few people have passed away who are under 45. When you get down to 25 and below it’s an even lower death rate.

Think of how many people were exposed last year prior to vaccines. In the first few waves where the most at risk people passed away quickly in many populations across the world, what was the chance of death? At its peak moving through the world population pre vaccine what was the percentage of those infected that passed away? What percentage had to be hospitalized? Remove emotion for a minute and think of the bigger picture.

Is it safe to say the number of people who caught covid is much higher than those that tested positive for covid? There may be deaths not counted as well, but it’s less likely deaths were underreported (unless you’re China) as Irregular patterns would emerge in countries (like China) but the average is 2% or less so far, and trending downward drastically. Not 2% of the population, 2% of those infected.

So now there is Delta, a strain more contagious, but who is being infected at this point matters a lot. If it’s not any more virulent, it means there will be fewer and fewer cases that require hospitalization, and even less deaths. It’s something to be hopeful and positive about not doom and gloom apocalyptic. The world is getting better everyday
 
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