Purps/BC Mango's

just got these a cpl days ago from bcseedking 100% germination outta the 5 of each i tried. These are the first QUAILTY seeds i've bought crossing my fingers

STRETCHING!!! get the lights low and burry them deeper if you can.

also am i not a fan of using drinkin cubs to grow in, to waterclone maybe but not to grow. it is a pain to get em of without ripping roots of and also lack they proper drainage holes in the bottom so the water gone sit and rot a way on your roots.

besides that, great germination rate

i've drilled 5 nice holes in the bottom of each. how low u suggest i put my 250 mh this early to them?? ty for your insight always welcome they were in rooter starter plugs first too btw

420101 said:

i've drilled 5 nice holes in the bottom of each.

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You spend a fortune on seeds, lights, nutrients etc, yet put your prized seedlings into crappy little plastic cups! Can't you afford a few bucks on some proper plant pots?

420101 said:

how low u suggest i put my 250 mh this early to them??

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At this stage the 250 MH should be around 4 feet away, no closer. Stretch is caused by lots of things - not just insufficient light.

i would rather use some floro tubes or CFLs at this stage then that hot 250W MH, you know. those floros can be moved right above those spruces as well as the CFLs, but tubs are even cooler then CFLs.

and sure, there are more reasons to stretching then insufficient light placement or light spectrum use in a grow, but those are the number one reasons always.

Hey buddy, so long as you have adequate drainage, you'll be fine. It sounds like you planned ahead and made some holes for drainage....great.

We all realize that these cups are a temporary home.

So far as light distance, before you can safely determine the light distance, you need to see if you have adequate ventilation, assuming that you do, I'd keep my light as clse as possible. Besides ventilation, do you use an oscilating fan?

In my opinion,4 feet is way too far away. I would not want to be more than 18" or even 24" away, at the very most. Moving it closer daily.
Peace

videoman40 said:

In my opinion,4 feet is way too far away. I would not want to be more than 18" or even 24" away, at the very most. Moving it closer daily.

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Videoman

Whilst you're perfectly entitled to hold your opinion, if you're going to do so in direct disagreement with one of mine you're going to have to come up with something a lot more substantive than 'that's my opinion'.

The more experienced growers here with good reputations for being helpful need to be doubly careful that the advice they offer less experienced growers is not only correct, but specific to the question being asked.

The problem here with your answer is that it's based on a rather simplistic 'rule of thumb' that you seem to have adpopted and that is that the closer the light is to the plants the faster they'll grow and 'plants can never have too much light'. In most situations apart from seedlings and clones those rules of thumb would apply, but not to seedlings I'm afraid.

Seedlings with their first set of cotyledon leaves are still using stored energy supplies and aren't even photosynthesising yet, so why do they need so much light? Too much light at this stage can actually stress and kill the delicate seedlings.

Seedlings and clones only need about 500 lumens per square foot for perfectly healthy growth to take place. A 250w MH will output somewhere around 18-23,000 lumens with HPS's more mid 20's. Even 18,000 lumens at 4 foot is outputting 18,000/4x4=1,125 lumens per square foot, which is already double the recommended 500.

Environment, temperatures, photoperiod, humidity, nutrient levels, planting density can all have an impact on the amount of stretch seen in seedlings - low light levels is only one cause and as long as the 500 lumens per square foot is adhered to shouldn't be the cause of stretch in seedlings.

As soon as the first and second pairs of real leaves appear then photosynthesis is starting to increase and the light should be lowered to give the young plants about 2,500-3,000 lumens at the plant tops. For a 250w MH, that would be 18,000/4= 4,500, 18,000/9 = 2,000, so about 2 1/2 feet away should be the optimum distance for early vegetative growth. As soon as 4 or 5 nodes have shown this can be lowered to about 2 feet away.

I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to have a 250w MH only 18 inches away from delicate seedlings.

Hey babygro...may I ask why you are so rude to videoman? That guy has helped out a lot, always answers questions, and is a great asset to this forum...could you lose the arrogant self righteous tone? -.I..(0-o)..I._

Shanti4life said:

Hey babygro...may I ask why you are so rude to videoman? That guy has helped out a lot, always answers questions, and is a great asset to this forum...could you lose the arrogant self righteous tone? -.I..(0-o)..I._

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Disagreeing with someones opinion isn't being rude to them.

If someone's got a piece of information that in my opinion is wrong, then I'll correct them with my reasons for why I think they're wrong - regardless of who they are. People then have two opinions to choose from.

Videoman is certainly helpful to the less knowledgeable members here - but let's not confuse being helpful with being knowledgeable - he's not right all the time, so follow his advice with caution.

Those hydro growers who followed his advice about molasses are all regretting having done so - let that be a warning. In fairness, that wasn't all down to Videoman, but as he championed Molasses use and brought it to everyone's attention he has to share some of the responsiblity for not adequately informing people that it should only be used in certain growing systems.

And I repeat what I said earlier - I do not advise ANYONE to have a 250w HPS or MH at 18 inches distance from newly germinated seedlings.

If you think he's right - go ahead and do it and see what happens.

Well I do stand by my advice baby.

First off the light in question is not an hps, he says he has a MH light, so when you give advice, make sure you realize what the poster is using for a light. So that you may offer advice specific to the question being asked.

There is a difference in lights. My recommended distances were pretty safe indeed. Personally I'd put it closer myself.

What hydro growers using my advice tyo use molasses? I've never once answered a hydro question, especially about molasses. Is this something you are just using, so that you can point a finger?

You wanna be a ganja guru, go do it. I could care less.

But you have no right to be pointing a finger at me about molasses. I clearly stated te benefits of using molasses, and how it benefited the soil.
That was all I said about molasses, and I stand by it, I still use it today.

