Is Time An Illusion?

Beefbisquit said:

I feel uncomfortable with unreasonable opposition. It's different if 97% of the general public believe something, or if 97% of experts in a field believe something specifically pertaining to their field of study.

I'm a libertarian, so unfortunately my vote doesn't really get counted towards my actual centralist views. I vote for which ever party holds the political views closest to mine when I vote. I refuse to belong to any party.

I care what you think because how you live your life and what you base your beliefs on affects me, whether I want it to or not. If we don't try to curb our CO2 emissions it is possible to reach a point of no return. When denialists like you try to convince other people that they don't need to be concerned, and that global warming is all a lie, it's detrimental to the entire world. That's why I care, not some lame, half concocted excuse about my job needing grants, or me being a leftist.

If you look at global warming similarly to the prisoner dilemma, it's easy to see that even if somehow the massive amount of data that's been collected was all wrong, and the world isn't getting warmer form CO2 emissions, the 2 possibilities with the best possible outcomes are the two that involve toning down CO2 emissions.

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CO2 isn't the only problem.

We dump MASSIVE amounts of oil in the ocean, just about every 10 years. On "Accident"

We have an ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELD basically surrounding the Earth for the past 50 years, THAT WAS NEVER STUDIED, and has never been here before.

And I'm sure there is PLENTY more we could solve to "head in the right direction"

To blame CO2 and get mad at people like Doer is dumb. Just do what you and your 97% want to do about CO2, and come to him when you want to talk about another problem, that he can see too.

I was just thinking about it, and they should make the roof of every building maintain a garden, for CO2, O2 purposes.

Since that building is standing ontop of a spot that probably used to be grass and trees.

Where's Doer? There's nothing good on, and I'm in the mood for more crazy Nova is coming on in 20 minutes, Brian Greene's Fabric of the Cosmos is doing 'Quantum Leap' tonight. Should be great...

Finshaggy said:

CO2 isn't the only problem.

We dump MASSIVE amounts of oil in the ocean, just about every 10 years. On "Accident"

We have an ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELD basically surrounding the Earth for the past 50 years, THAT WAS NEVER STUDIED, and has never been here before.

And I'm sure there is PLENTY more we could solve to "head in the right direction"

To blame CO2 and get mad at people like Doer is dumb. Just do what you and your 97% want to do about CO2, and come to him when you want to talk about another problem, that he can see too.

I was just thinking about it, and they should make the roof of every building maintain a garden, for CO2, O2 purposes.

Since that building is standing ontop of a spot that probably used to be grass and trees.

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Now, here's the crazy I was looking for. The Earth's Electromagnetic field is created by it's churning, turning molten iron core, and has been around for billions of years. It's a well known phenomena and well understood, and it's responsible for protecting Earth from harmful rays and radiation. In fact, it reverses polarity every 1,000,000 years or so, and takes up to 10,000 years for the reversal to take place. During the periods of polarity reversing, our magnetic field is weakened allowing more radiation to permeate the atmosphere. Hope the next one doesn't cause too much damage, we can ill afford that right now. You know, with the Earth warming and all...

tyler.durden said:

Now, here's the crazy I was looking for. The Earth's Electromagnetic field is created by it's churning, turning molten iron core, and has been around for billions of years. It's a well known phenomena and well understood, and it's responsible for protecting Earth from harmful rays and radiation. In fact, it reverses polarity every 1,000,000 years or so, and takes up to 10,000 years for the reversal to take place. During the periods of polarity reversing, our magnetic field is weakened allowing more radiation to permeate the atmosphere. Hope the next one doesn't cause too much damage, we can ill afford that right now. You know, with the Earth warming and all...

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I know the EARTH has a field. But WE'VE created a NEW one. With cars, AC units, large power plants, and thousands of other things including the computer you are looking at right now.

And we have NO IDEA what effect that is going to have on the Earth's electromagnetic field or the Earth itself.

Or even what it's doing RIGHT NOW.

Finshaggy said:

I know the EARTH has a field. But WE'VE created a NEW one. With cars, AC units, large power plants, and thousands of other things including the computer you are looking at right now.

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The fact that there are NO tables for correcting a compass reading due to technogenic magnetism tells me something I already knew: the EM fields produced by our energy economies don't have a meaningful effect on the geomagnetic field. It's like cars during the day running headlights ... you'll see the headlights if you look in the right places, but the intensity and quality of daylight are unbudged.

I own some large, strong permanent magnets. My compass doesn't show any deflection until it comes within 12 feet of them. cn

cannabineer said:

The fact that there are NO tables for correcting a compass reading due to technogenic magnetism tells me something I already knew: the EM fields produced by our energy economies don't have a meaningful effect on the geomagnetic field. It's like cars during the day running headlights ... you'll see the headlights if you look in the right places, but the intensity and quality of daylight are unbudged.

