It's A Fuct World

cheers ALB ive noticed that most of the 900 x 900 trays all are only 11cm deap ,so they would only flood to bout 90cm im guesssing ? , what size pots would suit these trays as i was gunna get them 170cm big W specials but there would be 80cm that doesnt get flooded ?

cheers mate ..

butcher73 said:

cheers ALB ive noticed that most of the 900 x 900 trays all are only 11cm deap ,so they would only flood to bout 90cm im guesssing ? , what size pots would suit these trays as i was gunna get them 170cm big W specials but there would be 80cm that doesnt get flooded ?

cheers mate ..

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90cm is 900mm, nearly 1m! That's a pretty deep flood you're wanting there, mate.

It's really only necessary to flood to about 25-50mm (2.5-5cm) deep. Your media will wick nute soln up to the roots of small plants with no problem.

170mm (not cm!)dia pots are fine. I use 175mm dia pots. Try Garden City Plastics for cheaper pots than at Big W. Should be about 45c/ea for 175mm dia x 175mm tall pots in stacks of 70. I haven't bought any from them for a few years, price may have changed.

haha ,, woops i meant 90mm / 175mm ,, cheers

Nice to see you back on here Al! your threads have been the source of information for me learning learning from ground zero. the weed Baron , you should sell to a stand up comedian! that shit made me laugh so hard! i'm looking forward to November This election will/should make Arkansas the first southern state for legal MMJ. I've been waitng for a couple of years for this. the whole reason for not moving to a legal state was to help get it passed here. this is the last chance, Either it passes or I move. I'm lucky that I have family in two legal states and several friends in 2 others. If I have to move I can take my pic. I'd rather spend that money setting up up a killer grow system than moving.
Anyway, pardon the ramble. You rock and your sog system is so simple even I can't fuck it up! well, not much anyway lol.

Good to see you around Al B, Sorry for sending the friend request, didn't read the About me.
Was going to ask ya, why don't you ever make an appearance in the Aussie Growers thread?
Anyway keep up the good work and contributions you always make.

Hey Al, I'm on the final stage of prep for my op and have another question for ya...

Okay, so I'm going with 4x4 trays and I'm going to buy 7in square pot for the trays. 36 7in pots can fit in the 4x4 with room for 8 more 6in pots (all of this depends on if the dimensions the manufacturer states are spot on). So I guess I'm asking if there's such a thing as too many plants for the space. I'd imagine that there isn't because of the lollipop effect, but I don't want to assume.

What do you think?

Al, How big is your clonning tray if you cut so long clones and let them root in 40mm cubes? Is the 60x40cm cloning tray enough to hold 35-40 clones?

Clones

Humidity: 50-60%
Temperature: 26-28C

Mothers:

Humidity: 30-50%
Temperature: 24-26C

Flowering:

Humidity: 30-50%
Temperature: 24-26C

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Is it still actual?

Thanks in advance

Swiezy said:

Al, How big is your clonning tray if you cut so long clones and let them root in 40mm cubes? Is the 60x40cm cloning tray enough to hold 35-40 clones?

Thanks in advance

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http://forum.grasscity.com/grow-journals/156518-batch-clones-rockwool.html

This is his clone setup.

WWShadow said:

Nice to see you back on here Al! your threads have been the source of information for me learning learning from ground zero.

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Thanks. I drop in when I can.

the weed Baron , you should sell to a stand up comedian! that shit made me laugh so hard!

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I'll pass your regards on to Stoney.

i'm looking forward to November This election will/should make Arkansas the first southern state for legal MMJ. I've been waitng for a couple of years for this. the whole reason for not moving to a legal state was to help get it passed here. this is the last chance, Either it passes or I move. I'm lucky that I have family in two legal states and several friends in 2 others. If I have to move I can take my pic. I'd rather spend that money setting up up a killer grow system than moving.

Click to expand...

Hope it works out for you. However, until the federal laws on cannabis are reformed, state laws permitting MMJ use are not a safe haven. The DEA will bust you & laugh at your state laws. Consequently, even if state laws permitting MMJ are enacted, were I you, I would not sign up to any MMJ producers' or users' registries nor obtain a permit card, etc.

Anyway, pardon the ramble. You rock and your sog system is so simple even I can't fuck it up! well, not much anyway lol.

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Thanks, I'm sure you'll do fine.

