Question for Republican Tokers

skunky33 · Dec 3, 2009

It's obvious that marijuana laws are usually party line votes with liberals on the side of legalization, decriminalization, and, medical mj. Conservatives on the side of authoritarian policies and mandatory prison sentences for even casual grow and use. Keep in mind that democratic does not automatically mean liberal Bill Clinton was not socially liberal (his social views deviate little from GW Bush in reference to law) But republican almost always means socially conservative. Federally, conservatives started the "War on Drugs" Newt Gingrich wanted to put people to death for 2 ounces of marijuana, in which he had 26 republican supporters. All republican presidents wanted to federally control states with mandatory sentences and give the DEA more power for search and seizure of private property, offered federal mandatory sentences. Even when conservatives shout "state rights", federal laws taking away states rights of authoritarian law enforcement nature are almost always generated, voted in, and supported by republicans.

Obama and Carter were the only presidents to actually be pro state rights on the issue of mj and many others.

It seems as though conservatives only state what liberals might do, or are going to do. But have no actual evidence of laws passed that give their arguements any validity. While on the other hand, we see authoritarian aggression with millions of Americans homes siezed, families torn apart, and ridiculous prison sentences put into law and supported by conservatives.
Sarah Palin in her last year as governor tried to change Alaska's liberal MJ laws to an authoritarian search and destroy policy. It is opposite of what she tried as mayor to legalize mj for adults in their own homes (before she started taking direction from the RNC)

So my question is- How exactly have conservatives given you less restrictive rights in the last 40 years? and how are liberals taking your rights away, state actual laws passed in which give the DEA and law inforcement more federal power.

REMEMBER STATE ACTUAL LAWS THAT GIVE DEA AND LAW ENFORCEMENT MORE POWER BY LIBERALS.

Being a conservative republican on a pro cannabis forum is like being an inter racially married KKK member in a reggae forum. Your either misinformed or stupid..

MuyLocoNC · Dec 3, 2009

You have some valid points, however you neglect the political reality of most of the "conservatives" on this forum.

A great many of us have long ago registered Independent or Libertarian. While we may be "Fiscal Conservatives" and do want the freedoms our founders provided us with protected, we disagree with the Republicans on many issues. I myself, am for abortion (except the late term stuff), desperately want legalization and am a vocal Anti-theist. Atheism doesn't begin to address my repugnance of religion.

However, the Democrat party has been hijacked by pure Statists and radical Progressives. While they may favor legalization, the rest of their agenda is so far from what I can stomach (card check, fairness doctrine, immigration reform, health care, cap n trade, stimulus) to name just a few, that I could NEVER support their candidate.

The question you are asking us, and one I've asked myself many times... Is legalizing the plant I crave, worth destroying the country I love? The answer is a resounding "NO". Hope that helps you understand.

jersey boi · Dec 3, 2009

conservativez == hypocrites

jersey boi · Dec 3, 2009

itz against da code of honor 4 memberz of da moral majority 2 grow weed. if their conservative brotherz find out therez illegal drug growerz n userz in their rankz theyll be disowned from da gop faster than larry craig.

jersey boi · Dec 3, 2009

MuyLocoNC · Dec 3, 2009

Great the troll is back, I thought this idiot got banned. 3 posts in a row and every one of them makes you look like an idiot... that's a true dedication to stupidity on your part.

jamesrock · Dec 4, 2009

Being a conservative republican on a pro cannabis forum is like being an inter racially married KKK member in a reggae forum. Your either misinformed or stupid..[/QUOTE said:
I really try not to get involved with the political threads but its just this kind of talk that really shows the worst of the two party system. Am I supposed to believe that you hold some sort of moral high ground over the right because your a dem or lib.
Left right conserve lib its all bad and you all have your agendas and Middle of the road people try to make sense of all the bullshit. Special interest and radical judges are really fucking this country up.
jmo

jamesrock · Dec 4, 2009

I went back and reread what i wrote and wanted to point out that i wasnt directing that stuff at skunky personally just the whole left / right conserv/ lib divide in the country. Peace skunky

OregonMeds · Dec 4, 2009

So by your own admission MuyLoco you will vote in even more delusional crackpots in the future who think god is on their side and might continue to dig us towards world war 3 with shitty foreign policies based on greed rather than overall good? And you'll do this because of your own greed as well, and proudly state so in defense of the party.

