old seeds --5 way test on germination

I have a large bottle of old seed from many years of collecting--no labels just a assortment of seed from good to great weed. from the 70s till 2000s.i tried several handfulls of these seed the old soak a day or 2 without 1 popping ,I then did a lot of reading and seem to have found a way to pop some or most of them.i did 5 test-- all 5 with store bought water---1 had nothing but water--1 had water and superthrive--1 had sugar water--1 had scaring outside of shell by sandpaper and water-- and last had sanded and put in sugar water--- I set in the sun between paper towels in a air tight container for each--after 12 hours I have 7 sprouts from the sugarwater with the scaring--1 from the scaring and plain water and none from the others. the sugar and warmth is the trick!!I think

as seeds get old they harden really hard!

the scarifying is the way to go

I just line a jar with average workshop sandpaper

and shake like crazy for 1 minute does the trick!

the use of aloe vera juice added to the water

works wonders

as is storing them seeds in a freezer with a tsp of rice

good luck

vostok said:

as seeds get old they harden really hard!

the scarifying is the way to go

I just line a jar with average workshop sandpaper

and shake like crazy for 1 minute does the trick!

the use of aloe vera juice added to the water

works wonders

as is storing them seeds in a freezer with a tsp of rice

good luck

Click to expand...

Have you had older seeds open but the taproot stall and not emerge? You can see the white stick in the opening.

I can get them to crack but not grow. I have not tried aloe as you suggest yet. I thought seaweed or willow water?

Tap root Stall, is popular with all seeds

imo look to the temps

to my blog on this uncompleted article : https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/Entry/germination-101.31319/

good luck

vostok said:

Tap root Stall, is popular with all seeds

imo look to the temps

to my blog on this uncompleted article : https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/Entry/germination-101.31319/

good luck

Click to expand...

Thank you. I bet cold temps was the problem. It was during mid winter. I will try a warmer way next time.

LittleT said:

I have a large bottle of old seed from many years of collecting--no labels just a assortment of seed from good to great weed. from the 70s till 2000s.i tried several handfulls of these seed the old soak a day or 2 without 1 popping ,I then did a lot of reading and seem to have found a way to pop some or most of them.i did 5 test-- all 5 with store bought water---1 had nothing but water--1 had water and superthrive--1 had sugar water--1 had scaring outside of shell by sandpaper and water-- and last had sanded and put in sugar water--- I set in the sun between paper towels in a air tight container for each--after 12 hours I have 7 sprouts from the sugarwater with the scaring--1 from the scaring and plain water and none from the others. the sugar and warmth is the trick!!I think

Click to expand...

So beginner question...you mean you let them soak in water after scarring? I'm trying to get seeds going and they are 6.5 years old. The first set I'm pretty sure rot after a few days so I want to do it right this next time.

what I did was scar the seed--put in alittle sugar water a few hours then into wet paper towel in a zip loc bag --- put where is is pretty warm---

MichiganMedGrower said:

Have you had older seeds open but the taproot stall and not emerge? You can see the white stick in the opening.

I can get them to crack but not grow. I have not tried aloe as you suggest yet. I thought seaweed or willow water?

Click to expand...

In older seed germination and then they stall and die at the tap exposure. The reason is lack of stored O2 in the plant to carry it over to the leaf set.

A few drops of H2O2 in your water can help the seedlings make the transition. This is well recorded fact.

Beans do better in 80-90 deg to pop. Don't go over 90. Got a seedling mat with a digital therm for a snake tank hooked up. The control therm is taped to the mat. I did a week of testing this by laser therm to be sure my temps don't go over 85F.....

I had a bit over 55% success with beans from the 60's, that had been stored well and kept at a safe RH. That was like 10-11 years ago.....oldest beans I've ever popped.

Dr. Who said:

In older seed germination and then they stall and die at the tap exposure. The reason is lack of stored O2 in the plant to carry it over to the leaf set.

A few drops of H2O2 in your water can help the seedlings make the transition. This is well recorded fact.

Beans do better in 80-90 deg to pop. Don't go over 90. Got a seedling mat with a digital therm for a snake tank hooked up. The control therm is taped to the mat. I did a week of testing this by laser therm to be sure my temps don't go over 85F.....

I had a bit over 55% success with beans from the 60's, that had been stored well and kept at a safe RH. That was like 10-11 years ago.....oldest beans I've ever popped.

Click to expand...

Thanks you for the tips.

I am pretty sure they were too cold. I use a lightbulb over an opaque container with a thermometer for a couple of years now with quite successful results.

However the seeds that stalled were during a very cold stretch last winter and the cold coming up from my open basement may have affected things more than I noticed.

I live in an old rebuilt cabin with an open Michigan basement basically.

Heat on seeds is kinda like lighting for clones to root. Gotta find that "sweet spot"....