JimmyRecard said:

Good to see you around Al B, Sorry for sending the friend request, didn't read the About me.

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S'ok.

Was going to ask ya, why don't you ever make an appearance in the Aussie Growers thread?

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I don't have time to keep up with multiple threads. All I can manage is this one.

Anyway keep up the good work and contributions you always make.

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Thanks.

legaleyes13 said:

Hey Al, I'm on the final stage of prep for my op and have another question for ya...

Okay, so I'm going with 4x4 trays and I'm going to buy 7in square pot for the trays. 36 7in pots can fit in the 4x4 with room for 8 more 6in pots (all of this depends on if the dimensions the manufacturer states are spot on). So I guess I'm asking if there's such a thing as too many plants for the space. I'd imagine that there isn't because of the lollipop effect, but I don't want to assume.

What do you think?

Click to expand...

It's possible in SoG to do as much as 4 plants per sq ft, but I don't like to pack them in that tightly in my own op. I hold it down to about 2.5/sq ft.

Swiezy said:

Al, How big is your cloning tray if you cut so long clones and let them root in 40mm cubes? Is the 60x40cm cloning tray enough to hold 35-40 clones?

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My clone box has 2 trays suiting 30x 40mm cubes each. I rarely have 60 in the clonebox at the same time.

Swiezy said:

Is it still actual?

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Yep, figures are still the same.

JGF said:

http://forum.grasscity.com/grow-journals/156518-batch-clones-rockwool.html

This is his clone setup.

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Same info is in the 'Batch of Clones in Rockwool' link in my signature on this board.

Hey Al, I really admire all the time and effort you've put into this thread, and your initial thread that I started following when I joined RIU, "Get A Harvest Every 2 Weeks". A virtual plethora of information, and your patience and time spend explaining things to virtually every poster has been an overwhelming source of information. Basically, thank you SO much!

I know you're rocking cool tubes w/ custom fitted Adjust-A-Wings and you highly recommend them, but for initial setup and cost minimization, if you had to pick one or the other to start with, would you do 6" cool tubes with generic XL reflectors (http://www.ebay.com/itm/1000w-1000-watt-Digital-HPS-MH-Grow-Light-System-Set-/160634128853?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item25668a49d5 w/ the 6" Cool Tube w/ XL reflector option) or go with Adjust-A-Wings (http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hoods-reflectors/wing-reflector/adjust-a-wing-large-reflector.html) and find a magnetic ballast and then add cool tubes when budget allowed. My only concern with doing Adjust-A-Wings first is the inability to cool the room effectively, whereas Cool Tubes allow most of the heat to be directed out of the room. My environment is a hot one so being able to keep the heat down is a priority, however since it's coming into cooler months now, it might not be an issue for winter and I could just adjust my setup before heat becomes an issue again. Your experience and advice is of course welcomed and valued, so I figured if anyone could help me, it would be you!

Also, when you setup your mother room you're running a 400wHPS 24/7 in a 2'x4' area correct? How exactly do you have it partitioned and ventilated other than having an oscillating fan? I didn't see any pics of your 400w and I wasn't sure if it was a cool tube as well run in conjunction with your other lights or how you maintained temp in there. I remember seeing a pic of an axial fan, but if you could explain that setup to me I would appreciate it.

Al, thank you, thank you, thank you for all of your help. I'm sure I'm becoming somewhat of a pest with all of my questions...

but, I'm trying to copy your setup as exact as I can (with some tweaks for my space I guess). So I did some math. Your tables are 2'7^ (820mm) with 23 6.9'' (175mm) pots in each tray. 2'7x2'7 = 7.29, and 23/7.29 = 3.15, meaning you have 3.15 plants per sq. ft. All of this information is based on a post you made in the original thread on pg. 52, and with all of this said, I'm going to be shooting for the 3.15 plant a sqft. that you have. However, you just said that you try to hold your plant count down to 2.5 sq ft. So, I'm not sure if I missed some adjustment you made to your setup (table size or plant number) as I was not able to read the entire thread.

Moreover, I really can't get around the hydroton/fytocell problem. I don't want to have to go to the hydro store or order off the internet as often as this setup would require me to, and I don't want to have to deal with disposing of this stuff either (not much of a problem with the fytocell). So I think I'm gonna construct or buy 4 4x4 aeroponic setups. How do you feel about aero? I've run a DIY aeroponic system myself before, but never doing SOG...

