DIY 4x12 3500K/5000k lm561c two channel board
- Thread starter VegasWinner
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- lm561c samsung pcb
nfhiggs
Well-Known Member
If they are running the same diodes, then at the same wattage per diode they will have the exact same efficiencies. Yours are running at .52W per diode while the QB's are running at .45W per diode. Higher wattage decreases lumens per watt - there is no "configuration" that gets around that fact. You are running yours at the 165 l/W range, while the QB's at 2100 mA are running at 175 l/W range. While your board may show higher intensity in the center, the two QB's spread the diodes out more and will therefore cover a greater area. Your board is not "more efficient", nor is it higher "lumens per watt". It is THE SAME at equal wattage per diode.. Yours is just a different size.
nfhiggs
Well-Known Member
Exactly.
nfhiggs
Well-Known Member
You need to message him directly to get in on another Co-Op buy.
nfhiggs
Well-Known Member
Mehh.. Its the weekend - he may just be off doing something. I'm sure he'll get the next one going soon if there is enough people interested.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
Yes
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
Looking to the horizon it appears Samsung has a new offering on the way. This may be old news to some folks but new to me today. Samsung has begun production on the LM301B 0.3w diode. It is expected to deliver 200lm/w and above also running 200mA and binned at 0.065mA.
Similar footprint as the LM561C.
Keep watching for that new GrowGreen 200w LM301B next.
Similar footprint as the LM561C.
Keep watching for that new GrowGreen 200w LM301B next.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
Here is 800w on two levels. No heat issues. Upper level diy flexible strips each 200w using 185h- c1400b drivers. Below is two 200w GrowGreen boards.
Upper plants have no heat issues from the lights below. 2x6 stacked grow
Upper plants have no heat issues from the lights below. 2x6 stacked grow
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ttystikk
Well-Known Member
The fact that it's in a window sheds some doubt on the efficacy of the lights. I'm not saying they don't work, but with that setup there's no telling what their actual performance is.
nfhiggs
Well-Known Member
Honestly, its not much to write home about. At 65 mA rated current, its output in the middle 3500K bin (S6 is the middle bin for the 561C) is 37 lumen, vs 36 lumen for the 561. Its really just the equivalent of one more bin. Biggest difference is its a 3x3 mm footprint rather than 3x5.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
The blinds stay closed so the neighbors don't complain but not light efficacy heat.
So if more sunlight more heat. I am looking at micro greens or herbs sitting 4" above 200w led lights no heat issues for the plants. All led lights can't stack without heat issues. These lights make little heat.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
5000k 200w 100w
∑Flux 18095 lm 9154 lm
18095 lm 9154 lm
Total 36190 lm 18308 lm
∑Power 106.2 W 47.7 W
106.2W 47.7 W
Total 212.4W 95.4W
Efficacy 170.4 lm/W 191.9 lm/W
170.4lm/W 191.9 lm/W
Total 340.8 lm/W 384.8 lm/W
∑LES 3225.6 mm2 3225.6 mm2
3225.6mm2 3225.6 mm2
Total 6450.2mm2 6450.2mm2
3000K 200w 100w
∑Flux 17062 lm 8551 lm
17062 lm 8551 lm
Total flux 34124 lm 17102 lm
∑Power 106.3 W 47.7 W
106.3W 47.7W
Total 212.4 W 95.4W
Efficacy 160.6 lm/W 179.2 lm/W
160.6 lm/W 179.2 lm/W
Total 321.2 lnm/W 358.4 lm/W
∑LES 3225.6 mm2 3225.6 mm2
3225.6mm2 3225.6 mm2
Total 6450.2mm2 6450.2mm2
Calculated power for one board with two channels at 200w and 100w
∑Flux 18095 lm 9154 lm
18095 lm 9154 lm
Total 36190 lm 18308 lm
∑Power 106.2 W 47.7 W
106.2W 47.7 W
Total 212.4W 95.4W
Efficacy 170.4 lm/W 191.9 lm/W
170.4lm/W 191.9 lm/W
Total 340.8 lm/W 384.8 lm/W
∑LES 3225.6 mm2 3225.6 mm2
3225.6mm2 3225.6 mm2
Total 6450.2mm2 6450.2mm2
3000K 200w 100w
∑Flux 17062 lm 8551 lm
17062 lm 8551 lm
Total flux 34124 lm 17102 lm
∑Power 106.3 W 47.7 W
106.3W 47.7W
Total 212.4 W 95.4W
Efficacy 160.6 lm/W 179.2 lm/W
160.6 lm/W 179.2 lm/W
Total 321.2 lnm/W 358.4 lm/W
