Alabama Governor wants to save money by giving driving exams in english only.

Translation is cheap these days....I know because that used to be my gig. As a translator you get paid between 6 and 15 cents per word depending on the language combination. A customer would pay maybe 30 cents a word for the finished product, so the one-time cost of having the translations is a drop n the ocean as far as state budgets are concerned. I would imagine that the money saved from less accidents would more than cover those costs. This isn't about saving money....it's about scoring cheap political points off people's xenophobia and bigotry.

abe23 said:

. This isn't about saving money....it's about scoring cheap political points off people's xenophobia and bigotry.

Click to expand...

Bingo, give the man a cigar......seems to be the GOP playbook and mentality go as far to the right as possible, trying to capitalize from the Tea Party "movement", I hope they understand that moderates see this shit and shake their heads and vote the other way. Good job pushing more of us moderates out of the GOP, before long the GOP will ONLY consist of white men from the South and teabaggers, oh wait they're almost there already.

ink the world said:

All immigrants arent here illegally. LOL its Alabama, why is anyone surprised? This has nothing to do with $ it has to do w/ racism. Period.

Click to expand...

"Alabama, why is anyone surprised?" oh because a bunch of white people live there it's ok to group everyone together...talk about racism! English is not a race nor is it tied to any race as someone previously pointed out there are more Chinese people who speak English than people in this country. I think your being difficult just to be difficult OR you're just dense. as far as I'm concerned people who enter ones land and refuse to assimilate are called invaders.

Stereotypes ≠ Racism

Besides, I'm pretty sure there are plenty of black folks in alabama. This isn't necessarily about racism....but it is about xenophobia.

Wow, Im gonna try to lay off the sarcasm here. Second time its been taken the wrong way....Sorry for the confusion I guess.

It seems pretty obvious that this is another step in the right direction. Make this country as inhospitable to illegal aliens as possible. SO THEY WILL LEAVE ON THEIR OWN. What is a common trait among illegal aliens that is NOT necessarily a common trait among legal immigrants and citizens? That's right, they don't know the language, so it is a no-brainer that this is aimed squarely at illegals.

I also think a lot of you supposedly educated people need to pick up a freakin' dictionary as you seem to take pride in how many times you can incorrectly use the term racism when you clearly mean prejudice.

It is not racism to expect a person to learn the states common language. It is racism when a person insists States majority should not expect them to learn the common language. Racism works both ways. Even all McDonald's located in America should be allowed to demand all employees to be able to read and write in the language common to the stores location. If the store is located in China town then they should be able to expect employees to speak, read and write in Chinese, however at the same time the State should be able to use only the language common to the majority of the State IE typically English. That is not racism, that is common sense. If California's majority speaks and writes only in Spanish then to expect them to learn English so as to adjust to the minority just because it is America is racism. America is a nation of all races. If the government insists all government documents be only printed in English then the American government should be required to furnish free translators or free bilingual assistance. The same should hold for state government. Government and private enterprise should not be bound by the same rules. As an example I should not be able to refuse to rent to a non English speaking person, but I also should not be required to pay to provide a translator or bilingual assistant to people wishing to rent an apartment. That is their responsibility. Equal rights does not eliminate the requirements for individual equal responsibilities.

sometimes i just get sick of it all

i'm white, 3rd generation american, all 8 of my great grandparents came between '10-'14, they came and learned americana, and where PROUD!

and i am still proud of my eastern and central european heritage, but, i am an american and of that i am damn proud
the thing is families have been doing it that way for awhile, and recently it's turned into a big joke, come to america, hustle the system, and live like a fuckin animal-
who are these heathens, who does this? not my family, or my neighbors families, or most people i even know families
let these people do it the old fashioned way so they can have pride in being an american, it won't be easy but damn worth it
and i think it would make me proud to, someone wanting to be american so bad they came here and did it the hard way-the right way, the way MY family did it, that would make us brothers!

Huh....?

I'm sure if our immigration laws were the same as in '10-'14, we wouldn't really have an illegal immigrant problem. Just saying...