And you think this is a wise strategy? I think it's very short sighted, it doesn't matter how much extra you can stash away if you are truly successful you would still be successful under either administration but only one is likely stupid enough to get us all killed some day.

oh and yes I wish this two party crap would go away.

MexicanWarlord420 · Dec 4, 2009

MuyLocoNC said:
You have some valid points, however you neglect the political reality of most of the "conservatives" on this forum.

A great many of us have long ago registered Independent or Libertarian. While we may be "Fiscal Conservatives"

Those same "fiscal conservatives" are also birthers, deathers, teabaggers, and extremist bigots.

Keenly · Dec 4, 2009

MexicanWarlord420 said:
Those same "fiscal conservatives" are also birthers, deathers, teabaggers, and extremist bigots.

typical left right bullshit

pull your head out of the sand and wake up to the fact that left right is all a ploy to keep us fighting over our own enslavement

MuyLocoNC · Dec 4, 2009

OregonMeds said:
So by your own admission MuyLoco you will vote in even more delusional crackpots in the future who think god is on their side and might continue to dig us towards world war 3 with shitty foreign policies based on greed rather than overall good? And you'll do this because of your own greed as well, and proudly state so in defense of the party.

And you think this is a wise strategy? I think it's very short sighted, it doesn't matter how much extra you can stash away if you are truly successful you would still be successful under either administration but only one is likely stupid enough to get us all killed some day.

oh and yes I wish this two party crap would go away.

Well, to be honest, I voted for Ron Paul last fall. I didn't agree with some of his foreign policy stances at the time, but I agreed with almost EVERYTHING else he stood for. So, to answer your first point, No, I'm not voting for religious nuts in the future.

As to the whole world war point, and I understand your point of view based on your feelings and interpretation of what you see, however, I couldn't disagree with you more. I think this administration is setting the stage, through it's feeble and apologetic tone, for a tragedy of epic proportions. My hope is that Israel will say "fuck you and your suicidal, flaccid sanctions" to us and bomb Iran back to the Paleolithic era.

I know that doesn't register well with you, but I'm a firm believer that there are times you have to remind people who's still the big dog on the block. Yeah, you try to reason with them first, but you TAKE THEM AT THEIR LEADERS' WORD, if they insist on being a threat and maybe they actually kill some of your citizens... well then it's time to go ROMAN on them, no apologies, no bullshit restrictions on the military... wholesale carnage. Put enough fear in them that they won't stick their heads out of the bomb craters they'll be calling home for the next twenty years. Then you pack up your shit and bring the warriors home. It's quick, it's simple, it's effective and it's affordable.

As to greed, don't bother. I've seen your posts and I know where you're coming from on that subject. What you label greed, I call the heart of this economy. Pure, unfettered capitalism. Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. I want a flat tax, guy making 20k a year pays the same percentage as the guy making 2 million. I'm not rich, but I sure as hell earned what I have and no one has a right to redistribute it... NO ONE. The Repubs are almost as bad as the Dems when it comes to overspending money that isn't theirs, so don't think I'm all giddy for them either. But I will support the lesser of two evils, hopefully it will give us time to get an organized third party into power.

Audit the FED. These traitors gave away 5 trillion under Tarp and when asked who got it, they told the boys on the hill to fuck off.

MuyLocoNC · Dec 4, 2009

Double post...sorry. Warlord would you like to offer a thought that DIDN'T originate from MoveOn.org, MediaMatters or the Huffington Post? Or would you prefer to keep making your posts even more inconsequential and easy to ignore?

OregonMeds · Dec 4, 2009

MuyLocoNC said:
Well, to be honest, I voted for Ron Paul last fall. I didn't agree with some of his foreign policy stances at the time, but I agreed with almost EVERYTHING else he stood for. So, to answer your first point, No, I'm not voting for religious nuts in the future.

Oh ok thank you.

As to the whole world war point, and I understand your point of view based on your feelings and interpretation of what you see, however, I couldn't disagree with you more. I think this administration is setting the stage, through it's feeble and apologetic tone, for a tragedy of epic proportions. My hope is that Israel will say "fuck you and your suicidal, flaccid sanctions" to us and bomb Iran back to the Paleolithic era.

