Soiless medium considered hydro or soil?

bravedave said:

Funny, I have been here for 2 years and never been asked my roots and now twice in one thread. Yes and not so distantly related to the pictured.

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Just curious. So which Nation?

bravedave said:

That's right. Why settle on just Promix HP and Tub of Jack's Citrus when you can simplify and russle up some
fox farm ocean forest soil
red worm castings
Happy frog
Kelp
Potters Gold
dolomite
bone meal
azomite
rock phosphate
Bloom bat guano
Molasses
blood meal and maybe
humic acid

And after the newb mixes this together and plants his/her clones he/she can get down to work on their tea recipe.
Yeah, much easier. Lol

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Well im pretty sure organic growing doesnt need all the things you listed dave. Some roots organic soil and some organic two part feed is all you need to grow some good quality bud. Well maybe some calmag, and maybe some molasses and bennies. But molasses and mycorrhizae arent really hard to figure out, neither is calmag.

I mean if youve been telling organic growers to build super soil vs. take the easy route then i can see how people youve been teaching to grow would have problems. My simplest route to success for a new grower is to get a two part food, organic soil and some pearlite, and calmag. Then let the plant and light do all the work.

Soiless growing needs closer attention paid to ph, constant feeding, more water flushes to leach salt buildup, ppm or ec readings more often and meters for both, the addition of more calcium and magnesium more frequently(most organic soils sold are ammended with lime and oyster shell to make it easier for the grower), and usually more frequent watering which i might add needs to have food added every time and ph adjusting. So to me and id say the majority of other people, a soil grow is easier for a beginner because of the simplicity and cost effectiveness.

I dunno dave. You seem to have lost the argument of the thread topic and now you've deviated to debating a side arguement where you pick a line of text from a quote and challange it, even if theres no relevance to the topic at hand. And yet again youve decided to go against the popular vote on this one. Theres a consensus amongst seasoned growers that for a beginner, a soil grow is the safest bet. Are you not in the loop on this one, or have you been told that soiless mixes or coco are easier for beginers? Or is that just your opinion?

Alienwidow said:

Potato potahto. Im sure all our systems work well. The point of the thread isnt how well we can all grow, its the question, is soiless hydro? Im pretty sure that ive explained that soiless peat mixes arent hydro. Coco is the closest to hydro but still not hydro. And coco chunk can very well be hydro when used in an ebb system or drain to waste. If theres no objections i think we can put this dead horse to rest.

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I believe hempy bucket with perlite is passive hydro. Never grown with coco.

GrowUrOwnDank said:

I believe hempy bucket with perlite is passive hydro. Never grown with coco.

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Ya thats just like growing in hydroton balls right? Water goes in and comes right out. Theres no real fertilizer or water retentive qualities to pearlite so yes, id say hydro, like a flood and drain table that doesnt recirculate. Roots grow in water, and air, and moisture leftover from the "ebbs".
Coco is pretty much on par with peat in most of the ways it behaves.

Alienwidow said:

Well im pretty sure organic growing doesnt need all the things you listed dave. Some roots organic soil and some organic two part feed is all you need to grow some good quality bud. Well maybe some calmag, and maybe some molasses and bennies. But molasses and mycorrhizae arent really hard to figure out, neither is calmag.

I mean if youve been telling organic growers to build super soil vs. take the easy route then i can see how people youve been teaching to grow would have problems. My simplest route to success for a new grower is to get a two part food, organic soil and some pearlite, and calmag. Then let the plant and light do all the work.

Soiless growing needs closer attention paid to ph, constant feeding, more water flushes to leach salt buildup, ppm or ec readings more often and meters for both, the addition of more calcium and magnesium more frequently(most organic soils sold are ammended with lime and oyster shell to make it easier for the grower), and usually more frequent watering which i might add needs to have food added every time and ph adjusting. So to me and id say the majority of other people, a soil grow is easier for a beginner because of the simplicity and cost effectiveness.

I dunno dave. You seem to have lost the argument of the thread topic and now you've deviated to debating a side arguement where you pick a line of text from a quote and challange it, even if theres no relevance to the topic at hand. And yet again youve decided to go against the popular vote on this one. Theres a consensus amongst seasoned growers that for a beginner, a soil grow is the safest bet. Are you not in the loop on this one, or have you been told that soiless mixes or coco are easier for beginers? Or is that just your opinion?

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ManOMan you carry a butthurt a long way. Richy, you can write as many book length posts trying to impress and claim victory all you want ...or here invent a consensus and a vote that did not happen...but you have to ask yourself why changing my opinion means so much to you. You failed there again, btw.