You're grandparents probably would never have gotten get a green card under the current system, so you're point is moot. Green cards, as well as visas for skilled workers are given out by lottery based on ridiculously low quotas. Why do you think business need to hire illegals immigrants in certain parts of the country?

elaborate on that abe

what were our laws then that ensured so many became citizens, i don't get it it worked great then what changed
maybe if we didn't spend so much money taking care of non tax payers (in all it's forms) we could process the forms a little faster?
one thing i notice is we don't have a computer that says press 2 for polish, and there aren't scores of Australian gang bangers hanging around and this is going to sound racist but live in mexico like a dog- it's tough, live in america -it's easy but still live like a dog?WTF

The law was that if you come to ellis island and you aren't chinese....come on in. And don't fool yourself....your grandparents got hated on by people who thought they were no good, catholic (?), potato-eating eastern europeans who didn't belong in god's greatest land.

And the stereotypes about irish, italians, jews, eastern europeans etc all being degenerate drunken criminals and gamblers from the beginning of the century are alarmingly similar to the generalizations you just made about hispanic people...just saying.

But that's not even the point. Our economy needs the labor. If we had a guest-worker program and a path towards citizenship for the people who are already here, we might be able to address both the problem of border security and the structural problem in our labor market that makes us dependent on migrant labor to pick fruit and slaughter cows....well, georgie boy bush tried that. And guess who was against it...? "No Amnesty!!!" Remember that?

And now you have this clown duncan hunter who thinks that children born in the US to undocumented immigrants should have their citizenship taken away and be deported with their parents. Remember that the 14th amendement states that anyone born on US soil is a citizen. Can you honestly say that this isn't about hatred, xenophobia and bigotry, rather than the law when these people obviously don't give a shit about the bill of rights?

abe23 said:

The law was that if you come to ellis island and you aren't chinese....come on in. And don't fool yourself....your grandparents got hated on by people who thought they were no good, catholic (?), potato-eating eastern europeans who didn't belong in god's greatest land.

And the stereotypes about irish, italians, jews, eastern europeans etc all being degenerate drunken criminals and gamblers from the beginning of the century are alarmingly similar to the generalizations you just made about hispanic people...just saying.

But that's not even the point. Our economy needs the labor. If we had a guest-worker program and a path towards citizenship for the people who are already here, we might be able to address both the problem of border security and the structural problem in our labor market that makes us dependent on migrant labor to pick fruit and slaughter cows....well, georgie boy bush tried that. And guess who was against it...? "No Amnesty!!!" Remember that?

And now you have this clown duncan hunter who thinks that children born in the US to undocumented immigrants should have their citizenship taken away and be deported with their parents. Remember that the 14th amendement states that anyone born on US soil is a citizen. Can you honestly say that this isn't about hatred, xenophobia and bigotry, rather than the law when these people obviously don't give a shit about the bill of rights?

Click to expand...

We closed our borders to the tired, the lonely, the straving mssses years ago. We are a broke nation with huge trillon dollar debts. We are not the savers eof the world and just as we shp ould be spending monet we don't have so that Afghani females can have an education and show their faces in public we should also not be saving the poor mexicans. If the mexicans want US rights let them do as others are doing, come here legally and apply for US citizenships. If they choose to come here to work illegally then we owe them no rights as they are here illegally. Morals, ethics and rights are not the same. The fact that we might morally be respnsible to the needy doesn't mean we legally we them the rights guarnteed to US citizens. We as a nation or as people can no longer afford the 14th amendment. It should be repealed. If you want to be resonsible gor the poor and needy there are relief agencies you can support. All US citizens should not have to support all of the world who wants a better life at our expense just because some bleeding hearts years ago wrote the 14 amendment. We were a different nation then. We should not have to keep and antiquated badly formed law wriitten over 100 years ago, and almost 100 years after are country earned its independence. If you actually study the reason and intent behind the law it was mainly maent to establish you was qualified to serve as a member of congress and president. It is quite obvious at that time it would never be construed as it is now construed. We need some independence of some of the stupid amendments and laws from the past. They were not written in gold and they can and should be changed. People who are convicted of a felony for growing pot lose for life all rights to welfare, food stamps, section 8 housing, voting and gun rights and your worried abiut the rights of illegal immigrants and their children born here to illegal immigrants. That is sad. So in some peoples opinions it is just fine for a pregneant mexican to crawl under or over a border fense to give birth in the us so her child vcan be a US citizen and therefore sposnsor her anfd the fater so they all can stay in America. Plus the child is entitled to welfare and food stamps until 18 years old, so her parents do not even have to work and can not be deported unless they commit a crime as they must stay with their underage child. I really doubt that was the intent behind the 14 th amendment. The insane 14 th amendment was Passed by Congress June 13, 1866. Ratified July 9, 1868.