It just seems so obvious that you cant help anyone without putting someone else down in the process. I guess that helps you feel big.
Good luck to you and your endavors.
Peace

videoman40 said:

First off the light in question is not an hps, he says he has a MH light, so when you give advice, make sure you realize what the poster is using for a light. So that you may offer advice specific to the question being asked.

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Perhaps if you actually bothered to READ what I wrote you'd have seen I referred specifically to a MH light, yes amazingly enough MH refers to Metal Halide -

babygro said:

Seedlings and clones only need about 500 lumens per square foot for perfectly healthy growth to take place. A 250w MH will output somewhere around 18-23,000 lumens with HPS's more mid 20's. Even 18,000 lumens at 4 foot is outputting 18,000/4x4=1,125 lumens per square foot, which is already double the recommended 500.

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And I did use the Metal Halide lumen output for my calculations, so as usual you're wrong again.

videoman40 said:

It just seems so obvious that you cant help anyone without putting someone else down in the process. I guess that helps you feel big.

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It's not about 'putting people down' it's about ensuring the correct advice and information is given. If you don't know the right advice to give - don't give any. No advice is better than bad advice, perhaps you might like to take that on board. Yes, you're not exempt from this, you don't know everything and you're not always right.

You don't have a particularly good track record for growing healthy plants, perhaps when you can get through a grow without killing any plants your advice here will contain a lot more credibility than it does at the moment, at least with those who's opinions actually matter.

Any fool can grow a weed, very few have the knowledge or know how to produce outstanding healthy high yielding plants. You can dazzle the newbie and inexperienced growers with your bullshit, the more experienced and knowledgeable growers here pay you little heed.

Play nice, I have seen you both give excellent advice and you both seem like nice fellas to me, and very knowledgeable. I guess sometimes people have different opinions...that's what makes this world go round. We're all here for the same thing...good times, good people and good advice. Grow on my friends

Metal halide from the get go. Even if I had one I probably wouldn't use it till I get a couple of sets of leaves. I love those compact flourescents and tube flourescents in the beginning. From what I hear the metal halides put out a fair amount of heat, so I would have to agree that putting them close would scare the hell out of me. I would wait on some advice from someone that has used metal halides during veg. I know myself and Videoman have not used metal halides during veg. I'm only going on what I've heard, but I believe Babygro hasn't used halides during veg either. Don't get this twisted, I'm not knocking anyone. My advice is to wait on more advice.

SmokerE said:

I'm only going on what I've heard, but I believe Babygro hasn't used halides during veg either. Don't get this twisted, I'm not knocking anyone. My advice is to wait on more advice.

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You don't have to be a rocket scientist to work out that you don't put a 250w MH (which outputs more heat and UVA and UVB than an equivalent wattage HPS) 18 inches away from recently sprouted seedlings.

I'm just about to get a 250w digital Lumatek ballast that runs both HPS and MH and I still wouldn't use the MH for veg, my 200w blue Envirolite does that job just fine.

I like those envirolites. Metal halides seem like a waste. Just my "opinion", not hating on metal halides. I just dont' want to mess up my plants trying something like them, when the flourescent kinds do all I need.

IF you dont want to read the novel replys you got heres the simple anwser. Yes your light is too far cause they are stretching (a little) If I was using your light I would have it at about 20-24 inches above right now and put it closer by the day. Also your plastic cups are perfectly fine with the drainage holes thats what I use on every plant from the start I dont care what anyone says bad about them, do you think a plant can acually tell that its in a "crappy pot", besides they will only be in there for a week or so anyways.

For you it seems, it is about putting people down. My grows are just fine, thanks for your concern though. If you truly believe what you say, maybe you shouldn't have advised him anything at all.

There is a big difference between knowledge and experience, an experienced grower would never have replied in the way that you have.
An experienced grower has the confidence to reply without having the feeling he has to prove himself, by forcing his opinion on others.

4 feet away for a 250 watt mh light is just too far away, you know it too.
Peace

babygro said:

Perhaps if you actually bothered to READ what I wrote you'd have seen I referred specifically to a MH light, yes amazingly enough MH refers to Metal Halide -



And I did use the Metal Halide lumen output for my calculations, so as usual you're wrong again.



It's not about 'putting people down' it's about ensuring the correct advice and information is given. If you don't know the right advice to give - don't give any. No advice is better than bad advice, perhaps you might like to take that on board. Yes, you're not exempt from this, you don't know everything and you're not always right.

You don't have a particularly good track record for growing healthy plants, perhaps when you can get through a grow without killing any plants your advice here will contain a lot more credibility than it does at the moment, at least with those who's opinions actually matter.

Any fool can grow a weed, very few have the knowledge or know how to produce outstanding healthy high yielding plants. You can dazzle the newbie and inexperienced growers with your bullshit, the more experienced and knowledgeable growers here pay you little heed.

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I would just let them stretch for now, its not that big of a deal. After they get a bit more developed, you could turn that stretch into roots with some roothormones and a razar, or you could simply bury it up.

Its not that big of a deal really, just do what you feel comfortable with.


Videomans post about molasses got me some pretty tasty white, and purple widow. Still curing.
<3

Hey Roseman I learned a lot from ya. I love your videos and you seem to know what you are doing, have good weekend...I should be getting my bubbleponics system soon...thanks 2 you...wish me luck. I'm an old outdoor grower but we'll see how I fare at this indoor stuff..heh heh

i dont know, i had seens from bcseedking before and they were bunk. i ordered 2 indica strain and when i grew them like 3 ft tall they have long leaves like sativas and it doesn't even look like a healthy plant. i germed 10 seeds and got like 2 female but they look like crap not even healthy so i disposed of them and got something else. I did this because i needed healthy moms. I was skiptical of them because of another board there we're plenty reviews of them being scam or something so i dont really know.