Ayone had problems with Indonesian Bat Guano?

wyteboi said:

they have promix with pine bark in it but i never see that type at the nursery's. only hp and bx. I am pretty sure that pine bark has properties that pure peat moss does not have so that should help to make a good soil.
As far as reusing , i think it will continue to get better because the peat and other organic matter gets broken down more and more until it is humus , just like WC and compost. eventually it will turn into a rich soil.
"cooking" the soil and reusing is probably the best thing to do no matter what. (for organics)

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When I started with this mix I was growing rare ferns and another fern guy showed me the recipe. Very acidic and the pine bark helped make it even more so, but that's just what ferns love.

Found out about the lime right quick when I started growing other things.

The ferns didn't seem to mind, but with everything else, the more broken down it got, the better it worked.

Letting it cook or age really helps, but I've seen recently that adding the worm castings with all their good bacteria REALLY helps the process along.

Before I started my worm bin I was just adding the meals and that worked ok, but the castings made a big difference in it breaking down.

Wet

Wetdog said:

When I started with this mix I was growing rare ferns and another fern guy showed me the recipe. Very acidic and the pine bark helped make it even more so, but that's just what ferns love.

Found out about the lime right quick when I started growing other things.

The ferns didn't seem to mind, but with everything else, the more broken down it got, the better it worked.

Letting it cook or age really helps, but I've seen recently that adding the worm castings with all their good bacteria REALLY helps the process along.

Before I started my worm bin I was just adding the meals and that worked ok, but the castings made a big difference in it breaking down.

Wet

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Thanks for the info wet!
So is the pine acidic too? also one Q about ferns. I have one that hates me , do u think it will like the peat moss strait?

wyteboi said:

Thanks for the info wet!
So is the pine acidic too? also one Q about ferns. I have one that hates me , do u think it will like the peat moss strait?

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No, but add some more perlite to some promix (they like it light and moist), and a 1-1-1 fert and I'll bet she loves you then.

WOW ... Did this thread get jacked or what?

Wet

I know the blueberry growers, (they need reaaaally acidic medium) like pine bark nuggets. And theres a popular rumor pine needles are acidic. Not true from what I hear from people I would trust. I figure for plants potted up a long time they might help provide more humus or something as they break down. Although most of potting soil is humus. Compared to real dirt.

Cant believe I killed my girls. Should I harvest before they rot or wilt more or something?

The one only other thing I can say is maybe the hydro store I bought the stuff from poisened it. The guy was a dick and I left it on the counter forever while he was doing something with the register for me. Long story but it was a big hassle I went thru with them to order something so maybe they wanted retribution?

Nutrient lock sucks and yes pH is important, I grow DWC so pH testing is really important to me... I never used to bother but then I saw the results when I did, it was an easy decision to make...

If you are going to grow organic and use soil.. Why don't you try Canna Terra Professional medium and BioCanna Vega and Flora? You can still use boost products like PK 13-14 but the medium is pest and mite resistant, and Canna is set and forget... I'm a bit of a Canna Whore, cause it works so well.. I am doing my first outdoor grow this summer in Oz and I am going to use all the above mentioned products...Only because the Terra Prof. is scientifically put together to monitor its own pH... How clever is that..???
But all this means spending more money and you probably don't want to do that...

Laceygirl....

If you are going to cut them down.... Cut them off at the stem and leave them in a big plain water bucket for about 5-6 days and let them drink nothing but water, so at least you can sort of flush them and maybe still salvage some good smoke out of it... I broke some stems off my widow a couple of weeks ago accidentally, and I didn't want to throw them away so I just stuck them in a big glass of water and presto a week later the smoke wasn't so chemical...

I feel for you dude... Laceygirl...

yea what she said, plus chop them in the middle of the night. I dont know if its just me or a myth , but years ago i read something in high times saying that all the food stays in the dirt at night then in the morning all the food slowly travels back up into the stems and flowers. I have always picked um at night since then..... it seems to take away the need for a flush , but the shit may just be real good , and i might be imaginin things?

