AN or Humbolt Nutrients?

BenRipped said:

That's a fair informantive statement I can respect, goes alot farther in people's mind than that the previous statement of "dumb newbs".

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people take offence to the "dumb newbie" label, I don't think it's a bad label, being a newbie acknowledges the fact you don't know it all and are open to advice. We all started somewhere and I meant no offence with the newbie quote but ya can't polish a turd.

Jbone77 said:

Of course expensive store bought synthetic nutes work in soil, but Jack's does the exact same thing and you don't pay for water. Better yet brew teas and have killer organic bud.

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But JBone, Ben is trying to teach you how to use nutes, He just got here and NOW he wants to tell you how great AN is and not to listen to these guys who try and save people money. If you don't buy AN, you are a poor piece of shit who doesn't know how to grow.

chuck estevez said:

But JBone, Ben is trying to teach you how to use nutes, He just got here and NOW he wants to tell you how great AN is and not to listen to these guys who try and save people money. If you don't buy AN, you are a poor piece of shit who doesn't know how to grow.

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lol, Roger that, don't know what I was thinkin.

chuck estevez said:

But JBone, Ben is trying to teach you how to use nutes, He just got here and NOW he wants to tell you how great AN is and not to listen to these guys who try and save people money. If you don't buy AN, you are a poor piece of shit who doesn't know how to grow.

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So says the pot calling the kettle black.......

Jbone77 said:

Call it a tangent, it doesn't bother me, the simple fact remains, if you buy expensive synthetic nutes(AN, Dynagro, GH, etc) to grow in soil you are dumb. Any basic soil with a dash of lime and fed with Jack's or even miracle grow is all you need. Hydro nutes are meant for hydro, do they work in soil? Of course they do. Does that make them a good choice? No. You know that

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First of all, AN has no business being lumped in with DynaGro in terms of price. I agree with the bolded statement above but DG is cheaper than jacks. Check the math below:

1 tsp/gal of Jacks is kind of the standard dose, no? A 1.5lb tub cost $15 and contains 148 tsp scoops (681 grams / 4.6 grams/tsp). That makes the 1 tsp/gal dose about 10 cents.

Foliage Pro is $50/gal. 1tsp/gal is too potent for my tastes but for the sake of this example we'll run with that number. There are 756 doses in 1 gallon (3780mls / 5mls) making each dose 6 cents ($50 / 756 doses).

I run FP with promix but if a beginner running a personal medical grow wanted results from the start, ffof and a light, occasional dose of foliage pro would kill it. So would Jacks, it's just a little more expensive unless you buy 10lbs at a time for $40 (4 cents per dose). Even then, that Foliage pro dose of 1tsp/gal could easily be cut in half.

I'm not here to argue about price, I'm talking about ease of use and guaranteed results for beginners. The soil in that scenario is by far the most expensive input.

Any newbie who starts their first indoor in Soil is probably a idiot as well.
No offense to anyone.
There are a lot of things a "Newbie" can do that classifies them as someone who didn't do research before they started to grow.
Starting your first grow in soil is asking for trouble, nutrients have nothing to do with it.
Newbs don't do PH, PPM, Wet/Dry cycle, or even know what they're putting in their feed.

They just buy bottles and grow. In my opinion it's not so much what you buy and what you use, but what you know, and how you grow.

I just waked and baked so that might have not mad any sense

Cannabis.Is.Free said:

Any newbie who starts their first indoor in Soil is probably a idiot as well.
No offense to anyone.
There are a lot of things a "Newbie" can do that classifies them as someone who didn't do research before they started to grow.
Starting your first grow in soil is asking for trouble, nutrients have nothing to do with it.
Newbs don't do PH, PPM, Wet/Dry cycle, or even know what they're putting in their feed.

They just buy bottles and grow. In my opinion it's not so much what you buy and what you use, but what you know, and how you grow.