∑LES 3225.6 mm2 3225.6 mm2
3225.6mm2 3225.6 mm2
Total 6450.2mm2 6450.2mm2
Calculated power for one board with two channels at 200w and 100w
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
LM301B diode
5000K 80cri
3000k 80cri
Interesting observation If you overlay the two spectrum's you get a big increase of the 450nm range as well as a little more in the 500-550nm range, and 650-700nm range
Notice also how at 175mA my selected drive current the output is 250 relative luminous flux%
5000K 80cri
3000k 80cri
Interesting observation If you overlay the two spectrum's you get a big increase of the 450nm range as well as a little more in the 500-550nm range, and 650-700nm range
Notice also how at 175mA my selected drive current the output is 250 relative luminous flux%
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
Explore and control LED-based tunable-white lighting
Two-color sources can enable tunable-white light, explains ISHITA GOSWAMI , but more colors can provide a broader tunable range, better quality light, and granular intensity control.
Solid-state lighting (SSL), leveraging white LEDs, has disrupted markets for traditional lighting products for some time now. With the transition to this energy-saving lighting technology, vendors have been able to offer cool, neutral, and warm white shades that have been quickly understood and accepted by consumers and professional buyers. But LED sources also afford luminaire manufacturers the ability to offer intelligent products that can be tuned to a desired CCT at any time by the user of a space. Let’s discuss why the time is right for tunable LED-based products and how such products can be designed for optimum tuning range, light quality, and intensity control; and subsequently how such a product would be controlled.
Indeed, warmer white lighting, at lower correlated color temperatures or CCTs, is known to help establish a comforting or relaxing environment, which many people welcome early in the morning or in an evening setting. Cool or neutral lighting at higher color temperatures, on the other hand, can have an invigorating effect and therefore is often preferred in contexts such as industrial workplaces, offices, or kitchens to help enhance concentration and maximize human productivity. But SSL can offer flexibility beyond choosing a CCT based on a specific application and accepted lighting practices.
With LEDs affording the opportunity to experiment with light in practical situations, human responses to varying light specifications are becoming more widely understood. Industry and academia are engaged in exploring, demonstrating, and validating the benefits of human-centric lighting (HCL) in applications such as hospitals, retail stores, schools, and offices. Consumers are ready for
tunable white lighting, opening the way for groups such as architects, interior designers, lighting specifiers, and facility managers to use their knowledge of the effects of different white shades to inf luence human moods and behavior and so establish even better environments for working, living, healing, buying, and spending leisure time.
Differences in tunable white sources White LEDs are fabricated either by phosphor conversion of blue or near-ultraviolet emission, or by mixing light from multiple red, green, and blue (RGB) monochromatic emitters. A combination of these two methods is also sometimes used. Adjusting the phosphor-coating composition or color mixing causes the characteristic of the white light to vary. A tunable-white light source is characterized by how many colors or whites are used to achieve the final CCT. There are two, three, five, and even potentially seven color sources that can be mixed for tunable-white developments today, but the actual implementation depends on ease of use, quality, and cost.
The cool, neutral, and warm shades mentioned earlier are referred to as fixed or static CCT white lighting. Typical CCT ranges for warm, neutral, and cool white are 2700–3000K, 4000–5000K, and 5000–6500K, respectively. Together, these CCT ranges define a continuum of tunable-white CCTs that would be perceived as being white.
