Obama's Certificate of Live Birth...

K

Keenly

Guest
jrh72582 said:
You just wait. I'm no fan of any democrat, but Obama will do just fine. He'll get re-elected again - just my prediction, nothing more. Please don't put it in your sig.
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his approval rating will be less than 40% by the end of the year if it maintains its momentum

thats not re-election winning stats
 
The Warlord

The Warlord

Well-Known Member
I'd rather get sick and die then have the government provide my healthcare. I'd REALLY rather people who can't afford healthcare do without if the alternative is ME paying for them out of MY pocket. Socialized medicine is just wrong on SO many levels.
 
purplekitty7772008

purplekitty7772008

Well-Known Member
CrackerJax said:
Oh that's that bum Carter. :lol: The king of appeasement as a weapon... :mrgreen:

Right after the SALT talks with Russia (nuclear disarmament), Carter was so overwhelmingly naive, it took my breath away. When Russia invaded Afghanistan the next day :lol: Carter said, "I can't believe he lied to me". :clap: How is that for total naivete!

Obama is doing the very same thing and will give back the very same results. All the despots LOVE Obama now.....easy pickings.
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:lol:

thanks for that.
 
F

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
The Warlord said:
I'd rather get sick and die then have the government provide my healthcare. I'd REALLY rather people who can't afford healthcare do without if the alternative is ME paying for them out of MY pocket. Socialized medicine is just wrong on SO many levels.
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you're already paying it. they call it "welfare". at least this way EVERYONE can get it, not just illegal immigrants. :wink:
medicare. :wink:
 
jrh72582

jrh72582

Well-Known Member
CrackerJax said:
I won't...that would be immature. Not my style. :wink:

I think he'll be lucky to get through the first term. People are waking up.... democrats are waking up. That's a real sign....the left are going to isolate themselves.........again

The hard left is like that crazy Uncle up in the attic. you keep him up there for years and after awhile, you think, maybe it would be okay to let him out and about. After a very short while, it becomes apparent that the Uncle is still a raving loon and must be forced back up into the attic again.

It's the "uneducated in life" youth which keeps the bad ideas of the left alive.... they don't know any better. :sad: They are also easily fooled because of their limited exposure to reality.
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You know as well as I do that reality differs greatly between demographics. I've been to places in the US that had me thinking I was in another world altogether.
 
purplekitty7772008

purplekitty7772008

Well-Known Member
The Warlord said:
I'd rather get sick and die then have the government provide my healthcare. I'd REALLY rather people who can't afford healthcare do without if the alternative is ME paying for them out of MY pocket. Socialized medicine is just wrong on SO many levels.
Click to expand...
I found this in the bill while skimming thru....

"
Part 1--Individual Responsibility

2
Sec. 401. Tax on individuals without acceptable health care coverage."


Umm, I don't know what that means. I need to scroll down and
find what they deem "acceptable health care coverage"

So they will tax us if we don't have "acceptable health care coverage".

:shock:
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I found this in the bill while skimming thru....

"
Part 1--Individual Responsibility

2
Sec. 401. Tax on individuals without acceptable health care coverage."


Umm, I don't know what that means. I need to scroll down and
find what they deem "acceptable health care coverage"

So they will tax us if we don't have "acceptable health care coverage".

:shock:
Click to expand...
Yeah keep reading it, like I said a bunch of times if you don't have insurance, and refuse to get coverage either through the private plans or the government plans (which are subsidized if you cannot afford it), you will be taxed since you will be a drain on society eventually.
 
jrh72582

jrh72582

Well-Known Member
Keenly said:
his approval rating will be less than 40% by the end of the year if it maintains its momentum

thats not re-election winning stats
Click to expand...
Approval ratings always fluctuate. Once the recession ends and people's lives start to improve, the ratings will go up. Obama will hit lower ratings and get much higher ones as well, it's reality of presidential politics.

Like I said, I really do believe this whole recession talk will end come 2010. By the first quarter, the market will be way up, jobs will recover, and the economy will strengthen. We'll start to see positive growth shortly.

And please refrain from putting these comments in your sig - such an immature move.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
his approval rating will be less than 40% by the end of the year if it maintains its momentum

thats not re-election winning stats
Click to expand...
According to fox news Bush hit the 40% mark in mid-late 2004 and was re-elected.
 
K

Keenly

Guest
hanimmal said:
Yeah keep reading it, like I said a bunch of times if you don't have insurance, and refuse to get coverage either through the private plans or the government plans (which are subsidized if you cannot afford it), you will be taxed since you will be a drain on society eventually.
Click to expand...

so "conform or be taxed"

is ok with you?


the only drain on society is the million new taxes that are going to pop out of no where

your complete lack of knowledge, even support for...this bill amazes me
 
The Warlord

The Warlord

Well-Known Member
fdd2blk said:
you're already paying it. they call it "welfare". at least this way EVERYONE can get it, not just illegal immigrants. :wink:
medicare. :wink:
Click to expand...