Wow.....you really don't like mexicans, huh? Does the fact they are mexican automatically make them illegal? Or do you also dislike legal mexicans immigrants? Around here all some of the 'illegals' are from central america and the caribbean, but there are tons from ireland, poland and russia as well. There's also lots of eurotrash people who outstay their visas and become de facto illegals...

By the way, immigration, be it legal or otherwise actually helps our economy. The act of leaving your home country to seek out better opportunities selects for the most motivated and determined people and they are much likely to be a plus for our economy than a drain. There's been a lot of research about this.

I have no problems with leagal immigrants of any nationality. I have no problems with Mexican Americans with US citizen ship. My oldest childs husband parents obtained US citizen ship in 1968 fter teaching in American colleges for 4 years. My son inlaw was born in the US. I just am not inclined to pay taxes to support illegal immigarnts or their children on US soil. I have no problem if they choose to live off their own earnings made om US soil as long as they realise they do not deserve the same rights or privedges of legal citizens. I think the amendment when just being born in the US entitles you to be a US citizen should have been deleted years ago. Any child that is born in the US to illegal immigrants should have the same status as the parents. If amn illegalmmigrant can find employment and support them selves and pay taxes to include a tx for the education of their children when enrooled in cs school that they are welcome as long as they continually work towrads obtaining US citizen ship. Otherwise they and their children should be deported regradless of where the children were c born. If the children are born to parents with another countries citizenship then the children should have the same citix zenship as the parents. If a parent obtains US citizenship and the child was born in the US then the child citizen ship by application can be a US citizen like its parent. Few americans lose a job to illegal immigrants. Should illegal immigrants have unemployment, welfare and food stamp rights in the US. No. Even working in the US and paying taxes should not qualify them for everything granted to US citizens. If you personally want that responsibity go for it. How many illegal immigrany ts are fighting beside US soldiers in Iraq or Afghanistan or serving in the military even in a non combat zone.

And a lot of that research has turned out to be bunk social science based merely upon skewed statistics not hard copy recorded data or records. It is sorta like lining up 1000 married couples side by side and then asking them each have you ever had sex wo ith someone other than your spouse since marriage. Oh yeah, I would belive those statistical reports. NOT!

Wow, hard to respond to that....

First off. It isn't bullshit. Immigration helps us and even illegal immigration is a mixed bag. One of the things that's made america great is that we attract the best and the brightest from all over the world. It's just that now we don't let them in anymore.

My view on immigration is that yes we do need to be tougher about enforcing federal immigration laws, but we also have to let in more skilled legal people and not give out visas by lottery and quotas. There also needs to be some sort of guest worker system as well depending on how many jobs are needed and where because our own population is getting less and less mobile. Then you need to deal with the 13 million people that are already here. Many of them you have to send back, but some should be allowed to stay if they pay fines and back taxes and apply for legal status.

we paid for the land, we make the rules. white english speaking men founded this country and fought AGAINST the spanish. it irks me to see spanish at all on just about everything i read. just as much it would irk me to have to see german, russian, or japanese on anything i see. LEARN THE LANGUAGE AND COME TO THIS COUNTRY THE LEGAL WAY. why is this so hard? twelve million illegals working, not paying taxes, but still using our roads, fire/police depts. then they have kids that they dont teach english cause they themselves dont speak it then when they get to school they have to have special classes, special teachers, the list goes on.
but to sum things up...this is AMERICA we speak ENGLISH we are culturally diverse yes, but it was the white mans ideals that brought this country to fruition. and im appalled that if a white man speaks on his heritage hes flamed as a racist or if there was a NAAWP people would go ape shit. yea i might sound racist, but im tired of this nation catering to people that could give a shit about what happens. we got hand outs and thats all they want.

abe23 said:

Wow, hard to respond to that....

First off. It isn't bullshit. Immigration helps us and even illegal immigration is a mixed bag. One of the things that's made America great is that we attract the best and the brightest from all over the world. It's just that now we don't let them in anymore.