In a few tunable-white light sources using three or more colors, these white CCTs lie along the daylight locus (DL) and black body locus (BBL) that traverse the long-established CIE (International Commission on Illumination) color space and those sources provide a higher-quality white as defined by CRI, the R9 CRI red sample, and the relatively new TM-30 color-fidelity metric published in
2015 by the Illuminating Engineering Society of America (IES; http://bit.ly/2bBubZM).
Fig. 1, for example, charts the CRI and R9 values of a three-color Luxi Tune source over a broad range of CCTs. Other tunable-white color sources using a two-color cool-white and warm-white averaging effect are limited in the range over which they can deliver high CRI and high color fidelity.
Importance of path Each tunable-white solution has a predefined path or tuning profile. With three or more colors, it is possible to track the BBL as mentioned earlier and independently dim the intensity of the resulting white light. Two-color sources, on the other hand, follow a straight line over a limited tuning range, and the resulting f lux also has limitations due to the averaging effect of cool white and
warm white needed to strike the right CCT, which has to be compensated with adding more LEDs in the tuning mix.
Both options are currently considered suitable for creating tunable-white LED light engines or modules. However, it is generally accepted that a high-quality white should have no more than a two standard deviation color matching (SDCM) variation along the tuning path. A two-color solution cannot meet this expectation over the entire range of 2700K–6500K CCTs. It is also recognized that true white may lie above, on, or below the BBL, depending on the observer. This f lexibility of a tuning curve that is offset above or below the BBL by design is not possible with a two-color solution. Based on research and customer feedback, LED Engin has established a path for its own tunable-white LuxiTune products, which is within 2 SDCM below the BBL over the 2100K–4300K range and gradually transitions toward the daylight locus from 4300K–6500K.
Two-color sources can enable tunable-white light, explains ISHITA GOSWAMI , but more colors can provide a broader tunable range, better quality light, and granular intensity control.
Solid-state lighting (SSL), leveraging white LEDs, has disrupted markets for traditional lighting products for some time now. With the transition to this energy-saving lighting technology, vendors have been able to offer cool, neutral, and warm white shades that have been quickly understood and accepted by consumers and professional buyers. But LED sources also afford luminaire manufacturers the ability to offer intelligent products that can be tuned to a desired CCT at any time by the user of a space. Let’s discuss why the time is right for tunable LED-based products and how such products can be designed for optimum tuning range, light quality, and intensity control; and subsequently how such a product would be controlled.
Indeed, warmer white lighting, at lower correlated color temperatures or CCTs, is known to help establish a comforting or relaxing environment, which many people welcome early in the morning or in an evening setting. Cool or neutral lighting at higher color temperatures, on the other hand, can have an invigorating effect and therefore is often preferred in contexts such as industrial workplaces, offices, or kitchens to help enhance concentration and maximize human productivity. But SSL can offer flexibility beyond choosing a CCT based on a specific application and accepted lighting practices.
With LEDs affording the opportunity to experiment with light in practical situations, human responses to varying light specifications are becoming more widely understood. Industry and academia are engaged in exploring, demonstrating, and validating the benefits of human-centric lighting (HCL) in applications such as hospitals, retail stores, schools, and offices. Consumers are ready for
tunable white lighting, opening the way for groups such as architects, interior designers, lighting specifiers, and facility managers to use their knowledge of the effects of different white shades to inf luence human moods and behavior and so establish even better environments for working, living, healing, buying, and spending leisure time.
Differences in tunable white sources White LEDs are fabricated either by phosphor conversion of blue or near-ultraviolet emission, or by mixing light from multiple red, green, and blue (RGB) monochromatic emitters. A combination of these two methods is also sometimes used. Adjusting the phosphor-coating composition or color mixing causes the characteristic of the white light to vary. A tunable-white light source is characterized by how many colors or whites are used to achieve the final CCT. There are two, three, five, and even potentially seven color sources that can be mixed for tunable-white developments today, but the actual implementation depends on ease of use, quality, and cost.
