Democracy?

Wavels

Wavels

Well-Known Member
Wow wee, has this thread veered off topic....
Great thread though, excellent exchange of ideas!
Being agnostic myself, I think I can see both sides of this issue.
I have rejected atheism, because what if I am wrong? Yikes!
Straddling the fence enables me to sort of have it both ways...heheeh.
I lean toward theism and may one day feel 100% comfortable with this belief.
What inclines me to a revelation of faith is the nature of objective reality.
Why is it that the most productive and successful civilizations have been believers of some type? The Judeo Christian based societies have done the best job in simple life enhancement and have uniquely provided more freedoms to their peoples.


Evolution as a theory is yet a work in progress, as are all theories.
I just don't know for sure yet, and I'm gettin kind of old!!!
Gotta keep tryin' to figure it out....leap of faith and all that!
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
skunkushybrid said:
Med', that question was answered for you in a different thread a while ago now. I believe it was answered for you by two or three different people.

Why don't you ask me why all cats aren't lions? Or, why all dogs aren't wolves... or, how whales are related to cows? Or, how it is that dolphins used to walk on land?
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One of is drinking koolaid and I don't drink. How can you put yourself at the center of the universe and call your self god(small letterr on purpose). Does that eliminate everyone else as God? Basically to me, God is everyone and everything, but He (it) is more than the whole, It is an ever expanding source of light and knowledge that man can never know! Man might experience some of the joys of God like power but never the whole.
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
One of my very best friends is a fallen-away Catholic. He claims to be an Athiest now. I asked him once what he would do if he were hit by a car and lay dying on the side of the road. He said he's ask someone to call a priest to say the last rites. I asked him why he would do that ... and he answered: "Well, you never know!"

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
ViRedd said:
One of my very best friends is a fallen-away Catholic. He claims to be an Athiest now. I asked him once what he would do if he were hit by a car and lay dying on the side of the road. He said he's ask someone to call a priest to say the last rites. I asked him why he would do that ... and he answered: "Well, you never know!"

Vi
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I think a lot of so called athiests would be looking for a hand up in the final moments. It's all well and good when you're young and healthy, let some catastrophy put you on deaths bed, and then ask if you still don't believe, anyone that brave would either be stupid brave, or incoherent brave, take your choice because it would no longer be about look at me and how smart I am, I don't need no stinkin Diety, it would be about me and whats next!
 
skunkushybrid

skunkushybrid

New Member
You guys really don't get it do you?

I KNOW.

There is no wavering, no question in my mind at all. I know there is no god. The closest thing to god is the human race. We are all gods. WE have the power to do good or evil, to create life or to destroy it.

There is no need to believe in a god in this day and age. We do not need the threat of hell to prevent us from doing wrong. How can intelligent people honestly fool themselves into believing such drivel... the answer is simple, programming. It starts from birth if you have religous parents, if not they'll get you from the moment you go to school. They'll tell you the stroies of the bible like they are fact.

I believe the bible did a good thing, it helped change our society into the one we have today... but its usefulness is outdated.

You honestly believe that when you die you're not really going to die, but live forever in paradise? Death is our minds biggest fear. You may not be aware of it consciously, but it will remain in your subconscious... terrifying you ever more as the time draws nearer. A young man's subject, death, the ceasing of LIFE. I capitalise it because of it's importance, we so want not to die.

If you truly believed in a god and heaven, then death would truly hold no fear for you.

Who's not afraid of death?
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
Who's not afraid of death? Skunky, outside of a few religious pariahs, I'd say everyone is afraid, or at least concerned. We certainly hope our leaders are or they would certainly unleash Armegedden. No matter what your religion (maybe muslim suicide bombers) the fear of the unknown is always present. If you tell me you don't fear death, to me, you will lose creduality. Even the most devout Christian will fight for his life up to the last minute. I believe fear of death is Gods way of containg the worst of human behavior, for if one had no fear of death they could rape and pillage without conscience.
 
skunkushybrid

skunkushybrid

New Member
I did not say I do not fear death, in fact if you read my posts you'll find I imply the opposite. I fear death, but at the same time I refuse to bullshit myself that I am going to live forever. This realisation merely makes my life more important.

A true believer in a god and heaven would not fear death. Fear of death is for the unsure, and those that know it is final.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
skunkushybrid said:
I did not say I do not fear death, in fact if you read my posts you'll find I imply the opposite. I fear death, but at the same time I refuse to bullshit myself that I am going to live forever. This realisation merely makes my life more important.