I have PHed once in 2 years and that was PHing the water after I switched from RO to a natural spring. Promix HP buffers things nicely. You may struggle with PH, I don't. I also water to runoff, pouring it off, every water. You may struggle with salt buildup, I don't. Also watering with Promix is simple. Great drainage and consistent. Almost impossible to screw up unless you forget to do it. You may struggle with watering, I don't.
I can grow a lb on $25 (not counting power and equip.). I find that pretty cost effective. You may struggle keeping your costs down, but I don't. Maybe you need to buy less product with cartoons on the bottle, but then again you are a fucking cartoon.

Tangerine_ said:

Just curious. So which Nation?

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Are you native? You are curious, but not really curious enough to gather the above from my first answer.

Never said Hempy bucket(perlite) was full blown hydro. But, I do understand why they call it passive hydro. Even the perlite doesn't really absorb the nutrients. And the hempy bucket does have a reservoir at the bottom. I've actually tried full blown hydro and have a RDWC. I just don't like to adjust ph all the time. I'm lazy like that. So I just went back to soil. It's all good. I'm sure y'all probably are better growers whatever method you all use.

Pig4buzz said:

Is this a tent? Nice crop!

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nope its not a tent......its a staircase! I finished out the storage area under a staircase. Insulated, drywalled, wired and ducted. Its not ideal but i made use of wasted space and its relatively hidden and quiet.

selfmedicator462 said:

nope its not a tent......its a staircase! I finished out the storage area under a staircase. Insulated, drywalled, wired and ducted. Its not ideal but i made use of wasted space and its relatively hidden and quiet.

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Very Nice and thanks for letting me hang out in your thread!
Thank you also for your service.

bravedave said:

Are you native? You are curious, but not really curious enough to gather the above from my first answer.

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WTF is that suppose to mean? Your first "answer"? What answer? You never answered anyone directly when asked what "tribe" or Nation? Didn't realize this was something so difficult for you.*shrugs* My bad. With your username and avatar I assumed it was something you were very proud of.

bravedave said:

ManOMan you carry a butthurt a long way. Richy, you can write as many book length posts trying to impress and claim victory all you want ...or here invent a consensus and a vote that did not happen...but you have to ask yourself why changing my opinion means so much to you. You failed there again, btw.

I have PHed once in 2 years and that was PHing the water after I switched from RO to a natural spring. Promix HP buffers things nicely. You may struggle with PH, I don't. I also water to runoff, pouring it off, every water. You may struggle with salt buildup, I don't. Also watering with Promix is simple. Great drainage and consistent. Almost impossible to screw up unless you forget to do it. You may struggle with watering, I don't.
I can grow a lb on $25 (not counting power and equip.). I find that pretty cost effective. You may struggle keeping your costs down, but I don't. Maybe you need to buy less product with cartoons on the bottle, but then again you are a fucking cartoon.

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Ya ok dave. Youre right. All of your wild theories can be true in your own mind if you want them to be. Now run along and go play with your 25 dollar grow.

Hey did you ever replace that MH that you were using for your flower room that was two or three years old? You did know that MH degrades way faster in quality than hps so they need to be switched out more often right?

GrowUrOwnDank said:

Never said Hempy bucket(perlite) was full blown hydro. But, I do understand why they call it passive hydro. Even the perlite doesn't really absorb the nutrients. And the hempy bucket does have a reservoir at the bottom. I've actually tried full blown hydro and have a RDWC. I just don't like to adjust ph all the time. I'm lazy like that. So I just went back to soil. It's all good. I'm sure y'all probably are better growers whatever method you all use.

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Ive done dwc and never adjusted ph before. It turned out great. I didnt have any deficiancies show up except a mag def in flower because i wasnt running calmag. It was my first grow long time ago. I kept track of ph and it would only climb to 8 in two weeks but i never fiddled with trying to keep it stable. Dwc was my favorite method ive used by far. Its just a lot of work. Great production though.

Oh and a great grower is someone that gets better every grow and never stops learning. If you dont agree with popular theory do your own tests and test the theory. Do side by sides and dont be afraid to tinker to learn. All the results go up in smoke anyway so no worries. Most of the time the mob is correct with the theories, were not reinventing the wheel here. People have been cultivating cannabis indoors since prohibition started.