I just waked and baked so that might have not mad any sense

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Amen, ++++++++++++rep

chuck estevez said:

Amen, ++++++++++++rep

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WTF did I say now to warrant deletion? I thought I was being nice,
Fucking vaginas.

I mean seriously, wtf was innapropriate?

This fucking sight has turned into a joke, if you say anything negative about Dynagro or led they delete it, you are a bunch of vaginas, I said nothing innapropriate. Enjoy deleting this post you silly felatio givers .

First off, I hate the term "synthetic nutes" (sorry Jbone). When using soil, bacteria need a source of NH4+ they can convert to NO3-. Plants can take up both NH4+ and NO3-, but greatly prefer NO3-. The nitrifying bacteria regulate the NO3- level. When it gets to high, it slows down (nobody likes waste).

The reason it makes no sense to use hydro nutes in soil is because hydro nutes provide almost 100% of the N as NO3-, thus there is no food for bacteria and no reason for them to exist anyway. If you feed your soil with 100% of your N as NO3-, you may as well use a hydroponic medium, because your soil is already lifeless.

As for these welfare growers, I can grow cheaper with hydro than they can grow with dirt. Calcium nitrate is about 2-3 dollars a pound. Indoor dirt is a luxury when compared with hydroponics.

Piss is high in urea (go figure) and other minerals, so it could theoretically be used to provide nitrogen, but like i said, this urea would need time to broken down and used by bacteria to get the NO3- level up.

BenRipped said:

synthetic nutes can be used in soil with great results but since soil is already dirty you are paying a preimum for highly cleaned refined materials. synthetic does not mean can't be used in soil. There's alot of bad info on these forums from these welfare growers that have a fixed income and are forced to shit in a pot for the compost materials. Don't let them convince you all you need to do is piss on your plants cause that shit doesn't work and they want you to fail.

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churchhaze said:

First off, I hate the term "synthetic nutes" (sorry Jbone). When using soil, bacteria need a source of NH4+ they can convert to NO3-. Plants can take up both NH4+ and NO3-, but greatly prefer NO3-. The nitrifying bacteria regulate the NO3- level. When it gets to high, it slows down (nobody likes waste).

The reason it makes no sense to use hydro nutes in soil is because hydro nutes provide almost 100% of the N as NO3-, thus there is no food for bacteria and no reason for them to exist anyway. If you feed your soil with 100% of your N as NO3-, you may as well use a hydroponic medium, because your soil is already lifeless.

As for these welfare growers, I can grow cheaper with hydro than they can grow with dirt. Calcium nitrate is about 2-3 dollars a pound. Indoor dirt is a luxury when compared with hydroponics.

Piss is high in urea (go figure) and other minerals, so it could theoretically be used to provide nitrogen, but like i said, this urea would need time to broken down and used by bacteria to get the NO3- level up.

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A lot of information that will literally do you no good in my opinion.

I hate the word "welfare growers"
Doesn't really make sense to me.

So in order to be a non welfare grower, we need to purchase the most expensive nutrients available, and buy into the hype of good marketed nutrients? That is what it seems like when you call someone a welfare grower.
I can literally buy multiple grows worth of plant food for $15.
Additives in 1Lt bottles from AN for $10-25 per bottle (Depending on the nutrient) and can last me multiple grows as well.

I maybe spent $50 on nutrients that will last me over 2 years if not more and my plants look lovely. (At least I think so)

Shit I spend more in one day in cab fares, food, stupid apps, etc.

I know I've said this before on other threads, but I just wanted to make it clear that Jack's classic and dyna-gro are not analogous products. Dyna-gro is mostly nitrate based while Jack's classic is mostly urea based.

Also, I question whether something that is 20-20-20 is really more expensive than 9-3-6, but again, apples to oranges. I'll go through the math after I get back from this trip.

