cloning a clone

mared juwan

mared juwan

Well-Known Member
Mr.Funk said:
Hello there, Sorry for posting a Question in your thread but i was wondering if i took a clone from a flowering plant in less then two weeks of flowering, would it stress or hurt the plant at all and will the clone survive Thanks.
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I do it all the time with no ill effects. A cut from a flowering plant will take a few days longer to root. Also it must "reveg" as it starts to grow again. The first couple leaf sets might be wrinkly or oddly shaped but the plant will grow out of that quickly. It definitely will not stress the mother plant you are taking the cut from (try to take cuttings from only the lowest branches). I try to avoid cutting from a flowering plant ONLY because it takes longer to root and start growing. But I have been lazy or busy on many occasions and let plants flower for a few days or even a couple of weeks before taking cuts. Despite what I hear all the time there were no ill effects to the health and potency of the resulting clone. So if your choice is between a cut from a flowering plant or no clone at all I would choose to take the cutting every time.
 
Silky Shagsalot

Silky Shagsalot

Well-Known Member
i've taken cuts, put them in stasis for a few weeks, and then rooted them out. then i turn around and do the same thing again, with the same cuts. it's a great way to buy yourself time for the next grow...
 
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mkfx

Active Member
AFAIK, cloning can definitely weaken your genetics.

it's like taking a photocopy of a photocopy over and over again.

it is not the act of cloning the plant that adds in the noise (distortion, error, etc), it is the DNA->RNA transcription for protein synthesis that introduces error.
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
mkfx said:
AFAIK, cloning can definitely weaken your genetics.

it's like taking a photocopy of a photocopy over and over again.

it is not the act of cloning the plant that adds in the noise (distortion, error, etc), it is the DNA->RNA transcription for protein synthesis that introduces error.
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What does that have to do with cloning? RNA transcription occurs for all protein synthesis, whether cloned or not.
A more likely cause is telomere depletion.

Also, copying photocopies is an analog process. Cloning is a digital one. More akin to copying a CD or DVD multiple times.
 
cream8

cream8

Well-Known Member
i have a mom white ice that ive cloned myself over and over 5 times not to mention the friend who gave it to me who had done it 10 times and he got the strain from some guys who supposedly started it from seed in 2000...9 years and i love this lady
 
Woomeister

Woomeister

Well-Known Member
mkfx said:
AFAIK, cloning can definitely weaken your genetics.

it's like taking a photocopy of a photocopy over and over again.

it is not the act of cloning the plant that adds in the noise (distortion, error, etc), it is the DNA->RNA transcription for protein synthesis that introduces error.
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Absolute rubbish, deal in facts not FICTION!!!:roll::roll::roll:
 
cream8

cream8

Well-Known Member
if you think about it your taking a cut of the exact genetics i dont see how it could change
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
cream8 said:
if you think about it your taking a cut of the exact genetics i dont see how it could change
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Because DNA has a limited number of telomeres. This is one theory that is tied to aging in all plants and animals. Not something that will happen in a dozen or so generations, but hundreds.
 
Woomeister

Woomeister

Well-Known Member
mindphuk said:
Because DNA has a limited number of telomeres. This is one theory that is tied to aging in all plants and animals. Not something that will happen in a dozen or so generations, but hundreds.
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Maybe a little longer than that my friend, many fruit crops have been cloned for 1000's of years, Romans brought vineyards to the Southeast of England and they are still cloned to this day.

World's oldest cloned plant, 43,000 years, is dying

abc.net.au — Kings lomatia is the oldest known plant clone. It stopped seeding and has been cloning itself for at least 43,000 years, remaining genetically identical over that time, which increases its vulnerability to disease and other threats.
 
Silky Shagsalot

Silky Shagsalot

Well-Known Member
Woomeister said:
Maybe a little longer than that my friend, many fruit crops have been cloned for 1000's of years, Romans brought vineyards to the Southeast of England and they are still cloned to this day.

World's oldest cloned plant, 43,000 years, is dying

abc.net.au — Kings lomatia is the oldest known plant clone. It stopped seeding and has been cloning itself for at least 43,000 years, remaining genetically identical over that time, which increases its vulnerability to disease and other threats.
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tell me woo (by the way, nice post here.) did they clone these vineyards using growth tips, or did they just use the leaves??? LOL!!!
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
Woomeister said:
Maybe a little longer than that my friend, many fruit crops have been cloned for 1000's of years, Romans brought vineyards to the Southeast of England and they are still cloned to this day.