The cool, neutral, and warm shades mentioned earlier are referred to as fixed or static CCT white lighting. Typical CCT ranges for warm, neutral, and cool white are 2700–3000K, 4000–5000K, and 5000–6500K, respectively. Together, these CCT ranges define a continuum of tunable-white CCTs that would be perceived as being white.
In a few tunable-white light sources using three or more colors, these white CCTs lie along the daylight locus (DL) and black body locus (BBL) that traverse the long-established CIE (International Commission on Illumination) color space and those sources provide a higher-quality white as defined by CRI, the R9 CRI red sample, and the relatively new TM-30 color-fidelity metric published in
2015 by the Illuminating Engineering Society of America (IES; http://bit.ly/2bBubZM).
Fig. 1, for example, charts the CRI and R9 values of a three-color Luxi Tune source over a broad range of CCTs. Other tunable-white color sources using a two-color cool-white and warm-white averaging effect are limited in the range over which they can deliver high CRI and high color fidelity.
Importance of path Each tunable-white solution has a predefined path or tuning profile. With three or more colors, it is possible to track the BBL as mentioned earlier and independently dim the intensity of the resulting white light. Two-color sources, on the other hand, follow a straight line over a limited tuning range, and the resulting f lux also has limitations due to the averaging effect of cool white and
warm white needed to strike the right CCT, which has to be compensated with adding more LEDs in the tuning mix.
Both options are currently considered suitable for creating tunable-white LED light engines or modules. However, it is generally accepted that a high-quality white should have no more than a two standard deviation color matching (SDCM) variation along the tuning path. A two-color solution cannot meet this expectation over the entire range of 2700K–6500K CCTs. It is also recognized that true white may lie above, on, or below the BBL, depending on the observer. This f lexibility of a tuning curve that is offset above or below the BBL by design is not possible with a two-color solution. Based on research and customer feedback, LED Engin has established a path for its own tunable-white LuxiTune products, which is within 2 SDCM below the BBL over the 2100K–4300K range and gradually transitions toward the daylight locus from 4300K–6500K.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
part 2
Fig. 2 illustrates this tuning range. Flexibility in creating ambience By adjusting in-source color mixing to follow a curve such as that shown in Fig. 2, it is possible to deliver tunable-white light sources that permit smooth adjustment between the limits of extremely cool (high CCT) to extremely warm (low CCT). Some sources also allow the intensity to be dimmed from 100% to as low as 0.5%, at each CCT over the tuning range. This is known as CCT tuning with deep dimming. Moreover, natural human responses to phenomena such as sunrise and sunset have conditioned people to expect tones to be cooler when lighting is brightest and to become warmer as lighting is dimmed. Accordingly, retailers or owners of venues such as bars or restaurants often seek to attract customers by presenting a cool and invigorating environment during daytime hours, while using lighting to create a warm glow moving into the evening. This is another version of tunable white known as warm dimming.
Moving forward from the CCT tuning and dimming options that are possible today, one potential next step for tunable-white lighting is to introduce control over color saturation. This is known as Du ́v ́ tuning as represented in Fig. 3. Du ́v ́ tuning requires three control handles for CCT, intensity, and saturation. LED Engine has demonstrated Du ́v ́ tuning within the 7-MacAdam-ellipse rectangles of the ANSI white space along iso-CCT lines, using a DMX controller.
Control requirements and wireless options The prospect of tunable-white lighting raises questions as to how users can apply settings or adjust the lighting to achieve the effects they desire. In fact, the adoption of tunable-white lighting is tightly linked to ease of use which is in turn determined by how intuitive the controls are. A color-aware user interface is required that allows the user to
set f lux levels and CCT directly without having to interpret what settings on the control- ler correspond to actual f lux and CCT output.
