Basement buildout, HPS DE vs 315w CMH vs chinese QB led? 7.5’ ceilings

I have the oddly shaped room you can see in the attached pics and im trying to maximize footprint canopy and yield in this room. i already have a bunch of phantom 1kw DE’s on hand but im second guessing running these versus going 315w cmh. i could run 12x 1kw DE’s on 5x5 footprints or 33x 315w CMH on 3x3 footprints. I can also fit 19x lights in there on 4x4 squares. How do the china CMH controllable setups compare to name brand? ive noticed with 1kw DE setups a china lamp and bulb is not noticeable yield and quality of flower wise compared to say a gavita or phantom DE with an ushio bulb. is this true of 315w cmh setups as well? would probably look to get all these lamps on alibaba with 0-10v controller inputs to utilize a Gavita EL2 or something. Ive had good luck running 1kw DE's in a 7ft tall tent but it did take a lot of constant training to keep the canopy scrogged down really low.

ive actually ran 4x 1kw DE's in a 10x10x7 tent with great success down in this basement.

http://instagr.am/p/BrBf3buBbIN/

http://instagr.am/p/BqfaTcUB6MV/
On the other hand ive been looking at chinese LED's and wondering if these alibaba LM301H type LED (Meiju Rita 600w qb800 model comes to mind) are actually decent units or if i should not take that gamble. buying 19x genuine HLG 550 - 650w LED's is beyond my monetary means. I could use a sonoff switch installed on each light to control the room.




33 total lights on 3x3 squares (315w cmh)


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19 total lights on 4x4 squares (china quantum boards?)


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12 lights on 5x5 squares (1kw DE hps)


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roughly 3.5x3.5 ft squares gets me to 27x lights at 480w each its 39 watts / sqft

Looks like im about 90% sure im going with 19x Meijiu F8 600w Bar lights in 4x4 pattern. they’ll be custom using all 90cri LM301b 3000k diodes, no additional 660nm or far reds. Meijiu has 3 main types of bar lights now. the MAJO (angled reflector bar/heatsinks, 256 diodes per bar), A8 style (has 256 diodes per bar, 2048 total diodes) is 482.00 +73.00 shipping, the F8 (folds in half and has 318 diodes per bar, 2544 total diodes) is 512.00 + 110.00 shipping.

the cost difference per fixture after shipping is 67.00 between the A8 and F8. the F8 appears vastly superior and for the upgrade cost of 67 bucks its a no brainer! it has 500 more diodes so they will run softer than the A8 at any given wattage.

square_root_pharms:

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Meijiu appears to be using Inventronics 600S12ADT drivers now which do appear to be 0-10v controllable and dim to off capable. I may or may not go with a china controller. i have looked at some other nice 0-10v controllers out there. if i had some coding skills i would make a wifi controller using a raspberry pi.

I really like the f8 from what I've seen, but why aren't you getting any of the red diodes.

Edit: by reds I mean the 660 that everyone seems to be using on the fixtures.

I think the trolmaster hydro x has an adaptor that will work with those lights.

Apalchen said:

I really like the f8 from what I've seen, but why aren't you getting any of the red diodes.

Edit: by reds I mean the 660 that everyone seems to be using on the fixtures.

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ill be using 90cri chips, if i need more red on top of that ill supplement using something better than 660nm epistars

The HPS DE(s) will always be the cheapest in initial cost, but you will pay through the nose at the wall, Then after HPS the CMH(s) are great, they grow beautiful plants, but you will be held to a 3 x 3 pattern, which is kind of inefficient because a 3 x 3 area is not really enough space to grow even 4 plants. Yeah, you need at a minimum a 2 x 2 space to grow 1 plant, but really a 2.25 x 2.25 space is what you really need to grow 1 plant. As for the Leds, the 320 boards are still the best bang for ones dollar. For example, 19 F8(s) will run you almost 12 grand shipped, and then you will still need to make lots of changes to them, to make them work the way you want, like being able to control them all at once, or in set groups, or putting all the drivers in a certain location, etc, etc. And if you went 320 route, 38 x 320, you would spend 5 grand less and get the same coverage as 19 F8(s), 2 x 320 per table running @ 240w each, grows the same amount pot as one F8 running at 480w over the same size table with the same amount of plants!

piratebug said:

The HPS DE(s) will always be the cheapest in initial cost, but you will pay through the nose at the wall, Then after HPS the CMH(s) are great, they grow beautiful plants, but you will be held to a 3 x 3 pattern, which is kind of inefficient because a 3 x 3 area is not really enough space to grow even 4 plants. Yeah, you need at a minimum a 2 x 2 space to grow 1 plant, but really a 2.25 x 2.25 space is what you really need to grow 1 plant. As for the Leds, the 320 boards are still the best bang for ones dollar. For example, 19 F8(s) will run you almost 12 grand shipped, and then you will still need to make lots of changes to them, to make them work the way you want, like being able to control them all at once, or in set groups, or putting all the drivers in a certain location, etc, etc. And if you went 320 route, 38 x 320, you would spend 5 grand less and get the same coverage as 19 F8(s), 2 x 320 per table running @ 240w each, grows the same amount pot as one F8 running at 480w over the same size table with the same amount of plants!

