Reverse Engineering everyone's nutrients

klx

klx

Well-Known Member
Yeah I reuse it but I was wondering if I can use it when mixing up my A and B concentrated solutions
 
MisterBlah

MisterBlah

Well-Known Member
klx said:
Hey MisterBlah, could I use the water out of the dehumidifier instead of buying distilled water?
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Yes, but...

Water that comes out of a dehumidifier is practically pure, but you run the risk of dealing with Legionella bacteria, which causes Legionnaires' disease, basically pneumonia. This is why condensate from air handlers and dehumidifiers in HVAC systems are sent down the drain instead of reused. It's a code requirement, IIRC.

So, in order to use it, you will want to treat it with chlorine. I recommend a solution of sodium hypochlorite, which is often sold as hypochlorus acid, or household bleach. I also recommend using that in general. Read this article here for information and concentrations for creating your own: http://scienceinhydroponics.com/2009/02/disinfecting-your-hydroponic-solution-with-hypochlorite.html

You'll want to make a solution that is like 1-5ppm of chloride and then just make your stock solutions after that.
 
klx

klx

Well-Known Member
MisterBlah said:
Yes, but...

Water that comes out of a dehumidifier is practically pure, but you run the risk of dealing with Legionella bacteria, which causes Legionnaires' disease, basically pneumonia. This is why condensate from air handlers and dehumidifiers in HVAC systems are sent down the drain instead of reused. It's a code requirement, IIRC.

So, in order to use it, you will want to treat it with chlorine. I recommend a solution of sodium hypochlorite, which is often sold as hypochlorus acid, or household bleach. I also recommend using that in general. Read this article here for information and concentrations for creating your own: http://scienceinhydroponics.com/2009/02/disinfecting-your-hydroponic-solution-with-hypochlorite.html

You'll want to make a solution that is like 1-5ppm of chloride and then just make your stock solutions after that.
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Sweet. Cheers mate!
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
Anyone got a break down for bloom boosters with NPK of 0-39-25? This used to be the old Bud Blood but still is in Grotek Bloosom Blaster, Rambridge Bud Blood, etc...

Most just list MKP as derived from but obviously something else in it.

Eit. I also belive they have gibberellic acid in it too.
 
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ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
CannaReview said:
Anyone got a break down for bloom boosters with NPK of 0-39-25? This used to be the old Bud Blood but still is in Grotek Bloosom Blaster, Rambridge Bud Blood, etc...

Most just list MKP as derived from but obviously something else in it.
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Yeah, MKP and a filler, lol Notice the ratio between the components is the same, they just put something else in there to dilute it. Nothing wrong with MKP when used in careful accordance with its potency.
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
Yeah, MKP and a filler, lol Notice the ratio between the components is the same, they just put something else in there to dilute it. Nothing wrong with MKP when used in careful accordance with its potency.
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Well I use MKP for one of my own products Basically MPK 905 grams and 105 of MAP. Sell 1kg for $35 which is below cost of what I pay for 500G Monster Bloom. If anyone can get me the recipe for 0-39-25 I'll make it (have tons of raw salts in my shop) and sell it to RIU members cheap.

This is what I do in my shop.

PH UP - 45% Potassium Hydroxide bottle it down from a 55gal barell.
PH DOWN - 75% food grade Phosphoric Acid, comes in 20L pails and bottle it down.
Carb Booster - Dextrose package it up and sell it at other brands wholesale price
Silicate - Kasil #5 break it down. its thick as shit. The NPK is 0-0-13 from what I calculated. I don't have the si ppm on hand.
Bloom Booster - MKP+MAP
Late Bloom Booster - Potassium Chloride 0-0-62 same a GP Dense and Dr K
Peroxide - 29% Peroxide. I have a permit to sell 35% but then have to take names when I sell it. CDN gov is worried about terrorist.
Calcium Peroxide - soil oxygenator same as AN old Soilox. Nutrilife Tripple 0, etc...GP CalOx.
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
C

churchhaze

Well-Known Member
CannaReview said:
Check out Bud Blaster http://www.supernaturalbrand.com/wp-content/uploads/TOPRINT_BudBlaster_1-52-31.pdf

Ingredients
MKP 0-52-34
DAP 18-46-0
MAP 11-52-0
Super Phosphate - Monocalcium phosphate

The label says 1-52-31 http://www.supernaturalbrand.com/wp-content/uploads/TOPRINT_BudBlaster_1-52-31.pdf

So the DAP/MAP/Super Phosphate amounts are tiny vs MAP

if someone can get me a break down I'll make some up and could send out to Canadian RIU users to test out.
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With an NPK of 1-52-31, it's obvious those other chemicals are more of a distraction to make it seem more complicated than it really is. That product is basically just MKP. There's no point in trying to recreate it.
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
churchhaze said:
With an NPK of 1-52-31, it's obvious those other chemicals are more of a distraction to make it seem more complicated than it really is. That product is basically just MKP. There's no point in trying to recreate it.
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You be surprised why people will buy one product over the other even if they are both 99% the same main chemical.
 
MisterBlah

MisterBlah

Well-Known Member
CannaReview said:
Check out Bud Blaster http://www.supernaturalbrand.com/wp-content/uploads/TOPRINT_BudBlaster_1-52-31.pdf

Ingredients
MKP 0-52-34
DAP 18-46-0
MAP 11-52-0
Super Phosphate - Monocalcium phosphate

The label says 1-52-31 http://www.supernaturalbrand.com/wp-content/uploads/TOPRINT_BudBlaster_1-52-31.pdf

So the DAP/MAP/Super Phosphate amounts are tiny vs MAP

if someone can get me a break down I'll make some up and could send out to Canadian RIU users to test out.
Click to expand...
Just for everyone's information: Triple Super Phosphate(TSP) is another name for MonoCalcium Phosphate.

