Why Hydro is easier than Soil

blazinbudsforever

blazinbudsforever

Well-Known Member
hydro rocks, used it for my first grow (which is finishing up) and if I ever messed something up I would change the res. Easy easy easy I dont understand why people have problems. And the lowryder 2 which I am growing looks 3 times as big as any ive seen in soil here.
 
klmmicro

klmmicro

Well-Known Member
I have only grown vegetables in hydro and it works well enough. There is a learning curve to it, and even with research I made rooky mistakes. I built a DWC system for lettuce...amazed at the volume of lettuce produced on a daily basis. The plants went crazy, despite several attempts at killing them off.

My first indoor medical grow was done in soil. I have grown outdoors in soil and so am familiar with what to expect. I would not say soil is better, but I will agree that it is very fogiving. No problems with anything and the result was a good yield. When it is time to replenish my medicine, most likely hydro will be used. Just want to see what it will do!
 
BigBudBalls

BigBudBalls

Well-Known Member
I prefer soil, but dig the tech and control of hydro. Gotta give it another shot (just did a small flood/drain with some veggies, so-so results)

But for cloning, I do like my areogarden (then pop em in soil)

dol72fins said:
i have been growing in soil for over 10 years. after doin months of research on forums like this 1, i decieded to build an aero/nft type of system. finished the cloner a little over 2 weeks ago filled the rez adjusted the ph to 5.9 and added the clones. today i have 13 out of 16 clones with roots. i'm amazed, in soil it took 3 weeks and got only half the clones to grow roots. so far everything has gone smoothly.
here's a link to my thread check it out. peace.
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/183168-new-hydro.html
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B

bongholio

Well-Known Member
BigBudBalls said:
Soil is more forgiving. If you are f*cking up a soil grow, just wait and see what you can do to a hydro grow.
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this is my opinion to,ive never had a problem growing outdoors in the 10yrs ive been growing,thats why i thought hydro will be easy but its not compared to outdoor.yes it might be easy to fix a problem in hydro but you have 5x more problems to deal with.if you have a nice fertile soil and you don't water everyday,the only other things you have to worry about is pests,thieves and cops but all them affect hydro to.gimme outdoor anydaybongsmilie
 
KaliKitsune

KaliKitsune

Well-Known Member
BigBudBalls said:
I prefer soil, but dig the tech and control of hydro. Gotta give it another shot (just did a small flood/drain with some veggies, so-so results)

But for cloning, I do like my areogarden (then pop em in soil)
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Go DWC for vegetables. Last night I checked on a freshly rooted Mr. Stripey clone I had taken, there was no roots showing out of the net pot. Nine hours later, I'm just now waking up, I checked and I have four finch roots already out in some parts of the net pot. I'll start up a journal in the regular gardening section.
 
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easygrinder

New Member
The only argument for soil, that ever seems to come up is the taste,

blah blah blah,

they say that using chemical nutrients leaves a residue that can be tasted,

well if chemicals leave a residue then so will organic nutes,

let me see, what would i like to be smoking the most,

a man made compound that gives the plant everything it needs

or bat shit, worm shit, countless other types of shit


errrrrrrr
 
Kriegs

Kriegs

Well-Known Member
People screw up soil grows because they try to do too much; they don't respect or believe the utter simplicity under which a plant, any plant, will grow.

I've been growing everything but MJ for decades. I ran into problems with my first indoor cause I got too hyped up and thought it needed "something special". Turned out, it's just plant -- put it in soil, water it properly and voila... lots of weed.

Hydro grows do have that advantage -- they serve the "desire to tinker", and actually benefit from it. The desire to tinker is a killer for soil grows. If you like things complicated, stay away from soil.
 
waldocat420

waldocat420

Well-Known Member
easygrinder said:
The only argument for soil, that ever seems to come up is the taste,

blah blah blah,

they say that using chemical nutrients leaves a residue that can be tasted,

well if chemicals leave a residue then so will organic nutes,

let me see, what would i like to be smoking the most,

a man made compound that gives the plant everything it needs

or bat shit, worm shit, countless other types of shit


errrrrrrr
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that is not true at all. hydro man made chemicals will definitely have a horrible taste if not flushed, 100% organic grow not so much, and will even leave a clean white ash when burned. personally, i would rather smoke something grown with mother natures finest sources of NPK, rather than something created in a lab..
 
