CrackerJax
New Member
At least now you know why everything is a surprise to you.... that's a cold comfort.
Talk of nuclear terrorists...Lord who will save us from Obama?
- Thread starter yadayada
- Start date
johnnytsmitw
Active Member
so youre one of those guys. I tried to keep an open mind in this conversation, but unfortunately youre the kind of troll that makes blanket statements without backing up your points. There is no point talking with you, because you really have no idea what youre talking about. come back with some sort of proof that you understand anything about international affairs, world politics, or can quantify any of your remarks, and then maybe I wont feel like I am talking to some jerk that sits around making hundreds of posts a day on various message boards.
seriously, i read through some of your other posts and half the time you have nothing to add to any thread. you were already asked not to post in this thread, but i guess youll argue that its your right to be a dick.
sorry if this is a dick move to anyone else. I had a brutal test today, then went to the river to relax and some kid was jumping off the bridge and died. my faith in humanity is waning.
johnnytsmitw
Active Member
i hear ya man. its been a while since I let a troll get to me. but like i said shitty day.
Dr. Greenhorn
Well-Known Member
ahahhahahahahaha
Dr. Greenhorn
Well-Known Member
and I think Cracker is a she
CrackerJax
New Member
Please for my sake... put me on ignore...it would be my PLEASURE to be on that list.
Just for the record.... you all think Obama is wrong?
ink the world
Well-Known Member
Just for the record.... you all think Obama is wrong?
I actually agree w/ Cracker on this.
We go back and forth most of the time; but i believe he's right on this one.
CrackerJax
New Member
TY.... I was starting to think everyone was losing their minds....
Cracker says something against Obama.... everyone goes crazy.
Cracker says something for Obama.....everyone goes crazy.
All I could do was laugh...knowing I'm not the one with issues.
Cracker says something against Obama.... everyone goes crazy.
Cracker says something for Obama.....everyone goes crazy.
All I could do was laugh...knowing I'm not the one with issues.
Dr. Greenhorn
Well-Known Member
ahahahaha! that's classic....CJ, always at the center of controversy! LOL
Dysprositos
Member
Actually they did have weapons of mass destruction. All of the official government documents can be found here on this website. On the website documents are available in the original pdf format. I especially like document 15.
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB80/
Key documentation related to the controversy that has become available in recent months makes up almost of all of the 14 additional documents contained in this updated briefing book. These records include:
- The full Top Secret key judgments section of the October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq's Continuing Programs for Weapons of Mass Destruction (Document 15)
- The CIA-DIA evaluation of two specialized tractor-trailers (Document 32)
- Reviews by the British parliamentary committees concerning the quality and use of intelligence on Iraq by the British government (Document 34, Document 36)
- David Kay's unclassified statement on the ISG's interim findings (Document 39)
- Congressional critiques of U.S. intelligence performance (Document 37, Document 41)
- Administration rebuttals of those and other critiques. (Document 35, Document 38, Document 40, Document 43).
CrackerJax
New Member
Do not confuse them with facts .... they want to believe what they have already....evidence is irrelevant to them.
.... they want to believe what they have already....evidence is irrelevant to them.
johnnytsmitw
Active Member
firstly thanks for bringing something to the table instead of blanket statements. I read through these items you listed and while it is obvious that Iraq did have some small scale weapon development it would be a stretch to call any of it a WMD.
"In addition, Kay summarized some of the Survey Group's discoveries, which included: a clandestine network of laboratories and safe-houses controlled by the Iraqi Intelligence Services containing equipment suitable for CBW research; reference strains of biological organisms concealed in a scientists home; documents and equipment hidden in scientists' homes that could be used for resuming uranium enrichment activities; and a continuing covert capability to manufacture fuel propellant useful only for prohibited SCUD missiles."
these could be better classified as government sponsored terrorist cells. They do not list anything definitive. These guys could be studying e. coli and you can download blueprints of nuclear weapons right now that would qualify you for the same thing these scientists are being accused of.
The article you especially liked seems to refute your claim.