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Are you talking about boards instead of bars?

Why not just go with 240w boards instead of 320w dimmed? Will end up even cheaper.

Looks like we got a problem getting 90cri diodes now.... I have one company saying they have 85-88cri lm301b but I don't see anything on Samsung's site about these chips.... I see 70, 80, 90 cri only...
Then there is another company saying they can do 90cri. Meijiu says they can't get 90cri now...

Just go with the 80cri 3000k. I doubt you would actually get 90cri from the Chinese suppliers even if they claim it.

I wish King Brite made a bar style I don't really like their quantum bar light set up though. I've heard King Brite as far as Superior with customer service if you burn out a diode or board they will ship you a new one whereas meijiu Will simply try to refund you a percent of the cost of that particular diode or board. So on a $500 light they might refund you 20 bucks to cover the percentage cost of that single board.

p0opstlnksal0t said:

I wish King Brite made a bar style I don't really like their quantum bar light set up though. I've heard King Brite as far as Superior with customer service if you burn out a diode or board they will ship you a new one whereas meijiu Will simply try to refund you a percent of the cost of that particular diode or board. So on a $500 light they might refund you 20 bucks to cover the percentage cost of that single board.

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Kingbrite does make bars (Link). I have their boards, luckily I haven’t had any issues so can’t speak on warranty but they were very helpful when placing an order.

Edit: Sorry, thought I read that you don’t like their quantum board set up.

Yeah I'm not a fan of that quantum bar light The diode count is pretty low in comparison to the other LED bar lights

p0opstlnksal0t said:

Yeah I'm not a fan of that quantum bar light The diode count is pretty low in comparison to the other LED bar lights

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That might mean better coverage though with a more spread out form-factor at the same total wattage, as long as it provides enough light per square foot directly under its footprint. Just cover the entire area of the tent with that.

NukaKola said:

Kingbrite does make bars (Link). I have their boards, luckily I haven’t had any issues so can’t speak on warranty but they were very helpful when placing an order.

Edit: Sorry, thought I read that you don’t like their quantum board set up.

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How long your king brites been running?

MikeLife500 said:

How long your king brites been running?

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I’ve only been running them 4-5 months so far. Just switched to LED recently.

NukaKola said:

I’ve only been running them 4-5 months so far. Just switched to LED recently.

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Thinking bout switching. Just trying to get some insight from someone with real experience with it

Some LED lights like the Fluence Spydr 2i strip style lights are designed to be operated close to the canopy, like 6 - 12 inches. Other lights like the quantum board or timber for example are designed to be operated at 30+ inches from the canopy. So when the ceiling height is a factor and you can raise the lights regularly as needed then go with a strip style setup with high diode count driven softly and run them at 12 inches every time you raise them, get close to 6 inches and it's time to raise them again. lol Strip builds are easy to do and you can build one hell of a good light for the money.

Renfro said:

Some LED lights like the Fluence Spydr 2i strip style lights are designed to be operated close to the canopy, like 6 - 12 inches. Other lights like the quantum board or timber for example are designed to be operated at 30+ inches from the canopy. So when the ceiling height is a factor and you can raise the lights regularly as needed then go with a strip style setup with high diode count driven softly and run them at 12 inches every time you raise them, get close to 6 inches and it's time to raise them again. lol Strip builds are easy to do and you can build one hell of a good light for the money.

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I agree building a strip light is amazing bang for the buck. But I can't imagine having to make 20+ fixtures. Lol. I made 8 fixtures with 28 strips each and I still shudder about how much work it is.
That being said Before that I was growing with 6 630W CMH lights and after adding in LEDs the room is a totally different level of brightness also got mad fox tailing near the end. A 750W fixture cost me $500 CAD to make. But that's bulk ordering everything from Digi-Key and requesting discount pricing from their sales staff. On such a large room I bet he could easily get the light costs down to $300/light if only 480w each. Still leaves the ungodly amount of labour.

MidnightSun72 said:

I agree building a strip light is amazing bang for the buck. But I can't imagine having to make 20+ fixtures. Lol. I made 8 fixtures with 28 strips each and I still shudder about how much work it is.
That being said Before that I was growing with 6 630W CMH lights and after adding in LEDs the room is a totally different level of brightness also got mad fox tailing near the end. A 750W fixture cost me $500 CAD to make. But that's bulk ordering everything from Digi-Key and requesting discount pricing from their sales staff. On such a large room I bet he could easily get the light costs down to $300/light if only 480w each. Still leaves the ungodly amount of labour.

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Yeah I figured out it's easiest to do it in steps. Build the first one to get all the kinks worked out. Then build the others step by step, like cut all the metal, install all the strips, assemble the sticks, wire them all up. If you are all setup to do one step, do it for all the lights and move to the next step. Honestly it shouldn't be more than 2 or 3 days of work if done that way.