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easygrinder

New Member
Kriegs said:
People screw up soil grows because they try to do too much; they don't respect or believe the utter simplicity under which a plant, any plant, will grow.

I've been growing everything but MJ for decades. I ran into problems with my first indoor cause I got too hyped up and thought it needed "something special". Turned out, it's just plant -- put it in soil, water it properly and voila... lots of weed.

Hydro does have that advantage -- it serves the "desire to tinker", and actually needs it. The desire to tinker is a killer for soil grows. If you like things complicated, stay away from soil.
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The reason why you can't tinker with soil is because there is no cause and effect, you can do something but it will take days for it to show, because of the buffering properties of soil, you never really understand if what you did was good or not, thats why it doesn't build your confidence up, thats why everyone sticks with soil and never branches out to learn new things, because they don't have the confidence to do it, and hydro is too hard and complicated,

hydro can be just as simple and straight forward and soil.

i spend a max of 20 mins with my plants every 3 days, apart from that i don't see them, i know exactly what is going to happen, i know how long a feed will last i know how much nutrients i need, and if you get nute burn you know its because you gave it x ppms last night or you didnt' bother checking ph, you can tell exactly what your problem is, because you made the changes that caused it,

thats why you don't see that many hydro growers posting threads like whats wrong with my plants, you seem to see endless threads like that from newbie soil growers though, because they never know really what they are doing, they just rely on someone giving them vague measurements like add quarter strength, or add a teaspoon of calmag to a gallon of water.

Last night i fed my hydro plants 1.6ec of bloom and 0.2 ec of pk boost, the water was also ph 5.72 and the temp of the water was 70 deg,
 
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easygrinder

New Member
waldocat420 said:
that is not true at all. hydro man made chemicals will definitely have a horrible taste if not flushed, 100% organic grow not so much, and will even leave a clean white ash when burned. personally, i would rather smoke something grown with mother natures finest sources of NPK, rather than something created in a lab..
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99% of people flush anyway, so that isnt' an issue
 
Kriegs

Kriegs

Well-Known Member
easygrinder said:
The reason why you can't tinker with soil is because there is no cause and effect, you can do something but it will take days for it to show, because of the buffering properties of soil, you never really understand if what you did was good or not, thats why it doesn't build your confidence up, thats why everyone sticks with soil and never branches out to learn new things, because they don't have the confidence to do it, and hydro is too hard and complicated,

hydro can be just as simple and straight forward and soil.

i spend a max of 20 mins with my plants every 3 days, apart from that i don't see them, i know exactly what is going to happen, i know how long a feed will last i know how much nutrients i need, and if you get nute burn you know its because you gave it x ppms last night or you didnt' bother checking ph, you can tell exactly what your problem is, because you made the changes that caused it,

thats why you don't see that many hydro growers posting threads like whats wrong with my plants, you seem to see endless threads like that from newbie soil growers though, because they never know really what they are doing, they just rely on someone giving them vague measurements like add quarter strength, or add a teaspoon of calmag to a gallon of water.

Last night i fed my hydro plants 1.6ec of bloom and 0.2 ec of pk boost, the water was also ph 5.72 and the temp of the water was 70 deg,
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My point was this: people tinker with soil when they don't need to. They follow formulaic suggestions that applied well to someone's 150W white widow grow that proved totally inappropriate for someone else's 1000W hindu kush grow. That's why it gets fucked up, not because the soil "needed tinkering", but because we insist on tinkering no matter what.

I think the vast majority of soil problems arise initially from over- or underwatering, and adding unneeded nutes (in that order). The usual response to these very-simple problems is a litany of complex or unrelated solutions that are, again, unnecessary and worse, off-target.