JGF said:

Hey Al, I really admire all the time and effort you've put into this thread, and your initial thread that I started following when I joined RIU, "Get A Harvest Every 2 Weeks". A virtual plethora of information, and your patience and time spend explaining things to virtually every poster has been an overwhelming source of information. Basically, thank you SO much!

Click to expand...

Happy to help!

I know you're rocking cool tubes w/ custom fitted Adjust-A-Wings and you highly recommend them, but for initial setup and cost minimization, if you had to pick one or the other to start with, would you do 6" cool tubes with generic XL reflectors (http://www.ebay.com/itm/1000w-1000-watt-Digital-HPS-MH-Grow-Light-System-Set-/160634128853?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item25668a49d5 w/ the 6" Cool Tube w/ XL reflector option) or go with Adjust-A-Wings (http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hoods-reflectors/wing-reflector/adjust-a-wing-large-reflector.html) and find a magnetic ballast and then add cool tubes when budget allowed. My only concern with doing Adjust-A-Wings first is the inability to cool the room effectively, whereas Cool Tubes allow most of the heat to be directed out of the room. My environment is a hot one so being able to keep the heat down is a priority, however since it's coming into cooler months now, it might not be an issue for winter and I could just adjust my setup before heat becomes an issue again. Your experience and advice is of course welcomed and valued, so I figured if anyone could help me, it would be you!

Click to expand...

Because winter's coming up for you, I would initially use the AAWs, without cooltubes and with a magnetic ballast located outside the room airmass. Add the cooltubes as soon as you are financially able, but before May if you can. Doing cooltubes right entails sourcing & dumping the air for them from outside the room airmass, as you will know, so plan your construction around your ductwork routing.

Also, when you setup your mother room you're running a 400wHPS 24/7 in a 2'x4' area correct? How exactly do you have it partitioned and ventilated other than having an oscillating fan? I didn't see any pics of your 400w and I wasn't sure if it was a cool tube as well run in conjunction with your other lights or how you maintained temp in there. I remember seeing a pic of an axial fan, but if you could explain that setup to me I would appreciate it.

Click to expand...

The op is laid out something like this:


Only the fans on the 900x900mm flowering trays oscillate. There's no room for the oscillating fan in the mother plant area for the fan to oscillate, so it doesn't.

Only the 1000s are in cooltubes, in a series duct.

The 400HPS in the mother area is about 1100mm above the trays and is not in a cooltube. The axial exhaust blower for the mother area is almost directly above the 400.

The ventilation systems for each area are controlled with independent thermostats.

My op is effectively a room within a room; I've roughed in some wall frames out of 2x4 timber and put some ceiling joists across them. That's all wrapped on the interior with panda film. The outside is coated in thin 1/4" MDF. The flowering & mother areas are separated with a double layer curtain of panda film; simply panda film looped over appropriate length 2x4's screwed to the supporting joists.

legaleyes13 said:

Al, thank you, thank you, thank you for all of your help. I'm sure I'm becoming somewhat of a pest with all of my questions...

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No worries- you're OK. I'll respond when I have time to do so. If I don't reply immediately, presume I'm working in my own op!

but, I'm trying to copy your setup as exact as I can (with some tweaks for my space I guess). So I did some math. Your tables are 2'7^ (820mm) with 23 6.9'' (175mm) pots in each tray. 2'7x2'7 = 7.29, and 23/7.29 = 3.15, meaning you have 3.15 plants per sq. ft. All of this information is based on a post you made in the original thread on pg. 52, and with all of this said, I'm going to be shooting for the 3.15 plant a sqft. that you have. However, you just said that you try to hold your plant count down to 2.5 sq ft. So, I'm not sure if I missed some adjustment you made to your setup (table size or plant number) as I was not able to read the entire thread.

Click to expand...

My trays are actually 900mm x 900mm (2.95 feet ^2 = 8.75 sq ft) & have 24 plants in each = ~2.7 plants sq ft.

Moreover, I really can't get around the hydroton/fytocell problem. I don't want to have to go to the hydro store or order off the internet as often as this setup would require me to, and I don't want to have to deal with disposing of this stuff either (not much of a problem with the fytocell). So I think I'm gonna construct or buy 4 4x4 aeroponic setups. How do you feel about aero? I've run a DIY aeroponic system myself before, but never doing SOG...

