CFL: Calculations and Room Design

Al B. Fuct said:

CFLs will never be more 'powerful' in terms of light intensity than they are now. The CFLs you buy at the grocery are already an adequate replacement for incandescent household illumination and won't be developed further. They don't need to be any more intense for that job.

Life's too short to grow crappy bud.

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I know you are a respected member and all...but I beg to differ. CFL technology is NOT stagnant. What led you to believe this? Do you have proof to back up your claims?

Allow me to prove my point...

Another variation on existing CFL technologies are bulbs with an external nano-particle coating of titanium dioxide. Titanium dioxide is a photocatalyst, becoming ionized when exposed to UV light produced by the CFL. It is thereby capable of converting oxygen to ozone and water to hydroxyl radicals, which neutralize odors and kill bacteria, viruses, and mold spores.

Have the new Titanium Oxide CFL's been around since the early 1900's?

Induction Fluorescent Lamps...

Since an induction lamp has no electrodes, it can have a very long service life. For induction lamp systems with a separate ballast, the service life can be as long as 100,000 hours, which is 11.4 years continuous operation, or 22.8 years used at night or day only. For induction lamps with integrated ballast, the life is 15,000 to 30,000 hours.

Research on electrodeless lamps continues, with variations in operating frequency, lamp shape, the induction coils and other design parameters. Low public awareness and relatively high prices have so far kept the use of such lamps highly specialized.



How about...The Cold Cathode Fluorescent Lamp (CCFL) is one of the newest forms of CFL. The lifetime of CCFLs is about 50,000 hours. CCFLs were initially used for thin monitors and backlighting, but they are now also manufactured for use as lamps. <- I don't think they had thin monitors back in the 1900's

There is the constant demand to increase efficiency.



"The CFLs you buy at the grocery are already an adequate replacement for incandescent household illumination and won't be developed further."

They actually are being developed further. There is constant research going on in lighting technology...and this INCLUDES CFL. Please point me to the your proof that there is no further development of CFL's. I have given you mine.

Thanks!

Oh and to this comment " Life's too short to grow crappy bud." <- What do you consider good bud? When Garden Knowm grew 8 oz from 8 42 watt cfl's...is that crappy bud to you? I'd be happy with that.

And what is the big deal if the 8 oz are not as dense as 8 oz of HPS?

Enlighten me. When it is put in a grinder...all of it looks the same to me. What is the point of having dense buds?

These silly arguments sound like the question ... what is heavier...1 pound of bricks or 1 pound of feathers.

Tanuvan said:

Oh and to this comment " Life's too short to grow crappy bud." <- What do you consider good bud? When Garden Knowm grew 8 oz from 8 42 watt cfl's...is that crappy bud to you? I'd be happy with that.

And what is the big deal if the 8 oz are not as dense as 8 oz of HPS?

Enlighten me. When it is put in a grinder...all of it looks the same to me. What is the point of having dense buds?

These silly arguments sound like the question ... what is heavier...1 pound of bricks or 1 pound of feathers.

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Exactly my point.

I'm sure they could've gotten more from a single 1000w HPS, but that single 1000w puts out way more light. I wouldn't be upset with 8 oz of bud...

The only issue I have with the CFL's at this point is the fact that the bigger they get the less efficient they become. Having to find the 'right' bulb to use will inevitably mean the use of many CFL's. Something on the range of 30-40 CFL's to match one HPS.

Personally, I use the fluoro's for veg.. HPS for flowering.. I'm just waiting to see what is in the future for these bulbs. The only thing is.. I use the T5's.. simple and easy to use.

At the moment I've getting 20,000L and I'll be upgrading to 40,000L soon. More light = faster growth.

The advantage I see to using CFL's is simply that anyone can get these and set something up in a small concealed space. With the low amount of heat they can be put almost anywhere.

For something bigger I'd op for the HPS to keep things simple.

dude that was so confusing!! i had to read over it a few times to get it right!! well done though!!

kearners said:

dude that was so confusing!! i had to read over it a few times to get it right!! well done though!!

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For simplicity the HID's are the way to go.

For small grows CFL's are the way to go.

For an amazing setup, use both.

Personally, I use T5's for veg and clones. HID's are just easier to use to flower. They produce more light from one source.

For something that Al is doing, you'll need the intensity of the HID's to produce fast veg growth.

My plants are SMALL with TIGHT nodes. When they flower they will go nuts!