I see a butt-load of hydro plant problems on RIU.. Not saying more so than soil, just that there's plenty on here to go along with soil problems. The root is that there are just a lot of folks trying to grow MJ that have never grown anything before, so they're trying to learn and adjust to absolutely EVERYTHING about growing plants. On RIU, this problem gets distilled thru the "MJ filter", but that is really what they're dealing with. It boils down to people not knowing how to read plants or (like me) people who do know how to read plants getting overexcited about growing their own MJ and suffering temporary insanity over it.

pH and overnute issues are definitely easier to fix in hydro. Thing is, they only happen in soil because of unnecessary messin' around.

For persons with their circuits connected and possessing decent math and reasoning skills (as you obviously have..), I can see where hydro is very simple and straight-forward. But, I think these qualities are the same keys to successful soil grows..

Good post; interesting discussion. +rep for you.
 
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easygrinder

New Member
Kriegs said:
My point was this: people tinker with soil when they don't need to. They follow formulaic suggestions that applied well to someone's 150W white widow grow that proved totally inappropriate for someone else's 1000W hindu kush grow. That's why it gets fucked up, not because the soil "needed tinkering", but because we insist on tinkering no matter what.

I think the vast majority of soil problems arise initially from over- or underwatering, and adding unneeded nutes (in that order). The usual response to these very-simple problems is a litany of complex or unrelated solutions that are, again, unnecessary and worse, off-target.

I see a butt-load of hydro plant problems on RIU.. Not saying more so than soil, just that there's plenty on here to go along with soil problems. The root is that there are just a lot of folks trying to grow MJ that have never grown anything before, so they're trying to learn and adjust to absolutely EVERYTHING about growing plants. On RIU, this problem gets distilled thru the "MJ filter", but that is really what they're dealing with. It boils down to people not knowing how to read plants or (like me) people who do know how to read plants getting overexcited about growing their own MJ and suffering temporary insanity over it.

pH and overnute issues are definitely easier to fix in hydro. Thing is, they only happen in soil because of unnecessary messin' around.

For persons with their circuits connected and possessing decent math and reasoning skills (as you obviously have..), I can see where hydro is very simple and straight-forward. But, I think these qualities are the same keys to successful soil grows..

Good post; interesting discussion. +rep for you.
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I think soil or hydro, these problems always arise for the same reason, everyone wants the answer put on a platter for them, no one is prepared to find out for themselves and to analyze things
 
KaliKitsune

KaliKitsune

Well-Known Member
waldocat420 said:
that is not true at all. hydro man made chemicals will definitely have a horrible taste if not flushed, 100% organic grow not so much, and will even leave a clean white ash when burned. personally, i would rather smoke something grown with mother natures finest sources of NPK, rather than something created in a lab..
Click to expand...
This isn't true at all. My hydro basil destroys my soil basil in quality of pesto, and that's without flushing. Ditto tomatoes, catnip, parsley, and cilantro.

Nutrient ion salts, no matter the source, are still nutrient ion salts. Plants will change the composition of the nutrient solutions upon contact by depleting specific nutrients more rapidly than others, which means only what the plant requires will be allowed to pass through. You know our blood/brain barrier? The plant roots serve the exact same function. They are filters and will not allow bad things in if they are healthy and undamaged. However, osmosis can and will cause issues if you don't slowly acclimate a plant to a readily-available source of nutrients in at first light and then later greater quantities. Too strong of a solution at an early stage will kill a plant in hydro or soil, as we all know, and part of that reason is osmosis, combined with potential hydrogen.

Now, in the case of marijuana, the fact that there are greater quantities of available nutrients present is what gives it the 'harsh smoke' and sure you WANT to flush it if you're going to combust it and inhale the smoke, because that excess of nutrients will alter the flavor. I've even had organic soil-grown bud that was harsh as hell because there wasn't any proper flushing. The curing was great, though.
 