A suitable control strategy needs to have two handles, capable of controlling CCT and intensity, independently and simultaneously. The basic LuxiTune light engine uses two 0–10V controls; 0–10V has been around in the lighting industry for a while. Although LED Engin has used DMX (both 512A and RDM) successfully for tunable white, DMX is not widely used outside professional or stage lighting markets. DALI (digital addressable lighting interface) is another alternative that is more popular in commercial markets, particularly in Europe. Currently, DALI protocols are available for managing one variable (Device Type 6, or DT6), or two (Device Type 8, or DT
, but DT8 devices cannot yet be certified by DALI.
The options for controlling tunable-white lighting continue to evolve and now include some important developments such as wireless connectivity. One opportunity may be to leverage the rapid pace of progress in the smart-building space. The ZigBee protocol has made some inroads in lighting. LED Engine has tested the tunable-white market with a ZigBee Home Automation (ZHA) enabled tunable-white solution. However, few if any ZHA controllers in the market today are suited for tunable-white applications as they lack the two separate handles for independently controlling intensity and CCT. Bluetooth Low Energy
(BLE) mesh networking promises advantages for tunable-white lighting including an end-to-end solution. Not only is it possible to have two independent control handles for CCT and intensity, the BLE control interface is user friendly, and lights can be controlled by an app on a smart device with touchscreen operation. Secure networks with four levels of access can be set up to control multiple light nodes that extend over large distances without requiring hubs or gateways, and can be controlled from a single terminal with minimal restriction on communication range.
Because all devices on a BLE network can advertise their presence and status, the controlling app can be allowed to access all lighting fixtures and groups of fixtures.
This feature would help in commissioning and managing a network of tunable light fixtures in a commercial environment spread across several f loors. Moreover, autonomous coordination between nodes and the ability to incorporate input from sensors, would provide the opportunity to implement advanced features such as activating lights in sequence as a person walks along a corridor. LuxiTune with the BLE mesh option can incorporate all these advantages for luminaire developers.
The market for tunable-white lighting may yet be too young for manufacturers to back one wireless option over another. One effective way to give luminaire product developers the flexibility to have multiple connectivity choices is a modular design. You can realize a f lexible scenario by having a basic 0–10V driver that works with different modular control boards such as in the tunable-white light engine shown in Fig. 4. This allows a tunable-white solution to be assembled and commissioned with minimal effort by plugging the chosen control module into headers on the basic driver board.
Future of dynamic lighting Lighting designers, luminaire manufacturers, and end users have become familiar with the effects that can be achieved by dynamic white lighting. The market is now ready to accept tunable-white lighting products capable of supporting even more varied effects. Some products have already been successfully realized. Other aspects need to come fully into place, such as the realization that dynamic lighting offers quantifiable benefits for applications in retail, healthcare, hospitality, commercial, and education. Control options for tunable white can be simplified with improvements such as BLE mesh, and intuitive controls are the key to enabling this exciting technology to deliver its full potential.
http://www.ledengin.com/files/articles/tunable_white_colors_control.pdf
Fig. 2 illustrates this tuning range. Flexibility in creating ambience By adjusting in-source color mixing to follow a curve such as that shown in Fig. 2, it is possible to deliver tunable-white light sources that permit smooth adjustment between the limits of extremely cool (high CCT) to extremely warm (low CCT). Some sources also allow the intensity to be dimmed from 100% to as low as 0.5%, at each CCT over the tuning range. This is known as CCT tuning with deep dimming. Moreover, natural human responses to phenomena such as sunrise and sunset have conditioned people to expect tones to be cooler when lighting is brightest and to become warmer as lighting is dimmed. Accordingly, retailers or owners of venues such as bars or restaurants often seek to attract customers by presenting a cool and invigorating environment during daytime hours, while using lighting to create a warm glow moving into the evening. This is another version of tunable white known as warm dimming.
Moving forward from the CCT tuning and dimming options that are possible today, one potential next step for tunable-white lighting is to introduce control over color saturation. This is known as Du ́v ́ tuning as represented in Fig. 3. Du ́v ́ tuning requires three control handles for CCT, intensity, and saturation. LED Engine has demonstrated Du ́v ́ tuning within the 7-MacAdam-ellipse rectangles of the ANSI white space along iso-CCT lines, using a DMX controller.
