Five myths about immigration

In my own country.

Ok, fair enough. How do you think we should decide how many can come into the country legally? Should there be quotas? Very high standards? Both? What should the standards be? Should there be a program to allow unskilled seasonal workers to pick fruit and whatnot?

hanimmal said:

Says the person breaking the law.

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so a rapist and a person with a parking ticket are the same in your eyes

I cant answer all those questions but I will answer 1. We don't need mexicans to pick fruit or clean hotel rooms. America just pimps them out to get something out of the deal! If they were not here there are plenty of jobless Americans that would take those shit jobs in a heartbeat! We would just spend the money more wisely and stimulate our own economy.

robert 14617 said:

so a rapist and a person with a parking ticket are the same in your eyes

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Great point rob!

we have a migrant worker program and have quotas for issuance of work visa's

we have alot of illegal in our state, i agree w/mediceneman, i was a manager at a place where the owner started only renting to illegals, because wouldnt complain, the minite they got moved in they w/smuggle in more illigals, they w/crown 18 people in a 1 bedroom trailer, i had prob 50 mail for names that wernt on the rental agreement, they were ssn they used that wernt thiers, i know for a fact they do not have car ins, they get in a wreck, you cant id them. now also they feel no need to speak english ecept the kids, i have no problem w/immigration, they can just do it legally like my people did learn english learn our history, and im sorry but they have a kid every year because the belive they cant be deported if thier kids are us citizens, they get food stamps, welfare, housing, that we cant get, why do you think the states are going broke. im not a bigot, i just want them to do it riight

Denofearth69 worked hard, saved up, and was able to start a very successful masonry company doing custom stone work for Telluride Colorado's wealthy elite. Denofearth69, not some money grubbing jerk, hires and pays LEGAL immigrants very well, and gets very good work from them in return.

Along come the illegals, price per square foot of stone work almost instantly drops from $27-35 dollars a square, to $9 a square. Now Denofearth69 AND his LEGAL immigrant workers are fucked. To add insult to injury when Denofearth and other contractors report this abuse to the INS, nothing is done about it because they don't want to ruffle the feathers of the super rich homeowners who hired the illegals. Denofearth69's American dream gets flushed down the toilet by people with no right to even be here.

Denofearth69 is also white boy who grew up in Santa Fe NM and has enjoyed the very social and familial culture of Hispanics and has no problem with those here LEGALLY!!!

When my former workers wanted to fill openings in my company with their family and friends it was understood that they must have green cards, and none of them had any problem obtaining, so why do illegals feel the need to remain illegal?So they can fly under the radar? So they don't have to pay income taxes?

I have no problem with immigrants as our great nation is great because we are so diverse. but, to put it bluntly, FUCK YOU!!! If you think illegals should be allowed to remain illegal, and that is exactly what you are saying when you say illegals shouldn't be targeted for being here illegally.

Yea you said it right with you cant id them. They get in carona induced dui hit and run accidents all the time and cause the legal drivers insurance to go up.

It always seems to me its the rich bastards who have the money to hire hard working americans want the illegal mexican workers just so they can save a few bucks. and dont get me started about the illegals in this country. im no racist at all but fuck those stinkin ass filthy wet back basterds. ive seen alot of valid points on here about how they live off of yours/my tax dollars to support themselves. and then work under the table to avoid paying any taxes. fuck sending them back so they can just come to america again. drop them off in the middle of africa... or just kill them?

Damn! lol. Africa? hahaha!

It is a fact that immigrants are taking away the blue collar jobs. I would like to see our immigration system model maybe Australia's where to obtain citizenship you have to be able to offer the country something and if you dont in 6 months your out. This will probably never happen. I grew up in the NW and even there we have schools that only speak primarily Spanish. Some of these illegal immigrants were my friends, they had more then a lot of my friends parents who were hard working and citizens. I also had a hit and run in a gas station. A family in a purple astro van hit me and fled they eventually caught the van which had no insurance. I personally have never had a ticket and my insurance rose! I was furious but nothing can be done. I see the affects and I think we need to remodel our system, not based on hate but logic.

haha I knew this guy who had been sent back 7 times no joke.. he would disappear for a month or two and then he'd be back

Did any of you actually read the article...?

Oh, and estesj....my point was that you can't really address 'legal' and 'illegal' immigration as separate issues. People will come where there are jobs. Already, a lot of people have gone home or haven't tried to come here because unemployment is high and the job market is tight at the moment.

And if there are so many americans were willing to work as farmhands or in slaughterhouses, there wouldn't be such a demand for illegal immigrants in those sectors.

so a rapist and a person with a parking ticket are the same in your eyes

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No, but people looking out for their families and being willing to work their asses off, someone growing a recreational drug, and getting a parking ticket are all about the same in my eyes. If it is illegal so be it, but doesn't mean I agree with it.


And to the dude that lost your business, that blows.


And I am going to apologize in advance for this.


To have your business you had to at least make enough money to pay everyone and all your bills and purchase all the material to stay open. And at $27 a square foot you should make enough to stay in business I take it (otherwise you would not take the jobs because you would lose money is why I say that). So at $27 you are at a market equilibrium if that is the case. And when you sold it for 30+ you were making a profit.


So, here is the problem and why there needs to be changes, but not the type most people think it should be (mexicans getting the boot).

If they were able to drop the price down to $9 (your price is now triple right) to do the same job and the same quantity of jobs. But instead of dropping the prices, they kept them the same (for a period of time).