On most strains. I simply set the cuttings in willow water and keep them so all they get is ambient light from the other half of the veg room (no direct lighting, not even week cfl's). I don't get those yellowing of leaves like some get cloning. Takes about 10 days and they stay green and nice. Straight to solo's and they take off like mad!

I like cuttings from lower on the plant. The more N they have (high up on the plant). The longer they take to root.

Seedlings = get direct lighting....

vostok said:

Tap root Stall, is popular with all seeds

imo look to the temps

to my blog on this uncompleted article : https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/Entry/germination-101.31319/

good luck

Click to expand...

Hmm, soaking seeds? It's like when I plunk down big dollars for beans from the proper source's. They are all beginning to stress that soaking seeds is a bad thing and will not honor any guarantee on their beans if you do!
I have never "soaked" cannabis seeds. It's not wise and these breeders are correct!
Many folks will use differing water sources for this soak. If you use a distilled, bottled water or RO or even "some" taps. You risk having little to no dissolved O2 in it.
Low O2 levels will actually drown seeds! They draw from the dissolved O2 in the water to successfully pop and grow on. I have simply added a few drops of H2O2 to my popping waters, used to moisten my paper towels and to the first waterings of older seeds for years...

Tap stall on old, and I mean old beans is more due to lack of O2....Supply that and see more success......but yeah, if your letting beans get below 70F, your going to have some problems too.

Just thought to share that V.....

Dr. Who said:

Heat on seeds is kinda like lighting for clones to root. Gotta find that "sweet spot"....

On most strains. I simply set the cuttings in willow water and keep them so all they get is ambient light from the other half of the veg room (no direct lighting, not even week cfl's). I don't get those yellowing of leaves like some get cloning. Takes about 10 days and they stay green and nice. Straight to solo's and they take off like mad!

I like cuttings from lower on the plant. The more N they have (high up on the plant). The longer they take to root.

Seedlings = get direct lighting....

Click to expand...

I do clones pretty much just like that too!

I thought the reason to cut from lower branches was the concentration of rooting hormones available lower down. Not sure which book I read that in. Maybe Jorje Cervantes.

Dr. Who said:

Hmm, soaking seeds? It's like when I plunk down big dollars for beans from the proper source's. They are all beginning to stress that soaking seeds is a bad thing and will not honor any guarantee on their beans if you do!
I have never "soaked" cannabis seeds. It's not wise and these breeders are correct!
Many folks will use differing water sources for this soak. If you use a distilled, bottled water or RO or even "some" taps. You risk having little to no dissolved O2 in it.
Low O2 levels will actually drown seeds! They draw from the dissolved O2 in the water to successfully pop and grow on. I have simply added a few drops of H2O2 to my popping waters, used to moisten my paper towels and to the first waterings of older seeds for years...

Tap stall on old, and I mean old beans is more due to lack of O2....Supply that and see more success......but yeah, if your letting beans get below 70F, your going to have some problems too.

Just thought to share that V.....

Click to expand...

I don't soak seeds either but I did the first 2 Grows. Greenhouse seed co specifies 12 hrs to soak in water before placing in a paper towel. Must show all steps to get guarantee.

I think that some harder shell seeds it may help but I have not had the need.

I use well water that is .3 ec for everything. Pete at CH9 seeds told me ro is no good for seeds or seedlings as the minerals in the water help the shell open more than filtered or distilled.

Don't know what is true now. O2, minerals, etc. lol.

But I am splitting the difference. I will put my old seeds in a wet coffee filter inside a baggie in the dark and keep temps stable at 77 degrees.

And I will put a few drops of h202 in the water I wet them with.

MichiganMedGrower said:

I do clones pretty much just like that too!

I thought the reason to cut from lower branches was the concentration of rooting hormones available lower down. Not sure which book I read that in. Maybe Jorje Cervantes.

Click to expand...

The N thing was in a class book
I can remember that shit like I was there yesterday. Now to remember someone's name I met yesterday......I gotta do the association game to remember - Of course if not caring was in order..... don't play the game.

MichiganMedGrower said:

I don't soak seeds either but I did the first 2 Grows. Greenhouse seed co specifies 12 hrs to soak in water before placing in a paper towel. Must show all steps to get guarantee.

I think that some harder shell seeds it may help but I have not had the need.

I use well water that is .3 ec for everything. Pete at CH9 seeds told me ro is no good for seeds or seedlings as the minerals in the water help the shell open more than filtered or distilled.

Don't know what is true now. O2, minerals, etc. lol.

But I am splitting the difference. I will put my old seeds in a wet coffee filter inside a baggie in the dark and keep temps stable at 77 degrees.

And I will put a few drops of h202 in the water I wet them with.

Click to expand...

Pete's right too! I think if I remember right. They help in the "wetting" and release of the seam....Good plan!

I go down to the cold water creek in back of the property and collect some of that. - still add a cpl of drops of H2o2...

Harden collected spawn for fishing in that creek too......mmm, now I know I'll have some smoked Steelhead for lunch....