Oh boy so we don't agree on anything Israel, that's for sure.

I know that doesn't register well with you, but I'm a firm believer that there are times you have to remind people who's still the big dog on the block.

Old fashioned republican stance, not even applicable today.

Yeah, you try to reason with them first, but you TAKE THEM AT THEIR LEADERS' WORD, if they insist on being a threat and maybe they actually kill some of your citizens... well then it's time to go ROMAN on them, no apologies, no bullshit restrictions on the military... wholesale carnage. Put enough fear in them that they won't stick their heads out of the bomb craters they'll be calling home for the next twenty years. Then you pack up your shit and bring the warriors home. It's quick, it's simple, it's effective and it's affordable.

Oh boy...

As to greed, don't bother. I've seen your posts and I know where you're coming from on that subject. What you label greed, I call the heart of this economy. Pure, unfettered capitalism. Greed, for lack of a better word, is good.

Yes you too can be a slave to another Enron and lay the foundation for another economic meltdown with no regulations.

I want a flat tax, guy making 20k a year pays the same percentage as the guy making 2 million. I'm not rich, but I sure as hell earned what I have and no one has a right to redistribute it... NO ONE.

I agree on flat tax, except add no way out of it no deductions. But you just sort of contradicted yourself by saying noone has a right to redistribute what you earn but they do I guess if it's a flat tax and if it's for things you want like roads just not schools or schools just not fire stations or just not hospitals or just not health care? My way of thinking gets all the things I want extra for the same amount of money we all spend already NO MORE OUT OF YOUR PAYCHECK OR MINE OVERALL! In general what people pay now is more than it would be if we all had national health care, and there is no reason all things we touch must fail as they claim for why it just wouldn't work.

The Repubs are almost as bad as the Dems when it comes to overspending money that isn't theirs, so don't think I'm all giddy for them either. But I will support the lesser of two evils, hopefully it will give us time to get an organized third party into power.

I don't want more spending either...

Audit the FED. These traitors gave away 5 trillion under Tarp and when asked who got it, they told the boys on the hill to fuck off.

I answered some in the text above.

MuyLocoNC · Dec 4, 2009

OregonMeds said:
I answered some in the text above.

Read and noted. While I don't share your optimism on the health care issue, I certainly think we're going to be giving it a try for a while. I hope you're right and I'm wrong, I really do. I was more than a little put off by Obama's aid announcing we won't see any improvement in our health care situation for a decade or two.

It's also hard for me to get too worked up over Enron anymore. Their fraud cost about 37 billion dollars, no small sum to be sure, but compared to the government sanctioned fraud of today, it's peanuts. There's no question we need regulations for blatant fraud, the problem with the government in charge of business is any mistakes are Titanic by comparison. Friendly corporations, industries, unions and so on, get paid off, but when the facts are disclosed, no one goes to jail, unlike Enron. Barney Frank and Dodd should be rotting in a jail cell for their role in the Freddie/Fannie debacle.

Rob Roy · Dec 4, 2009

It is hypcritical to preach freedom and follow the party lines of EITHER the present Democrat or Republican party.

We have a dominant two party system, both want to control people's life, liberty and property. I politely submit this...Fuck them both. Next.

OregonMeds · Dec 4, 2009

MuyLocoNC said:
Read and noted. While I don't share your optimism on the health care issue, I certainly think we're going to be giving it a try for a while. I hope you're right and I'm wrong, I really do. I was more than a little put off by Obama's aid announcing we won't see any improvement in our health care situation for a decade or two.

It's also hard for me to get too worked up over Enron anymore. Their fraud cost about 37 billion dollars, no small sum to be sure, but compared to the government sanctioned fraud of today, it's peanuts. There's no question we need regulations for blatant fraud, the problem with the government in charge of business is any mistakes are Titanic by comparison. Friendly corporations, industries, unions and so on, get paid off, but when the facts are disclosed, no one goes to jail, unlike Enron. Barney Frank and Dodd should be rotting in a jail cell for their role in the Freddie/Fannie debacle.

Just because the recent stuff makes enron pale in comparison doesn't mean we should at all forget it though, because it will happen again and again and it's just one example of why unregulated capitalism just doesn't work for certain areas.