They not only could get the work done and pay the other contractors enough to stay open, But also to still pay you and your men 2/3 of their salaries while they went and got a new set of skills that would make them more marketable and be able to get a better job than before.

And we would all be better off for doing that. Because not only are your men (and possibly you because you started out with a much better set of skills that you could improve with 2/3 of your old pay and as much time as you need to do something else) better off, but that higher wages and more specialized skills would mean a more productive society and more wealth creation for everyone.


Actually that was something that doesn't even need the government to do. You could have rallied with all the local businesses and hired the illegals, laid off all your old crew but still pay them 2/3 while they find new careers, or go back to school, kept your same pay (I am sure that most business owners don't pay themselves like they are illegal immigrants) and eventually if all contractors acted like this the market would never even notice the difference until you all stopped paying the old workers and you made bank for a while (until undercutting would eventually bring the prices down to the $9).

But instead we cannot figure out how to work with each other, and are prone to panic and lay blame on other people.


Because we can't do that and we cannot stop putting people who don't have a clue (dems or republicans (not to mention the even more insane fringe parties lack of anything economically sound), we all suffer.

I just don't understand why people don't actually look at the situation and just jump to anger over someone moving less distance than Nebraska to Wisconsin.

abe23 said:

....my point was that you can't really address 'legal' and 'illegal' immigration as separate issues.

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this is one of the biggest myths concerning immigration. it suits the proponents of amnesty to make this claim, but it is a lie that plays to our sympathy for the self-proclaimed victims of the world and our traditional role as a nation of immigrants. the simple fact is that we can't afford to serve everyone.

its too later guys you polititions have sold your country for temporary gain


its baked n the cake if you will


too many idiots with voter cards now

get you guns and butter and you will be ok

but dont trust the government anymore

they are your enemy and the enemy of all free men




i have come to realize its just human nature for the intelligent to subgegate the retards


america was not an acception but just a fresh start at taking over people.

undertheice said:

this is one of the biggest myths concerning immigration. it suits the proponents of amnesty to make this claim, but it is a lie that plays to our sympathy for the self-proclaimed victims of the world and our traditional role as a nation of immigrants. the simple fact is that we can't afford to serve everyone.

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And this is based on what exactly? All the evidence suggests that immigration is a net positive for the country. If someone moves into your town, starts a business and creates jobs, does it really matter whether he's from kansas or guatemala? People who are willing to leave their country in search of greener pastures tend to be go getters and it's in our interest for them to come here and help us grow.

And is the anticipated tightening of the labor market as the baby boomers retire and the active workforce shrinks also a convenient pro-amnesty myth? Because the japanese don't think so. They're busy building new robots so they don't have to let in a bunch of filipino maids and korean construction workers...


Oh, and Big P....you seem a little 'baked in the cake' yourself.

CaRNiFReeK said:

JOE LEGAL vs. JOSE ILLEGAL

You have two families: "Joe Legal" and "Jose Illegal".
Both families have two parents, two children, and live in California.

Joe Legal works in construction, has a Social Security Number and makes $25.00 per hour with taxes deducted.
Jose Illegal also works in construction, has NO Social Security Number, and gets paid $15.00 cash "under the table".

Joe Legal: $25.00 per hour x 40 hours = $1000.00 per week, or $52,000.00 per year. Now take 30% away for state and federal tax; Joe Legal now has $31,231.00.
Jose Illegal: $15.00 per hour x 40 hours = $600.00 per week, or $31,200.00 per year. Jose Illegal pays no taxes. Jose Illegal now has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays medical and dental insurance with limited coverage for his family at $600.00 per month, or $7,200.00 per year. Joe Legal now has $24,031.00.
Jose Illegal has full medical and dental coverage through the state and local clinics at a cost of $0.00 per year. Jose Illegal still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal makes too much money and is not eligible for food stamps or welfare. Joe Legal pays $500.00 per month for food, or $6,000.00 per year. Joe Legal now has $18,031.00.

Jose Illegal has no documented income and is eligible for food stamps and welfare. Jose Illegal still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays rent of $1,200.00 per month, or $14,400.00 per year. Joe Legal now has $9,631.00.
Jose Illegal receives a $500.00 per month federal rent subsidy. Jose Illegal pays out that $500.00 per month, or $6,000.00 per year. Jose Illegal still has $ 31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays $200.00 per month, or $2,400.00 for auto insurance. Joe Legal now has $7,231.00.

Jose Illegal says, "We don't need no stinkin' insurance!" and still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal has to make his $7,231.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline, etc.

Jose Illegal has to make his $31,200.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline, and what he sends out of the country every month.

Joe Legal now works overtime on Saturdays or gets a part time job after work.
Jose Illegal has nights and weekends off to enjoy with his family.

Joe Legal's and Jose Illegal's children both attend the same school. Joe Legal pays for his children's lunches while Jose Illegal's children get a government sponsored lunch. Jose Illegal's children have an after school ESL program. Joe Legal's children go home.

Joe Legal and Jose Illegal both enjoy the same police and fire services, but Joe paid for them and Jose did not pay.

Do you get it, now?

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i believe this is not the first time you post this chain-email bullshit on this forum.

keep it up and it's spam

i called you out on it already..

jose illegal does not earn 10 bucks an hour. the national rate is closer to 4 bucks an hour.

stop spreading lies.

also there seems to be alot of child abuse, when you find out who the abuser is, its an illegal, im not a racest but enough is enough!