Ya I know, we really need to get rid of welfare. I personaly know a guy who makes 100 bucks a day and gets food stamps. it's rediculous.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
so "conform or be taxed"

is ok with you?


the only drain on society is the million new taxes that are going to pop out of no where

your complete lack of knowledge, even support for...this bill amazes me
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You crack me up. I post actual information, but because it doesn't jive with your conspirarist theorists you dismiss it.

But that aside, yes I have no problem to tax the people that can afford but chose not to carry ANY health insurance. It will eventually catch up to them, and when it does it will cost us all a lot more money. Out of the 1/6th of Americans that don't have any coverage we are having to pay their bill.

Of those 1/6 that could pay but chose not to and still live in our society are just taking advantage of the system, and they should not be allowed to. Because, again this is pivotal and you keep ignoring it, eventually they will use it and that means we pay for them, even though they could have been responsible. They will eventually get (cancer,accident, sick, old,) and when that happens under the current system they would not be able to get health insurance and they would have to still get care, which we pay for through higher premiums, more money out of pocket, or the insurance company paying more money which they pass that costs onto us.

I mean are you trying to not understand?
 
purplekitty7772008

purplekitty7772008

Well-Known Member
A little section I looked at...and completely disagree with

‘SEC. 1173A. STANDARDIZE ELECTRONIC ADMINISTRATIVE TRANSACTIONS.



D) enable the real-time (or near real-time) determination of an individual’s financial responsibility at the point of service and, to the extent possible, prior to service, including whether the individual is eligible for a specific service with a specific physician at a specific facility, which may include utilization of a machine-readable health plan beneficiary identification card;


I want to know how they are going to determine our financial responsibility
in real time without having access to bank accounts. And they will determine if we are eligible for service with a "specific physician at a specific facility"....

I thought if anyone who accepted this plan would be able to keep
their own doctors?

and a machine readable health plan beneficiary identification card.

Great.....

just great.
 
Roseman

Roseman

Elite Rolling Society
If you want your Health Provider to have the heart and compassion of the IRS and the efficiency of the Post Office, you'll support Obama's health plan.
 
jrh72582

jrh72582

Well-Known Member
purplekitty7772008 said:
A little section I looked at...and completely disagree with

‘SEC. 1173A. STANDARDIZE ELECTRONIC ADMINISTRATIVE TRANSACTIONS.



D) enable the real-time (or near real-time) determination of an individual’s financial responsibility at the point of service and, to the extent possible, prior to service, including whether the individual is eligible for a specific service with a specific physician at a specific facility, which may include utilization of a machine-readable health plan beneficiary identification card;


I want to know how they are going to determine our financial responsibility
in real time without having access to bank accounts. And they will determine if we are eligible for service with a "specific physician at a specific facility"....

I thought if anyone who accepted this plan would be able to keep
their own doctors?

and a machine readable health plan beneficiary identification card.

Great.....

just great.
Click to expand...
Do you have health insurance and understand how it works? You seem really confused.

For example, I have health insurance. I'm with an HMO. I get to pick my PCP (primary care physician) and he deals with everything. When I'm sick, I see him. If I need a recommendation for something, I ask him and he gives a form to my insurance, telling them to cover whatever procedure I need. I also have an insurance card so that any hospital can see that I am covered and that all expenses will be paid. It's a way of communicating back and forth between my insurance carrier and whoever will be needing payment for any services rendered. This card is vital as a way of identifying my membership and my ability to have everything paid for.

Now, when the health plan passes, NOTHING changes for me. I still have the SAME insurance, the SAME doctor, everything. I see no difference. My carrier will still be the same.

But, if you have NO insurance, you CAN get on the government plan. If you're on this plan, you will get a CARD, like the one I have with my insurance plan. This card will tell the hospitals and doctors that you are a legitimate carrier an it serves as proof that payment will be rendered. If they need more information, they can get real-time access to your insurance information (what is covered, what is not, etc...) from an account number on that card. It's the exact same as what I have. A card, an account. The card is machine readable, as they have been for years now. The system will be the same.

The reason why I assume you have no insurance (or that your g-ma takes care of it) is because this is common practice for ALL insurance. They always check what is covered at what place and always pre-certify before any major procedure. Do you understand how this is no different? Ask other people with insurance. It's the same. They have a card and that card has a number on it. That account number allows the doctors to access what is covered and paid for by you and by your insurance company. It's so simple and intuitive. It's been around for a LONG time.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
SEC. 1173. INFORMATION FOR BENEFICIARIES ON MA PLAN ADMINISTRATIVE COSTS.