Follow my journal and you shall see.





Enigma

I have a headache but I love this thread!

Very informative. I don't even care who was "right," that was one hell of a lesson. Everyone should read this thread.

Auzzie07 said:

Very informative. I don't even care who was "right," that was one hell of a lesson. Everyone should read this thread.

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Thanks!

Garden Knowm would agree that CFl's are a viable option for any grower.. shit, he wrote a book on it!



E

As far as lumens are concerned, I'm rather convinced that if two lights are positioned within close proximity of each other that the overlapping radial illuminance increases resulting in an increase of lumens in that area.

Here's a rough diagram using three horizontally positioned lights showing their radial output with 12" diameters. As can be see, there's a doubling and a tripling of illuminance. With this type of an array, SCROG or LST would be the most efficient growing technique.

CFL's work well on a micro level. I've just recently begun and will be setting my aim very low hoping for 1/10 gram per watt and/or 1 gram per week of growth.

lightweight said:

CFL's work well on a micro level. I've just recently begun and will be setting my aim very low hoping for 1/10 gram per watt and/or 1 gram per week of growth.

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Bah! Grab GK's book for what $15 or so? and get more that 1/10 gram per watt. Or, get creative and try to out do what he did! rules were made to be broken and good luck with the grow!

btw, as I have seen it...done correctly for every 8000 lumens of flouro you can expect at least 2oz dry.

wonderful arguement ! I got one .How about if you overdrive the ballasts on 4 ft 40watt tubes. run one light on one ballast. Overdrive!YA!

Were are you guy getting these prices.Online?

Tanuvan said:

Bah! Grab GK's book for what $15 or so? and get more that 1/10 gram per watt. Or, get creative and try to out do what he did! rules were made to be broken and good luck with the grow!

btw, as I have seen it...done correctly for every 8000 lumens of flouro you can expect at least 2oz dry.

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Won't happen. The stink makes me paranoid so I have to cut early forgoing the crucial "fattening" stage plus my setup only allows for three 1/4 gallon pots at one time so everything is micro including yield. One square foot space I've got. I'll make the best of it though.

By the way, I am now totally convinced that lumens do not increase with additional lamps. However, lumens most likely increase as proximity to the lamp decreases.

lightweight said:

Won't happen. The stink makes me paranoid so I have to cut early forgoing the crucial "fattening" stage plus my setup only allows for three 1/4 gallon pots at one time so everything is micro including yield. One square foot space I've got. I'll make the best of it though.

By the way, I am now totally convinced that lumens do not increase with additional lamps. However, lumens most likely increase as proximity to the lamp decreases.

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Wrong. Read the first thread in my sig. Lumens do add.

Not claiming to be an expert on anything here, I would like to point out the ease of use of cfl lighting for a micro grow...

However, having seen first hand some less than desirable results from cfl flowering, I decided to mix things up a little bit...

I am using 5 cfl (2700k) and one 35 watt HPS (1900k)...
I know... it's a baby light, and it's so cute!!!... but with my BIG fan, I can have it very close to my plants without worries...

Knowing what I know today, I would have gone with the 50 watt HPS, maybe even the 70 watter?!?! ... But I am really not sure of how much more heat they would produce...

I can see myself forking out for another HPS, and will probably go with the 50 watt, just because of how small I want to keep things...

I really enjoyed the thread so far and I think both sides have made a valid point...

Thanks to all for the knowledge...

Gypsy...

this is exactly what i was looking for someone who knows about cfls...i had a question about them..how many would i need for a homemade grow box 2 ft wide by 4 feet tall i really need help beacuse my plant stopped growing but any help will be greatly appreciated!

i would just say fuck it and use them all if you can....grow me some dank and im pleased...

Excellent post! I'm using a 180w Extreme Flower (3w diodes) and (1) Daylight Spectrum CFL 125w, Warm Spectrum CFL 125w, and two Warm Spectrum CFL bulbs 65w. I just started but the clones look great and I'm pretty excited about saving money. Why burn a whole in your wallet and possibly one in your home from HID's. One of the top reasons people get busted is because of house fires!

Ok, Ive tried to read all this. my question is this:

One person or so has claimed that if I use 2 CFL'S Each with 2000L , I still will be only getting 2000L instead of 4000L ???
And If this is confirmed why would that make grow lights with up to 8 bulbs...

Because Im about to make a purchase...

Can someone confirm or denie this plz???

anyone?.............................................................