Electric, water, sewer we are all stuck with monopolies there is just no way to run the infrastructure to double up or more to give people options which is the only way a free market works well for the consumer, so given no regulation they'll fuck you and have fucked us, and will fuck us again. Why bend over for that stuff willingly? Regulate them at least, but better yet they should just be government services would be my preference. Take even the option of profit away so we can all just pay less.

Banks must be regulated or do I need to argue that? I wouldn't want them socialized though because banks aren't monopolies so people have choices.

I hope you can see the difference in my stance vs communism. I'm all for capitolism and never want to see it go away other than certain areas.

I'd damn sure never want a Public Roads Corporation charging me whatever it wanted to drive anywhere.

skunky33 · Dec 4, 2009

MuyLocoNC said:
You have some valid points, however you neglect the political reality of most of the "conservatives" on this forum.

A great many of us have long ago registered Independent or Libertarian. While we may be "Fiscal Conservatives" and do want the freedoms our founders provided us with protected, we disagree with the Republicans on many issues. I myself, am for abortion (except the late term stuff), desperately want legalization and am a vocal Anti-theist. Atheism doesn't begin to address my repugnance of religion.

However, the Democrat party has been hijacked by pure Statists and radical Progressives. While they may favor legalization, the rest of their agenda is so far from what I can stomach (card check, fairness doctrine, immigration reform, health care, cap n trade, stimulus) to name just a few, that I could NEVER support their candidate.

The question you are asking us, and one I've asked myself many times... Is legalizing the plant I crave, worth destroying the country I love? The answer is a resounding "NO". Hope that helps you understand.

I understand your stance on some issue's but health care reform? I don't see how giving people health care will "destroy the country" That's what they said about medicare and medicaid and those are some of the most popular programs in history if they were not around millions of older people would suffer and die horrible deaths. fairness doctrine was shut down 87-11 by rep and dems. So really whats your arguement? Card check that's been around since 1935..lol I see problems with cap and trade but "destroying America?" sounds like Glenn "the end is near" Beck. Again, I can understand not agreeing with policies. But it's been blown so out of proportion by psychic pundits who promote scenarios as reality. What meaning of "statist" do you mean? You mean government affairs in economics or fascism. The first has been around for awhile, the second is fascism which is a pretty far fetched arguement as of now and an over used term from the 50's.

Rob Roy · Dec 4, 2009

skunky33 said:
I understand your stance on some issue's but health care reform? I don't see how giving people health care will "destroy the country" That's what they said about medicare and medicaid and those are some of the most popular programs in history if they were not around millions of older people would suffer and die horrible deaths. fairness doctrine was shut down 87-11 by rep and dems. So really whats your arguement? Card check that's been around since 1935..lol I see problems with cap and trade but "destroying America?" sounds like Glenn "the end is near" Beck. Again, I can understand not agreeing with policies. But it's been blown so out of proportion by psychic pundits who promote scenarios as reality. What meaning of "statist" do you mean? You mean government affairs in economics or fascism. The first has been around for awhile, the second is fascism which is a pretty far fetched arguement as of now and an over used term from the 50's.

...and who will pay for this healthcare that is to be "given"?

...and what will happen in this "free country" if somebody decides not to participate?

skunky33 · Dec 4, 2009

jamesrock said:
I really try not to get involved with the political threads but its just this kind of talk that really shows the worst of the two party system. Am I supposed to believe that you hold some sort of moral high ground over the right because your a dem or lib.
Left right conserve lib its all bad and you all have your agendas and Middle of the road people try to make sense of all the bullshit. Special interest and radical judges are really fucking this country up.
jmo

I don't toll any party line. But to support people who want to throw you in prison is Darwinism at work. I don't hold any high moral ground. If you smoke and are a conservative republican who the hell do you vote for??? really. I'm not saying being conservative on issue's is even wrong. I'm a hunter. I have tons of fairly conservative and liberal friends. I'm more of a true libertarian than anything. The problem with libertarians now a day's is that social conservatives have high jacked that term because they didn't want to be associated with Bush and now have integrated their republican ideology and voting to only republicans. I only know any libertarians anymore that vote socially liberal.

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