Kriegs

Kriegs

Well-Known Member
easygrinder said:
I think soil or hydro, these problems always arise for the same reason, everyone wants the answer put on a platter for them, no one is prepared to find out for themselves and to analyze things
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Tru that.. How many posts do you see asking "how / what do I ....xyz" and the damn answer is right there in the stickies just above it?
 
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easygrinder

New Member
Kriegs said:
Tru that.. How many posts do you see asking "how / what do I ....xyz" and the damn answer is right there in the stickies just above it?
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when i started growing i read read read and read some more, from the very first moment i thought about growing i started reading. even without going on a single forum all the information is out there in plain text format, you can find practically any grow book in a e-book format if you do a search.

I see 100's of people using all sorts of growth enhancers, solely because someone else told them it will do the world of good, i see people buying a 20 bottle line up of advanced nutrients thinking its going to get them double the yield over anyone else. Most of this started out with someone passing on the sales pitch that they bought hook line and sinker, then they pass it on and soon it gets acknowledged as "fact". I'm not sure how many people ran completely simple grows while they enhanced their skills first so as to get a base of results to see what actually makes a difference.
 
Kriegs

Kriegs

Well-Known Member
easygrinder said:
when i started growing i read read read and read some more, from the very first moment i thought about growing i started reading. even without going on a single forum all the information is out there in plain text format, you can find practically any grow book in a e-book format if you do a search.

I see 100's of people using all sorts of growth enhancers, solely because someone else told them it will do the world of good, i see people buying a 20 bottle line up of advanced nutrients thinking its going to get them double the yield over anyone else. Most of this started out with someone passing on the sales pitch that they bought hook line and sinker, then they pass it on and soon it gets acknowledged as "fact". I'm not sure how many people ran completely simple grows while they enhanced their skills first so as to get a base of results to see what actually makes a difference.
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No doubt...

I have an advanced degree, and actually did field research on a group of plants in the midwest US that thrive and outcompete others only in most nutrient POOR situations. For example, 8-12 mg/kg of available phosphorous, when most any soil has at least 50. In these settings, added nutrients cause these plants to disappear and be taken over by other plants.

Ppl don't realize that for plants, "more" is often NOT better and that each species has evolved to compete under very specific conditions. When you try to force that plant to do things it's not designed for (such as take up a butt-load of nitrogen, or cal-mag, or whatever), it will fight you. We're all anxious to harvest some bud, so human nature dictates that we'll want to force things.
 
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easygrinder

New Member
Kriegs said:
No doubt...

I have an advanced degree, and actually did field research on a group of plants in the midwest US that thrive and outcompete others only in most nutrient POOR situations. For example, 8-12 mg/kg of available phosphorous, when most any soil has at least 50. In these settings, added nutrients cause these plants to disappear and be taken over by other plants.

Ppl don't realize that for plants, "more" is often NOT better and that each species has evolved to compete under very specific conditions. When you try to force that plant to do things it's not designed for (such as take up a butt-load of nitrogen, or cal-mag, or whatever), it will fight you. We're all anxious to harvest some bud, so human nature dictates that we'll want to force things.
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most people don't realize that the biggest danger to their plants is themselves, it grew perfectly fine without us in nature, so why does it need someone fucking with it every 10 mins, learn what it needs, give it just that, and then sit back, the more minimum your efforts whilst still maintaining the plants requirements the better the plants grows.

People gotta learn to stop fucking with it.
 
Ray Fox

Ray Fox

Well-Known Member
easygrinder said:
most people don't realize that the biggest danger to their plants is themselves, it grew perfectly fine without us in nature, so why does it need someone fucking with it every 10 mins, learn what it needs, give it just that, and then sit back, the more minimum your efforts whilst still maintaining the plants requirements the better the plants grows.

People gotta learn to stop fucking with it.
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Word. Well said Easygrinder. :hump:

They're plants. Let nature take its course and only respond to the plant's movements, not otherwise.


 
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