My view on immigration is that yes we do need to be tougher about enforcing federal immigration laws, but we also have to let in more skilled legal people and not give out visas by lottery and quotas. There also needs to be some sort of guest worker system as well depending on how many jobs are needed and where because our own population is getting less and less mobile. Then you need to deal with the 13 million people that are already here. Many of them you have to send back, but some should be allowed to stay if they pay fines and back taxes and apply for legal status.

Click to expand...

Bullshit is indeed bullshit. Actually we need not let in anyone if they do not apply legally and we do not have a shortage in their fields of skill or expertise. We have more than enough well educated and trained individuals that are legally American citizens, so even the skilled are really not needed. Well maybe if we can ship the immigrants country a dozen lawyers or politicians for each legal immigrant we accept. If the illegal immigrants have not already applied to become citizens they can pack and leave now why wait any longer for them to do more than just look out for themselves. They have had more than enough time to conform. They can simply pack up their illiterate children and leave without ever causing us great harm. Especially if congress would actually do something for us for a change instead of just looking out for themselves and the special interest groups. Illegal immigrants are really just not needed. If prices of American grown vegetables and fruit go up, so be it. Congress should just tax the the countries supplying us with cheaper vegetables and fruit to balance the costs. Heaven forbid we should have to return to eating canned and frozen vegetables and fruit when they are out of season. How traumatic, could we live through having to make such sacrifices. If you can't I suggest you leave with the illegal immigrants instead of insisting we go down the drain to improve their standards of living.

So when people do research about the economic impact of immigration on the US economy it's bullshit, but if you say so it's true....? You must be really smart. This is obviously not about a pro vs con of immigration to you; you just don't like foreigners and your silly little, xenophobic tirade is a pretty good indication of that. You're just today's version of the of the same ignorant assholes who complained about dirty immigrants from germany, ireland, eastern europe etc 100 years ago.

You also want to strip people of their citizenship because.... actually, I'm not sure, why....because their parents are mexican, is that it?

Nice thread. I believe that anyone should be allowed to come to our country anytime they please and stay for as long as they like and take any job that they are capable of performing. Of course, this is assuming that they are able to support themselves, live within the laws of our society, and have no serious violent criminal history from their homeland. HOWEVER, I believe it is common decency to learn the language of the land you now choose to call home. I have lived overseas a few times, and I have traveled to many places where English was not spoken. Not once during my journeys have I ever expected the inhabitants of these lands to completely change their culture or government operations just because I had not spent the time to learn their language.

Choosing to move to a new country is a huge decision in an individual's life. A watershed even. You leave behind friends and family or maybe an old dog. But when you reach your new country, you have the opportunity to have those things all over again. Only this time you get to experience them in a new place with new people. Don't you think that you would want to be able to speak and read the native language? Wouldn't that make your experience and life a lot more enjoyable?

Now, of course people are going to retain many of their cultural values from their homeland. This is excellent because they bring these traditions to their new country and more people enjoy them. I understand that people will probably want to speak their native tongue in their own home. That is great. Three languages are spoken in my home. But, we all speak English when we go out to conduct business and take our driver's exam.

I don't think this has to do with racism as much as it has to do with state's rights and fear. I lived in Alabama for a number of years in Montgomery and also far out in the country. I truly believe that the Southern folk are afraid that their culture is dissipating. Everywhere they go, they see things in Spanish. The small deep south eateries are being replaced by taco shacks and Mexican cantinas, etc.

Honestly, is it too much for the citizens of Alabama to ask the immigrants in their states to learn English?

Radiate said:

Immigrants will not learn english sooner or later if we continue catering to them.

To go to someone elses country where traditions and standards have already been established and then attempt to change said standards because one does not put forth the effort to learn the language beforehand is nothing short of assanine and offensive. When in Rome do what Romans do.

Any tourist or traveler with a lick of common sense will learn a basic working of the language and culture of the place they intend to visit in order to be able to coherently function on their travels and also to be aware of any cultural quirks that may cause an unforseen snafu.

Why do illegal immigrants ignore such a simple courtesy? Seeing as how they come here for the better life and opportunity, the least they could do is learn to communicate in the standard language of the country and stop trying to change everything the suit themselves.

Click to expand...

You are right on the money....