World's oldest cloned plant, 43,000 years, is dying

abc.net.au — Kings lomatia is the oldest known plant clone. It stopped seeding and has been cloning itself for at least 43,000 years, remaining genetically identical over that time, which increases its vulnerability to disease and other threats.
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Well, grape vines are not annual plants. They actually drop leaf and live throughout the winter so they have a longer natural lifespan than cannabis, which is supposed to live only one season.
The plant listed in the article, King's Lomatia, is a special case too. It is a triploid plant that cannot reproduce sexually and each plant's lifespan is about 300 years.

Of course I don't know if we really are seeing degradation, but telomere depletion has been implicated in the aging and degradation of genetic information in other plants species.

I am one of those that doubted degradation of clones, but a little more reading has convinced me it can happen. I still think the majority of the problems can be avoided by culling weaker cuttings and not using anything but the strongest for a mother plant.
 
vapedg13

vapedg13

New Member
In Hawaii they cut off the buds and reveg the weed plant....the same plant can grow and produce buds for years...it turns into a mj tree:mrgreen:
 
Drr

Drr

Well-Known Member
vapedg13 said:
In Hawaii they cut off the buds and reveg the weed plant....the same plant can grow and produce buds for years...it turns into a mj tree:mrgreen:
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yeah they are lucky with no winter.. but you could do this indoors if you wanted.. time would be an issue.. unless someone has tried it... wouldn't the revegged plant with the large root system grow very fast? possibly cancelling out the time issue?
 
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Mr.Funk

Well-Known Member
Cool man, Thanks Mared very good info yea i think im ganna try that and see what happens ya know it would be stupid not to. Thanks
 
M

Marijuana101

Well-Known Member
mared juwan said:
I think this qualifies as an "advanced technique" question. Cloning is not exactly newb territory. And the difference between taking cuttings from a single mother plant and the cloning of clones is something a lot of "advanced" growers seem to disagree on. I've seen many knowledgable growers say that cloning clones degrades potency and other factors. However, in my own experience this is not true. I have a strain which I have done this for 8 generations now. Meaning I grew the original plant from seed, then I cloned that plant before flowering it and vegged its clones until they were ready to give clones and then repeated the process. EIGHT times. I am rather limited on space and keeping mothers is just not feasible. Especially when I have noticed that as I selectively clone the healthiest and fastest-rooting plants the quality has actually INCREASED from all this, rather than the other way around. I am of the opinion that my 8th generation of this strain is more potent and vigorously growing than the original plant or any generation in between. They have only gotten better instead of worse which is the opposite of what many sources claim. Even so, when I tell people this I usually get a tisk tisk response saying you're not supposed to do this. But I've never gotten anyone to fully explain to me what is bad about it.
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any videos on how to clone???
 
M

Mobius

Active Member
The issue with cloning from clones is not one of genetics but of epigentics. It's Lamark's revenge.

The DNA and Mitochondrial DNA are not the only inherited factors in the plant. There are histomes that help package and unroll the DNA to allow for transcriptase to start the protein building that is the building blocks of the plant.

The thing to remember is that there are a host of "non-expressive" genes and genes that turn on an off due to environmental conditions. Certain of these conditions and switches are controlled by the histomes. When you stress a plant there is a chance that you could have switched a histome to its alternate form. This has the effect of turn on and or off a whole suite of genes. This can have both negative and positive effects(mostly negative). Autoflowering and other non-typical behaivor can be partly attributed to epigentics.

TLDR- Clones of clone are ok in general. Occasionally an environmental factor will spoil a clone and that "new" epigentic expression is passed down through sucessive generations. The best way to guard against clone degeneration is a stable environment. This includes radicla changes in diet without keeping a control if your experiment turns sour.
 
olosto

olosto

New Member
marcos said:
Im new i plant a seed because i came from good strain call granddady turf i search everywere i cant find anybody her of it..
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In case this is not a joke.... Its a strain called Grandaddy Purps or simple GDP. Very popular strain.
 
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