I own some large, strong permanent magnets. My compass doesn't show any deflection until it comes within 12 feet of them. cn

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But there IS light pollution.

And maybe your compass doesn't do anything. But what happens when a plant grows in between 2 magnetic fields?

Or goes from heavily populated magnetic place, to low mgnet place, to heavy magnet place?

What does it do to the ions in the sky? (It could Explain crazy earthquakes and tsunami stuff?)

There are a million things left to learn about what we are doing, and we will get 10X worse before we even start really trying to figure it out.

Oh light pollution I am an avid amateur astronomer, so i know about that.
Now while light is EM radiation, it doesn't affect parmanent or long-lasting magnetic fields. Different physics.
Also, since we use AC for just about everything, the EM "warble" around power lines decays to zip in a very short distance ... dozens of yards even at the hottest locations.
If you flew small planes, you could watch the compass flying over cities, power plants, areas of heavy industry etc. Zip-a-rino.
Areas where there is much iron in the ground DO cause magnetic aberrations, but that is a different (and not man-made) effect. cn

cannabineer said:

Oh light pollution I am an avid amateur astronomer, so i know about that.
Now while light is EM radiation, it doesn't affect parmanent or long-lasting magnetic fields. Different physics.
Also, since we use AC for just about everything, the EM "warble" around power lines decays to zip in a very short distance ... dozens of yards even at the hottest locations.
If you flew small planes, you could watch the compass flying over cities, power plants, areas of heavy industry etc. Zip-a-rino.
Areas where there is much iron in the ground DO cause magnetic aberrations, but that is a different (and not man-made) effect. cn

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I know they are different. Just comparable strides have been made to them in the new age.

But if planes feel it, air feels it, birds feel it, the atmosphere gets effects of it, and probably more.

But even if it is gone in a "Short distance" from A/C and stuff, it's still effecting us in our house, or the ground around it.

I'm not saying it IS a big deal, I'm just saying we could look into ALL of this JUST as much as CO2 pollution.

Finshaggy said:

I know they are different. Just comparable strides have been made to them in the new age.

But if planes feel it, air feels it, birds feel it, the atmosphere gets effects of it, and probably more.

But even if it is gone in a "Short distance" from A/C and stuff, it's still effecting us in our house, or the ground around it.

I'm not saying it IS a big deal, I'm just saying we could look into ALL of this JUST as much as CO2 pollution.

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I'm saying planes DON'T feel it.
Some birds navigate magnetically (pigeons?) The haven't been spoofed, and I would expect them to be more sensitive instruments for measuring any magnetic disturbance.
Tangent: The magnetic poles have been on the move, and some experts are predicting a geomagnetic field reversal maybe even in our (well, your, y'all young whippersnappers) lifetimes. THAT will be when magnetically navigating migratory critters will be sort a fun to watch. cn

cannabineer said:

I'm saying planes DON'T feel it.
Some birds navigate magnetically (pigeons?) The haven't been spoofed, and I would expect them to be more sensitive instruments for measuring any magnetic disturbance.
Tangent: The magnetic poles have been on the move, and some experts are predicting a geomagnetic field reversal maybe even in our (well, your, y'all young whippersnappers) lifetimes. THAT will be when magnetically navigating migratory critters will be sort a fun to watch. cn

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LOL! I heard of the same possibility, Neer. I hadn't even thought of what the poor magnetically navigating animals will do after the reversal, there will be an entire PBS Nature series starring misguided creatures with Benny Hill music in the background...

Finshaggy said:

CO2 isn't the only problem.

We have an ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELD basically surrounding the Earth for the past 50 years, THAT WAS NEVER STUDIED, and has never been here before.

To blame CO2 and get mad at people like Doer is dumb.

Click to expand...

Finshaggy said:

And we have NO IDEA what effect that is going to have on the Earth's electromagnetic field or the Earth itself.

Or even what it's doing RIGHT NOW.

Click to expand...

Finshaggy said:

And maybe your compass doesn't do anything. But what happens when a plant grows in between 2 magnetic fields?

Or goes from heavily populated magnetic place, to low mgnet place, to heavy magnet place?

What does it do to the ions in the sky? (It could Explain crazy earthquakes and tsunami stuff?)

There are a million things left to learn about what we are doing, and we will get 10X worse before we even start really trying to figure it out.

Click to expand...

So, it is dumb to blame Co2, which has mountains of data to support it being a greenhouse gas, and instead we should blame some unstudied, unconfirmed EM field which may or may not be doing something that may or may not be harmful, but probably isn't. How silly for science to have not thought of this already!