  • (a) Disclosure of Medical Loss Ratios and Other Expense Data- Section 1851 of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395w-21), as previously amended by this subtitle, is amended by adding at the end the following new subsection:
    ‘(p) Publication of Medical Loss Ratios and Other Cost-related Information-
    • ‘(1) IN GENERAL- The Secretary shall publish, not later than November 1 of each year (beginning with 2011), for each MA plan contract, the medical loss ratio of the plan in the previous year.
    • ‘(2) SUBMISSION OF DATA-
      • ‘(A) IN GENERAL- Each MA organization shall submit to the Secretary, in a form and manner specified by the Secretary, data necessary for the Secretary to publish the medical loss ratio on a timely basis.
      • ‘(B) DATA FOR 2010 AND 2011- The data submitted under subparagraph (A) for 2010 and for 2011 shall be consistent in content with the data reported as part of the MA plan bid in June 2009 for 2010.
      • ‘(C) USE OF STANDARDIZED ELEMENTS AND DEFINITIONS- The data to be submitted under subparagraph (A) relating to medical loss ratio for a year, beginning with 2012, shall be submitted based on the standardized elements and definitions developed under paragraph (3).
    • ‘(3) DEVELOPMENT OF DATA REPORTING STANDARDS-
      • ‘(A) IN GENERAL- The Secretary shall develop and implement standardized data elements and definitions for reporting under this subsection, for contract years beginning with 2012, of data necessary for the calculation of the medical loss ratio for MA plans. Not later than December 31, 2010, the Secretary shall publish a report describing the elements and definitions so developed.
      • ‘(B) CONSULTATION- The Secretary shall consult with the Health Choices Commissioner, representatives of MA organizations, experts on health plan accounting systems, and representatives of the National Association of Insurance Commissioners, in the development of such data elements and definitions.
    • ‘(4) MEDICAL LOSS RATIO TO BE DEFINED- For purposes of this part, the term ‘medical loss ratio’ has the meaning given such term by the Secretary, taking into account the meaning given such term by the Health Choices Commissioner under section 116 of the America’s Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009.’
    (b) Minimum Medical Loss Ratio- Section 1857(e) of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395w-27(e)) is amended by adding at the end the following new paragraph:

    • ‘(4) REQUIREMENT FOR MINIMUM MEDICAL LOSS RATIO- If the Secretary determines for a contract year (beginning with 2014) that an MA plan has failed to have a medical loss ratio (as defined in section 1851(p)(4)) of at least .85
      • ‘(A) the Secretary shall require the Medicare Advantage organization offering the plan to give enrollees a rebate (in the second succeeding contract year) of premiums under this part (or part B or part D, if applicable) by such amount as would provide for a benefits ratio of at least .85;
      • ‘(B) for 3 consecutive contract years, the Secretary shall not permit the enrollment of new enrollees under the plan for coverage during the second succeeding contract year; and
      • ‘(C) the Secretary shall terminate the plan contract if the plan fails to have such a medical loss ratio for 5 consecutive contract years.’.
Click to expand...
That is the actual text I don't see what you wrote in that. Can you cut and paste the entire part so that I can see what your talking about please.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I want to know how they are going to determine our financial responsibility
in real time without having access to bank accounts. And they will determine if we are eligible for service with a "specific physician at a specific facility"....

I thought if anyone who accepted this plan would be able to keep
their own doctors?

and a machine readable health plan beneficiary identification card.

Great.....

just great.
Click to expand...
Again I tried to find it but couldn't so please just copy/paste the entire thing and not just a snippit it will be easier to explain.

But you also should understand that if your accepting this program, you don't have insurance. If that is the case you would not have a personal doctor usually. If you do have one then you would just do what what Jrh said.
 
purplekitty7772008

purplekitty7772008

Well-Known Member
jrh72582 said:
Do you have health insurance and understand how it works? You seem really confused.

For example, I have health insurance. I'm with an HMO. I get to pick my PCP (primary care physician) and he deals with everything. When I'm sick, I see him. If I need a recommendation for something, I ask him and he gives a form to my insurance, telling them to cover whatever procedure I need. I also have an insurance card so that any hospital can see that I am covered and that all expenses will be paid. It's a way of communicating back and forth between my insurance carrier and whoever will be needing payment for any services rendered. This card is vital as a way of identifying my membership and my ability to have everything paid for.

Now, when the health plan passes, NOTHING changes for me. I still have the SAME insurance, the SAME doctor, everything. I see no difference. My carrier will still be the same.

But, if you have NO insurance, you CAN get on the government plan. If you're on this plan, you will get a CARD, like the one I have with my insurance plan. This card will tell the hospitals and doctors that you are a legitimate carrier an it serves as proof that payment will be rendered. If they need more information, they can get real-time access to your insurance information (what is covered, what is not, etc...) from an account number on that card. It's the exact same as what I have. A card, an account. The card is machine readable, as they have been for years now. The system will be the same.

The reason why I assume you have no insurance (or that your g-ma takes care of it) is because this is common practice for ALL insurance. They always check what is covered at what place and always pre-certify before any major procedure. Do you understand how this is no different? Ask other people with insurance. It's the same. They have a card and that card has a number on it. That account number allows the doctors to access what is covered and paid for by you and by your insurance company. It's so simple and intuitive. It's been around for a LONG time.
Click to expand...
Yes, I understand the plan is optional.

But for those who accept it, I find it completely unacceptable for
them to have real time access to your accounts. Which is what will
have to happen if they need to determine your financial situation
in "near time/real time".

Yes, I have insurance. As stated earlier. With a card. But not a card
that is readable by a machine. I've never even heard of that before you

told me you had one.
 
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