"The quality of the intelligence analysis has also come under scrutiny. The failure to find weapons stocks or active production lines, undermining claims by the October 2002 NIE and both President Bush and Secretary of State Colin Powell (Document 16, Document 27), has been one particular cause for criticism. Controversy has also centered around specific judgments - in the United States with regard to assessments of Iraq's motives for seeking high-strength aluminum tubes, and in the United Kingdom with respect to the government's claim that Iraq sought to acquire uranium from Africa. Post-war evaluation of captured material, particularly two mobile facilities that the CIA and DIA judged to be biological weapons laboratories, has also been the subject of dispute. (Note 5)"
although it does have a picture of a very small plant that is claimed to be a chlorine/phenol plant, in reality it could be anything, the amount of chlorine or phenol a facility of this size would not be a large scale threat. Chemical weapons of this type have been used since WWI and are only potent over small areas where the concentration of the element can be high enough to cause any real damage. The article also brings up the hilarious example of aluminum tubes. there was an article on the news just a couple days ago saying that these same types of tubes can be used for many different things including making bicycles and melted/mixed with other metals to produce cans.
to say that Iraq was a global threat is laughable, I am sorry.
edit, read some more and while it is possible that they had mobile facilities, i still stand by my claim that while the country was obviously run by a dickhead, they were not a global threat. Russia still has tons of anthrax stockpiled for "research" as well as real WMDs. I am not saying that Iraq wasnt on its way to being a problem, but its pretty obvious that the world was lied to or that our govt ran with some bad intelligence.
I dont see Iran as a threat. I really just think they are trying to move ahead with technology the US abandoned 40 years ago to move their country up in the world. We didnt have these problems when India went nuclear.
CrackerJax
New Member
How about simply using some common sense? Too much?
We get it.... you don't like Obama.
We get it.... you don't like Obama.
"Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin used the holocaust memorial ceremony at Israel's Yav Vashem last Sunday to threaten Iran. The theme of his speech was that Iran is the new Nazi Germany and if Iran is not stoped there will be another holocaust. Netanyahu said "The historical failure of the free world in facing the Nazi beast was in not confronting it when it could still be stopped," Netanyahu said, "today we witness the fire of the old-new hate, the hate of the Jews being spread by the regimes and organizations of radical Islam, spearheaded by Iran and its cohorts."
http://www.examiner.com/x-9462-LA-Nonpartisan-Examiner~y2010m4d13-Netanyahu-uses-Holocaust-Remembrance-day-to-promote-war-with-Iran
.
. that's NOT Obama.
.
.
CrackerJax
New Member
Oh... it isn't?
But I have read all of the posts...try the very first. This is one of the few times I agree with Obama.
But I have read all of the posts...try the very first. This is one of the few times I agree with Obama.
ink the world
Well-Known Member
I do see them as a threat, I never saw Iraq as much of a threat.
As the president of a nuclear capable country calls for another nation to be "wiped off the map" you have to pay attention.
His treatment of political protesters further convinced me of his nature.
I abhorred the Bush administrations foreign policy, and as I said before I opposed the second Iraq war. This however I feel is a threat and needs to be addressed.
The previous administration pretty much did nothing about the matter for the last 8 year and now we have to deal w/ the problem. I hope there is a peaceful solution, but I honestly dont have much faith in the man.
Talk, diplomacy and sanctions are a good start, but at what point does talking to a wall become a waste of time?
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
i found it rather amuysing, the concept of doing all the world can do to stop them getting a weapon, and i believe the quote was even "thousands" could die. so that justifies killing a million civvies to stop them killing thousands of civvies? hmmmmm, seems kinda out of balance if you ask me
ink the world
Well-Known Member
Where is the "millions of civies" figure coming from? Are you meaning that an invasion would mean millions of civilian casualties?
If so, i care more about 1,000 Americans than I do 1,000,000 Iranians. Sounds callous but its how I feel.
LOL I bet I get whacked from the Progressives for this, while I have already drawn the ire of most conservatives around here. Yippee, the pleasure of being a moderate
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
does that mean you're happy for everyone outside of america not to give two shits about planes being flown into buildings and such, much rather they take out a thousand of you than the 100 of us.Where is the "millions of civies" figure coming from? Are you meaning that an invasion would mean millions of civilian casualties?
If so, i care more about 1,000 Americans than I do 1,000,000 Iranians. Sounds callous but its how I feel.
LOL I bet I get whacked from the Progressives for this, while I have already drawn the ire of most conservatives around here. Yippee, the pleasure of being a moderate
but no, i feel for both sides. i do not mould my morals and ethics to work for me, or in relation to the other side, but unfortunately, as i showed in my other thread, americans don't really care about morals values if the other guy doesn't play by them.