You like to act as if the popular interpretation of things are wrong, and that your special intellect and insight has shown you the correct way, and then you can't ever properly describe this correct interpretation but instead simply demonstrate terrible comprehension and application of half-baked technical terms. This allows you to maintain in your head the illusion of always being right, when any responsible and careful thinker would see always being right as a red flag for possible error.

*walks in thread*

*reads doer and finshaggy posts*

*loses faith in humanity*

*leaves thread*

Got this from the jhon titor site As may know russia recently said this : http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/russias-military-chief-potential-conflicts-near-russian-borders-may-grow-into-nuclear-war/2011/11/17/gIQAWQTJUN_story.html And obama anounced this: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-11-16/asia/world_asia_australia-obama-trip_1_military-expansion-military-power-top-priority?_s=PM:ASIA and china said this: http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/et-cetera/china-warns-australia-against-military-pact-with-us/articleshow/10766203.cms Now we all know that the so called elites that run the world,want mass depopulation. Now heres what the so called time traveler jhon titor,said whats gonna happen in 2015.. I remember 2036 very clearly. It is difficult to describe 2036 in detail without spending a great deal of time explaining why things are so different.

In 2036, I live in central Florida with my family and I'm currently stationed at an Army base in Tampa. A world war in 2015 killed nearly three billion people. The people that survived grew closer together. Life is centered on the family and then the community. I cannot imagine living even a few hundred miles away from my parents.
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]There is no large industrial complex creating masses of useless food and recreational items. Food and livestock is grown and sold locally. People spend much more time reading and talking together face to face. Religion is taken seriously and everyone can multiply and divide in their heads.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Life has changed so much over my lifetime that it's hard to pin down a "normal" day. When I was 13, I was a soldier. As a teenager, I helped my dad haul cargo. I went to college when I was 31 and I was recruited to "time travel" shortly after that. Again, I suppose an average day in 2036 is like an average day on the farm.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]There is a civil war in the United States that starts in 2005. That conflict flares up and down for 10 years. In 2015, Russia launches a nuclear strike against the major cities in the United States (which is the "other side" of the civil war from my perspective), China and Europe. The United States counter attacks. The US cities are destroyed along with the AFE (American Federal Empire)...thus we (in the country) won. The European Union and China were also destroyed. Russia is now our largest trading partner and the Capitol of the US was moved to Omaha Nebraska.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]One of the biggest reasons why food production is localized is because the environment is affected with disease and radiation. We are making huge strides in getting it cleaned up. Water is produced on a community level and we do eat meat that we raise ourselves.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]After the war, early new communities gathered around the current Universities. That's where the libraries were. I went to school at Fort UF, which is now called the University of Florida. Not too much is different except the military is large part of people's life and we spend a great deal of time in the fields and farms at the "University" or Fort.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Constitution was changed after the war. We have 5 presidents that are voted in and out on different term periods. The vice president is the president of the senate and they are voted separately.[/FONT]

Bunch of vids on youtube of this guy....

Time and space is the limits of this world. Simple as that.

tyler.durden said:

LOL! I heard of the same possibility, Neer. I hadn't even thought of what the poor magnetically navigating animals will do after the reversal, there will be an entire PBS Nature series starring misguided creatures with Benny Hill music in the background...

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...I used to love Benny Hill!

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...and the bees too... seems along with our nomadic poles, wireless service disrupts the magnetically guided.

eye, i was moved to google "cell phone confuse bees", and it's quite possible that the story about cell phones harming bees might be an internet meme, which is just the newfalootin term for "rumor".
One of the really bothersome things about Google is that it's hard to weed information from just talk. Also, "catchy" ideas, true or otherwise, undergo a mass replication on the agar plate of a million blogs, and since Google ranks hoits by popularity, a catchy idea somehow gains the weight of truth by simply being repeated a lot. It's the modern version of the Big Lie, with it becoming hard to sort the more-correct stories from the merely sensational. In any case here's a fragment that teases more than it pleases (about bees and their service plans) ... but it does suggest that the very popular "bees, cell phones" story might be fabricated in part or entirely, like an online game of Telephone in which sensational ambiguity, interpretation ... spin ... gets positively selected. Oh i'm rambling ... cn
http://cleantechnica.com/2011/05/12/are-cell-phone-killing-bees-how-the-false-meme-spread/2/

meme

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is short for manuel also...

eye exaggerate said:

...I used to love Benny Hill!

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...and the bees too... seems along with our nomadic poles, wireless service disrupts the magnetically guided.

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I loved Benny Hill, too, it was my favorite slapstick. I used to believe the cell phone/bees thing, too. Here's a really interesting Nova entitled, 'Silence of the Bees'. The bee population is on a severe decline for apparently several different reasons, it's a truly alarming scenario. Some farmers in third world countries are actually having to pollinate flowers BY HAND to get a harvest:

http://video.pbs.org/video/995224587/