Control requirements and wireless options The prospect of tunable-white lighting raises questions as to how users can apply settings or adjust the lighting to achieve the effects they desire. In fact, the adoption of tunable-white lighting is tightly linked to ease of use which is in turn determined by how intuitive the controls are. A color-aware user interface is required that allows the user to
set f lux levels and CCT directly without having to interpret what settings on the control- ler correspond to actual f lux and CCT output.
A suitable control strategy needs to have two handles, capable of controlling CCT and intensity, independently and simultaneously. The basic LuxiTune light engine uses two 0–10V controls; 0–10V has been around in the lighting industry for a while. Although LED Engin has used DMX (both 512A and RDM) successfully for tunable white, DMX is not widely used outside professional or stage lighting markets. DALI (digital addressable lighting interface) is another alternative that is more popular in commercial markets, particularly in Europe. Currently, DALI protocols are available for managing one variable (Device Type 6, or DT6), or two (Device Type 8, or DT
, but DT8 devices cannot yet be certified by DALI.The options for controlling tunable-white lighting continue to evolve and now include some important developments such as wireless connectivity. One opportunity may be to leverage the rapid pace of progress in the smart-building space. The ZigBee protocol has made some inroads in lighting. LED Engine has tested the tunable-white market with a ZigBee Home Automation (ZHA) enabled tunable-white solution. However, few if any ZHA controllers in the market today are suited for tunable-white applications as they lack the two separate handles for independently controlling intensity and CCT. Bluetooth Low Energy
(BLE) mesh networking promises advantages for tunable-white lighting including an end-to-end solution. Not only is it possible to have two independent control handles for CCT and intensity, the BLE control interface is user friendly, and lights can be controlled by an app on a smart device with touchscreen operation. Secure networks with four levels of access can be set up to control multiple light nodes that extend over large distances without requiring hubs or gateways, and can be controlled from a single terminal with minimal restriction on communication range.
Because all devices on a BLE network can advertise their presence and status, the controlling app can be allowed to access all lighting fixtures and groups of fixtures.
This feature would help in commissioning and managing a network of tunable light fixtures in a commercial environment spread across several f loors. Moreover, autonomous coordination between nodes and the ability to incorporate input from sensors, would provide the opportunity to implement advanced features such as activating lights in sequence as a person walks along a corridor. LuxiTune with the BLE mesh option can incorporate all these advantages for luminaire developers.
The market for tunable-white lighting may yet be too young for manufacturers to back one wireless option over another. One effective way to give luminaire product developers the flexibility to have multiple connectivity choices is a modular design. You can realize a f lexible scenario by having a basic 0–10V driver that works with different modular control boards such as in the tunable-white light engine shown in Fig. 4. This allows a tunable-white solution to be assembled and commissioned with minimal effort by plugging the chosen control module into headers on the basic driver board.
Future of dynamic lighting Lighting designers, luminaire manufacturers, and end users have become familiar with the effects that can be achieved by dynamic white lighting. The market is now ready to accept tunable-white lighting products capable of supporting even more varied effects. Some products have already been successfully realized. Other aspects need to come fully into place, such as the realization that dynamic lighting offers quantifiable benefits for applications in retail, healthcare, hospitality, commercial, and education. Control options for tunable white can be simplified with improvements such as BLE mesh, and intuitive controls are the key to enabling this exciting technology to deliver its full potential.
http://www.ledengin.com/files/articles/tunable_white_colors_control.pdf
Budies 101
Well-Known Member
I'll wait a couple bins to come out if it's really that small of an upgrade... Unless they are super cheap for hundreds. I doubt you would even notice a difference even measuring PPFD an all that. If they are more $ I'd look at adding a few more 561c to make up the cost difference and get better spread of light and possibly even be more efficient than the new chips.
Just my opinion.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
long story short, abil;ity to mix spectrum from 3000k - 6500K is desired to create the best environment for people and plants.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
I think you are right. Samsung is coming out with the 5000k and bringing out the 32000k later in the year or early next year.