Alienwidow said:

Ive done dwc and never adjusted ph before. It turned out great. I didnt have any deficiancies show up except a mag def in flower because i wasnt running calmag. It was my first grow long time ago. I kept track of ph and it would only climb to 8 in two weeks but i never fiddled with trying to keep it stable. Dwc was my favorite method ive used by far. Its just a lot of work. Great production though.

Oh and a great grower is someone that gets better every grow and never stops learning. If you dont agree with popular theory do your own tests and test the theory. Do side by sides and dont be afraid to tinker to learn. All the results go up in smoke anyway so no worries. Most of the time the mob is correct with the theories, were not reinventing the wheel here. People have been cultivating cannabis indoors since prohibition started.

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I'm on a micro level but I've tried many methods over the years. heck they're all great methods. Guess it boils down to what suits ones needs.

As I think back tho, it's pretty amazing how MJ has evolved and becoming more and more accepted.

Some of us were asking, "why is pot even illegal" back in the 70's and 80's. We'll probably sooner. That's just the kinda crowd I was growing up with back then.

Anyway. I obsessed over my ph. Probably from reading too much here at RIU I don't know. Every night I would test in would go up pretty significantly. No biggy, by the end I had it down to pretty close to how much PH down I needed to add. Sometimes it would only take one good and get it right. It's def a cool way to grow. Some people love doing that stuff. Mad Chemists they are perhaps.

At the end of the day. Yawn. I'm always trying diff stuff. It's amazing to think about how far along the knowledge has spread.

GrowUrOwnDank said:

I'm on a micro level but I've tried many methods over the years. heck they're all great methods. Guess it boils down to what suits ones needs.

As I think back tho, it's pretty amazing how MJ has evolved and becoming more and more accepted.

Some of us were asking, "why is pot even illegal" back in the 70's and 80's. We'll probably sooner. That's just the kinda crowd I was growing up with back then.

Anyway. I obsessed over my ph. Probably from reading too much here at RIU I don't know. Every night I would test in would go up pretty significantly. No biggy, by the end I had it down to pretty close to how much PH down I needed to add. Sometimes it would only take one good and get it right. It's def a cool way to grow. Some people love doing that stuff. Mad Chemists they are perhaps.

At the end of the day. Yawn. I'm always trying diff stuff. It's amazing to think about how far along the knowledge has spread.

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The unstable PH has to do with the type of nutrients you use and how much you use of them, your nutrient strength might not be high enough to keep your PH stable. PH is very important in hydroponics.

Yodaweed said:

The unstable PH has to do with the type of nutrients you use and how much you use of them, your nutrient strength might not be high enough to keep your PH stable. PH is very important in hydroponics.

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At that time I think I was using the GH 3 part Flora series. Slightly under feeding by the instructions that came with them. I boosted when I needed to. It actually turned out to be a very productive grow. Just a little more maintenance than my old lazy ass wanted to do lol. Changing rez. PHing. It was an awesome grow tho.

I ordered a new Milwaukee ph meter. One I can replace the sensor on. I tried using my recently calibrated HM and checked it before hand....now it was reading low.

selfmedicator462 said:

Yeah I've got a planet vape stem and a 14mm gog adapter. Works good with a little bubbler. I could use a new battery. I have to charge after every use now. Lasted almost 5 years tho. I also have a pax2 for the pocket. I like the solo better.

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I rigged a ssv up to my water pipe, its like having a huge arizer solo that plugs in actually the fog is stronger and tastes better

but my cheap way to vape is always just a bong and a good digital heat gun set to 140 to 200c

Yodaweed said:

The unstable PH has to do with the type of nutrients you use and how much you use of them, your nutrient strength might not be high enough to keep your PH stable. PH is very important in hydroponics.

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This annoyed me as it was hard to get a stable ph for seedlings, my ph wouldnt stay put until i hit 1.7ec but that was 7.5ph tap water which is very soft.

Kingrow1 said:

This annoyed me as it was hard to get a stable ph for seedlings, my ph wouldnt stay put until i hit 1.7ec but that was 7.5ph tap water which is very soft.

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I like to use crystal geyser and some pH perfect. I started this because I draw my water from a well and it's around 600 ppm at 7.5ph. I grow in organic super soil with high Coir content and my plants get huge. Never had a pH or nutrient problem with it.

The303Yeti said:

I like to use crystal geyser and some pH perfect. I started this because I draw my water from a well and it's around 600 ppm at 7.5ph. I grow in organic super soil with high Coir content and my plants get huge. Never had a pH or nutrient problem with it.

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I dont worry about ph in soil, it was in response to what was said about hydro.