Based on the labeling requirements and their list of ingredients, you won't be able to figure it out without a lab analysis. This is a prime example of adding ingredients with the deliberate intention of obfuscating the product. They do not need DAP to create this product. And their use of triple superphosphate is low enough that they don't have to label calcium.

That being said, just use MKP instead. It's just easier. Use a Calcium Nitrate as your calcium source. And don't mix them in the same stock solution. You will get Di- and Tri-Calcium Phosphates to precipitate out of solution.

If you are going to make a stock solution of ANY of the above, then your solubility limits are as follows, @ 20°C:

MKP: 230 g/L
MAP: 374 g/L
DKP: 1600 g/L
DAP: 689 g/L
MonoCalcium Phosphate: 18 g/L
Calcium Nitrate: 1290 g/L

If you just want more info on fertilizer solubility/compatibility: https://www.open-salt.com/fertilizer-solubility/
If you want more on all compounds solubility: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solubility_table
 
MisterBlah

MisterBlah

Well-Known Member
CannaReview said:
You be surprised why people will buy one product over the other even if they are both 99% the same main chemical.
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At 99% similarity, I can think of a few things that will make me buy one over another. Though, none of these things are fertilizer.

But 100% similarity, which is what I'm trying to show with all of this, it makes no sense to hold onto brand loyalty. Hell, brand loyalty is pointless, regardless.

CannaReview said:
Well I use MKP for one of my own products Basically MPK 905 grams and 105 of MAP. Sell 1kg for $35 which is below cost of what I pay for 500G Monster Bloom. If anyone can get me the recipe for 0-39-25 I'll make it (have tons of raw salts in my shop) and sell it to RIU members cheap.
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1kG of MKP or MAP for $35? That's ridiculous. I can buy 25kg for $55. If I repackage it and sell at 1kg packages, it's like $7.
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
MisterBlah said:
Just for everyone's information: Triple Super Phosphate(TSP) is another name for MonoCalcium Phosphate.

Based on the labeling requirements and their list of ingredients, you won't be able to figure it out without a lab analysis. This is a prime example of adding ingredients with the deliberate intention of obfuscating the product. They do not need DAP to create this product. And their use of triple superphosphate is low enough that they don't have to label calcium.

That being said, just use MKP instead. It's just easier. Use a Calcium Nitrate as your calcium source. And don't mix them in the same stock solution. You will get Di- and Tri-Calcium Phosphates to precipitate out of solution.

If you are going to make a stock solution of ANY of the above, then your solubility limits are as follows, @ 20°C:

MKP: 230 g/L
MAP: 374 g/L
DKP: 1600 g/L
DAP: 689 g/L
MonoCalcium Phosphate: 18 g/L
Calcium Nitrate: 1290 g/L

If you just want more info on fertilizer solubility/compatibility: https://www.open-salt.com/fertilizer-solubility/
If you want more on all compounds solubility: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solubility_table
Click to expand...
I'm looking for a final product in dry salts. I guess with the DAP and MAP only raising the N to 1 that's max of say 30 or 100g of MAP or DAP. and Super Phosphate probably tiny amount. Problem is people will a lot of times not buy a product if the ingredients are not the same. When I gave people MPK as a bloom booster they didn't belive it would work as good as Bud Balster. I had to add MAP to make it look more complicated. Some didn't see any different results of BB vs my stuff but some still went back to paying $225 for 2.3 KG of BB vs $50 for 2 kg of MKP.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
MisterBlah said:
Just for everyone's information: Triple Super Phosphate(TSP) is another name for MonoCalcium Phosphate.

Based on the labeling requirements and their list of ingredients, you won't be able to figure it out without a lab analysis. This is a prime example of adding ingredients with the deliberate intention of obfuscating the product. They do not need DAP to create this product. And their use of triple superphosphate is low enough that they don't have to label calcium.

That being said, just use MKP instead. It's just easier. Use a Calcium Nitrate as your calcium source. And don't mix them in the same stock solution. You will get Di- and Tri-Calcium Phosphates to precipitate out of solution.

If you are going to make a stock solution of ANY of the above, then your solubility limits are as follows, @ 20°C:

MKP: 230 g/L
MAP: 374 g/L
DKP: 1600 g/L
DAP: 689 g/L
MonoCalcium Phosphate: 18 g/L
Calcium Nitrate: 1290 g/L

If you just want more info on fertilizer solubility/compatibility: https://www.open-salt.com/fertilizer-solubility/
If you want more on all compounds solubility: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solubility_table
Click to expand...
:clap: Thanks for those solubility numbers!

Tells me that even my stock solutions aren't too concentrated, that's fine with me.
 
C

CannaReview

Well-Known Member
MisterBlah said:
At 99% similarity, I can think of a few things that will make me buy one over another. Though, none of these things are fertilizer.

But 100% similarity, which is what I'm trying to show with all of this, it makes no sense to hold onto brand loyalty. Hell, brand loyalty is pointless, regardless.



1kG of MKP or MAP for $35? That's ridiculous. I can buy 25kg for $55. If I repackage it and sell at 1kg packages, it's like $7.
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Well is sell 1kg of MKP/MAP for $35 or so. It costs me about $30 for 500G of Grotek Monster Bloom.
 
since1991

since1991

Well-Known Member
Anyone read the book Hydroponic Food Production by Howard Resh? Its a little outdated but loaded with valuable info regarding making stock solutions. A very good read. Lots of pages. I bougjt mine years ago and i still find useful info in it.
 
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