A true believer in a god and heaven would not fear death. Fear of death is for the unsure, and those that know it is final.
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How many true believers have there been, Jesus, Budda, Mohammed, maybe, but when it comes to death, the rest of us are worried. It is natural to fear an unknown. We believers have our doubts, I'll say even Jimmy Swaggart has doubts, no one has come back except Jesus, and if you believe him, then we have no worries for he forgives all. Just try and live an honest fruitful (doing something to improve humanity) life and no matter what you believe, you'll be rewarded.
 
skunkushybrid

skunkushybrid

New Member
Only within the timescale of your life. When you are dead, that's it. That doubt that you have, quite often misinterpreted for the devil, I like to call common sense.
 
7xstall

7xstall

Well-Known Member
you might think i'm full of shit but i'm seriously not afraid at all of death. i know it's coming, nothing can stop it and who cares. i've done the best i can and that's it, whatever it's like i'll know when i get there.
 
skunkushybrid

skunkushybrid

New Member
You should be afraid of death... it doesn't always come with old age. The only thing you can hope for is that you have no time to contemplate it when it is happening.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
7xstall said:
you might think i'm full of shit but i'm seriously not afraid at all of death. i know it's coming, nothing can stop it and who cares. i've done the best i can and that's it, whatever it's like i'll know when i get there.
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sounds tough, but If you were given the fact that you had terminal cancer and days to live, could you be so brave, I think at the time of our death we all are going to be worried as this is all we,ve ever known and now we are marching forth into a new dimension, either nothing as skunk and many other athiests see it, or a new adventure, with new challenges as the Buddists see it or a heaven like place as the Christians see it, or even hell. The real deal is no-one knows, so death remains a mystery!
 
skunkushybrid

skunkushybrid

New Member
I KNOW. I have no doubts.

Do you think dogs think about what is going to happen when they die? Yet dogs are afraid of death... it's okay for the rest of the Earth's animals to rot in the ground, but mankind needs to be special. The only difference between us and dogs is that we can think about death long before it becomes a real, personal issue.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
skunkushybrid said:
I KNOW. I have no doubts.

Do you think dogs think about what is going to happen when they die? Yet dogs are afraid of death... it's okay for the rest of the Earth's animals to rot in the ground, but mankind needs to be special. The only difference between us and dogs is that we can think about death long before it becomes a real, personal issue.
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Don't you think that the fact we can contemplate our death might give us some special connection to eternity?
 
7xstall

7xstall

Well-Known Member
flatliners was a cool movie.

i wrecked my motorcycle when i was 18, going very fast, and thought i was dead. it really just pissed me off! :)

then i stopped rolling, it got quiet, and it hurt!
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
7xstall said:
flatliners was a cool movie.

i wrecked my motorcycle when i was 18, going very fast, and thought i was dead. it really just pissed me off! :)

then i stopped rolling, it got quiet, and it hurt!
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ME too only I was 25, and yeah it hurt like hell. I had an old lady pull right out in front of me, I was doing about 50, I had no time to react other than throw down the bike and jump, I almost made it over the car but hit my stomach on the driprail as I flew over the car, landed in some succulent water plants. Had a bruise from my pelvis to my chest, no broken bones though, could have been a lot worse, The bike went under the car and was totaled.
 
7xstall

7xstall

Well-Known Member
stupid drivers almost did me in on many occasions med! licensing is one area our state gvnmnts need to step it up a notch or two...or three!

bad thing about my story, and it's really bad, i caused my own wreck. was toasted, late to prob. officer, passing everyone on my crotch rocket. came to a bridge accelerating and front fork wobble kicked in..80 something.

last thing i saw before bike threw me up in the air was a car coming in the other lane!

now that i think about it, it was scary in that moment before i opened my eyes...wondering what would be there. i mean, it went from the thunder of my full helmet rolling on asphault to total silence.


glad it turned out to be some guy running at me yelling "don't move, don't move!!" as i got up. i imagine it was pretty horific to see what had just happened to me from the outside.

lol i was a mess.

i remember saying, "i have one cig in this pack, i'm going to go sit down over there and smoke it before the ambulance gets here." that poor guy looked at me like i was totally out of my mind, thought i was in shock or whatever, just good skunkweed keeping my nerves together! :)
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
Sounds painful, Mine was a TR-6 triumph, would do a little more than 80, but I don't think I ever took it up there. I did all my riding on the LA streets and traffic even then was bad! should have seen that bike, what a mess!
 
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