If you want a product like Jack's professional hydroponics for cheaper, try Hydro-gro from cropking. It's 4.5-14-34, nitrate based, and only needs to be mixed with calcium nitrate (like jacks professional), and mono potassium phosphate for extra P. I've never tried it myself, but I wanted to throw out some cheaper alternatives, that really are the same thing. (not an alternative to jack's classic, but one to Jack's professional hydroponics, and dyna-gro).

http://www.cropking.com/HydroponicSupplies/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=264_265&zenid=9accda486a967136a6e62822eb252d01

Jbone77 said:

This fucking sight has turned into a joke, if you say anything negative about Dynagro or led they delete it, you are a bunch of vaginas, I said nothing innapropriate. Enjoy deleting this post you silly felatio givers .

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Don't feel to bad, I got accidentally banned today.

I dont feel to bad, i enjoy pussy but there is way to many fuck ass vaginas on here. Sorry for my contributjon you fucking vaginas.&

churchhaze said:

First off, I hate the term "synthetic nutes" (sorry Jbone). When using soil, bacteria need a source of NH4+ they can convert to NO3-. Plants can take up both NH4+ and NO3-, but greatly prefer NO3-. The nitrifying bacteria regulate the NO3- level. When it gets to high, it slows down (nobody likes waste).

The reason it makes no sense to use hydro nutes in soil is because hydro nutes provide almost 100% of the N as NO3-, thus there is no food for bacteria and no reason for them to exist anyway. If you feed your soil with 100% of your N as NO3-, you may as well use a hydroponic medium, because your soil is already lifeless.

As for these welfare growers, I can grow cheaper with hydro than they can grow with dirt. Calcium nitrate is about 2-3 dollars a pound. Indoor dirt is a luxury when compared with hydroponics.

Piss is high in urea (go figure) and other minerals, so it could theoretically be used to provide nitrogen, but like i said, this urea would need time to broken down and used by bacteria to get the NO3- level up.

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Dont apologize, I agree.

Cannabis.Is.Free said:

A lot of information that will literally do you no good in my opinion.

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Wrong, it will do YOU no good. It does me plenty good. Chemistry isn't useless.

Cannabis.Is.Free said:

I can literally buy multiple grows worth of plant food for $15.

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You can literally get 50 pounds of calcium nitrate for around 30 dollars. That's a lifetime supply for most hydroponics growers.

Cannabis.Is.Free said:

Additives in 1Lt bottles from AN for $10-25 per bottle (Depending on the nutrient) and can last me multiple grows as well.

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Don't get additives in bottles, get them in plastic bags.

churchhaze said:

Wrong, it will do YOU no good. It does me plenty good. Chemistry isn't useless.




You can literally get 50 pounds of calcium nitrate for around 30 dollars. That's a lifetime supply for most hydroponics growers.





Don't get additives in bottles, get them in plastic bags.

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I agree with you actually, for the most part.
That information won't do most people good is what I should have said. Even if I was growing hydroponically, I don't think I would need that information to get by. All I'm saying is it isn't necessary if you're not a super advanced hydro grower, growing is simple enough, hydro just needs better attention and math skills.
Sadly I don't do DWC though, some people would call me lazy for not wanting to learn it, others would think it's overrated, personal choice.
Now that you mention it though, I'm gonna do some window shopping for bags of nutrients in raw form to possibly make my own tea like some people on here do.
Seems like I'm going to have an extremely long read tomorrow.

Jbone77 said:

Of course expensive store bought synthetic nutes work in soil, but Jack's does the exact same thing and you don't pay for water. Better yet brew teas and have killer organic bud.

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exactly. you can make an effective tea that hardly costs anything except for a watchful eye and a few dollars. and teas can go as rich as you desire, not going overboard of course. but you see my girls. a product mainly of a finely tuned compost tea that's pretty fkn good and organic base maybe once per ten days to 2 weeks....taste is hard to beat...

Jbone77 said:

This fucking sight has turned into a joke, if you say anything negative about Dynagro or led they delete it, you are a bunch of vaginas, I said nothing innapropriate. Enjoy deleting this post you silly felatio givers .

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lol roflmao ....right on