Click to expand...

Aero is fine but you will find that it's difficult or impossible to move plants around to even up development by putting stragglers in more preferential lighting positions.

Al B. Fuct said:

My clone box has 2 trays suiting 30x 40mm cubes each. I rarely have 60 in the clonebox at the same time.

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Are these clones tightly packed? I'm trying to figure out what's your clonebox and/or trays size. I will need space for ~40 clones on 60x40cm tray and need your advice, is it doable?

Also can't find how much you flood mother and flo table. I found contradictory information about it. Read somwhere that you flood flo tray to 150mm, but another post said 25-50mm. Found nothing about mother tray. Could you enlighten me?

Cheers

Swiezy said:

Are these clones tightly packed? I'm trying to figure out what's your clonebox and/or trays size. I will need space for ~40 clones on 60x40cm tray and need your advice, is it doable?

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The cubes can be packed right up against one another. In fact, that will improve heat retention in the cubes from your heat mat. That's how I place them in my clonebox. You'll be able to fit 150 40x40mm cubes in 600mm x 400mm.

Also can't find how much you flood mother and flo table. I found contradictory information about it. Read somwhere that you flood flo tray to 150mm, but another post said 25-50mm. Found nothing about mother tray. Could you enlighten me?

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Only if you're using clay pellets do you need to flood up to the overflow. With absorptive media, only 25-50mm is necessary. Wicking action will do the rest.

Al,
I just wanted to take a moment to say "THANK YOU"!!
I have been reading your threads and have learned so much. You have saved my first grow several times. I'm going to pattern my grow after yours. I am changing a lot around. You have explained in detail every little potential problem with solutions and preventative measures to take.
Thank you.
Pen

pen47Tex said:

Al,
I just wanted to take a moment to say "THANK YOU"!!
I have been reading your threads and have learned so much. You have saved my first grow several times. I'm going to pattern my grow after yours. I am changing a lot around. You have explained in detail every little potential problem with solutions and preventative measures to take.
Thank you.
Pen

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*blush*

Thanks for the thanks. Hope it goes swimmingly for you!

I am starting from seed.

Have seedlings in 1.5" rockwool cubes under T5 6 bulb at about 3" from the canopy

Im running ph water 5.5-5.8 on the seedling for 2 weeks flushing from the top of the rockwool cube to rid salt crust on the block and test run off every 3-4 days with 20ml of ph 5.5 water... Do you get salt crust on the top of your clone cubes? and Do you flush the cubes from the top to get EC reading of the clones run off?

You advise with clay pellets to flood a 1/2" below where the cube is set. With the wicking power of loose rockwool absorbent I get that you only have to flood about 1 to 3" but how deep do I put the seedling cube or clone cube? how deep do you place the cubes in Loose Roc/ STG? i

Should I put my 2 week seedlings in 8.5"x 8" pot that I have reserved for my mothers or work my way up to the 8.5" pot? I have a 400w hps for the mothers. If I remember correctly you flood for five minute intervals once a day for your mothers right....and five min intervals twice a day with the STG

Historic hurricane happening outside right now, what a goodtime for my first post ever on the worldwide web

Al B you took a already 6 year crazed lunatic and turned me into a monster, THANK YOU

Al, I can't stop saying Thank You. You deserve a medal or something...

But if I'm gonna need about 49 clones every 2 weeks, how many mothers do you suggest I keep, and under what amount of wattage?

And by the way, I have 8 125W LEDs laying around (big waste of money, if you ever intend to flower with these things), so I could use those for the mothers, but if you think HID is the way to go, I'll take your advice.

legaleyes13 said:

Al, I can't stop saying Thank You. You deserve a medal or something...

But if I'm gonna need about 49 clones every 2 weeks, how many mothers do you suggest I keep, and under what amount of wattage?

And by the way, I have 8 125W LEDs laying around (big waste of money, if you ever intend to flower with these things), so I could use those for the mothers, but if you think HID is the way to go, I'll take your advice.

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Sorry to intrude on this response but I thought I may have something to add. I too bought some 180w LED's from SPectra (wattage reduced to 140 or so), which do indeed not work for flowering, but it turns out they make very good vegging lights. Whether or not they would be adequate to keep your perpetual going, I won't say, but they work much better for vegging that they do for flowering! They seem to provide superior vegetative vigor compared to T5 as well. Good luck!