I sure in the fuck hope the hydro guy didnt fuck u around like that.. When something dies that quick , it is a poison. (i cant say what did it but something either poisoned or something built up to form a poison? From what i have seen it is very hard to overdo any meals because i think they just sit in the dirt until the soil food web uses um.
YES PH IS IMPORTANT, but in dirt it is very hard to change, without repoting.
Sorry bout the loss Biness....
wb

So these purple indicas are just finally turning purple but Im doing it bad to these now! DAMMIT. I used the guano last almost a month ago and finally was sure it was messing them up so I flushed a little and stopped it. These were coming along ok. A week or two ago I fed them a little of everything I use (except the guano) and they looked a little better. So thinking maybe they do need more N I gave them a water and some more fish emulsion a few days ago. Now they are really dying. The leaf tips are curling as if the fish emulsion burned them even tho theyre still chlorotic. Some leaves get almost white. Making me think maybe Fe? But its mainly the older leaves. Some of the lower bud leaves look great. Maybe Magnesium? Ive given them a little epsoms and molasses. Maybe not enough.

You really need to get a pH meter. Those ones you stick in the soil are less than useless and the soil itself can vary widely from spot to spot within the pot.

I use something better, but even one of those cheapy $20 pH pens off ebay will be better than what you are using. www.eseasongear.com has the best prices and most makes and models. They are also in eBay, same name.

Measure your runoff water, not the soil.

It really looks like you have serious lockout problems along with the over nuteing. Really have to get that under control first, one thing at the time, and the first item would be getting your pH right, then on to the next problem.

Wet

top dress your plants with garden lime dont be scared to use it.... and water the crap out of them.
two products i like to use that ive helped my babys with when i locked em out. earth juice micro blast..and ANs revive. damn good product.
if you are growing in any kind of soil garden lime the shit out of it. any type of salt based nutes lower the PH of your soil and your plants will hate you.
ive never OVER garden limed soil. it also has calcium in it.
good luck

businessmen said:

So these purple indicas are just finally turning purple but Im doing it bad to these now! DAMMIT. I used the guano last almost a month ago and finally was sure it was messing them up so I flushed a little and stopped it. These were coming along ok. A week or two ago I fed them a little of everything I use (except the guano) and they looked a little better. So thinking maybe they do need more N I gave them a water and some more fish emulsion a few days ago. Now they are really dying. The leaf tips are curling as if the fish emulsion burned them even tho theyre still chlorotic. Some leaves get almost white. Making me think maybe Fe? But its mainly the older leaves. Some of the lower bud leaves look great. Maybe Magnesium? Ive given them a little epsoms and molasses. Maybe not enough.

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If you really want to fix these business man, then you need to stop dicking around with all these weird fertilizers...You're going to have to spend some cash to save them... To put it bluntly, your ratios for feeding suck... You don't want to be guessing what they are getting as you don't know what they need, that's obvious... Buy some Canna Bio Organic nutrient , Cannazym, Canna Rhizotonic and get some Canna coco and repot those things... Rinse the coco well with 5.8 pH water first... Use 35% perlite with it so you get good drainage.. Then we have eliminated any problems there... Repot your babies and give them a drench with the Bio Canna Rhizotonic and Cannazym, and wait two days.. Then drench them again... Its the only way I would go to bring them back... You need a feeding regime that will not keep the plant see-sawing from one extreme to the other... If you want to grow organic, then BioCanna is the way to go.... Please message me with any questions, I will help in anyway I can, but what you are doing now isn't working...

Sorry dude... Laceygirl...

Thanks for the advice lacey. I cant imagine repotting a plant that should be ready in a few weeks though. Dont think they even grow new roots. What do I rip off the old soil? If that doesnt kill em I dont know what would.

max420thc said:

top dress your plants with garden lime dont be scared to use it.... and water the crap out of them.
two products i like to use that ive helped my babys with when i locked em out. earth juice micro blast..and ANs revive. damn good product.
if you are growing in any kind of soil garden lime the shit out of it. any type of salt based nutes lower the PH of your soil and your plants will hate you.
ive never OVER garden limed soil. it also has calcium in it.
good luck

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For sure on that! I've UNDER limed more than a few times, but never OVER limed.

Get the powdered dolomitic lime at Lowes or HD. NOT hydrated lime, you can burn with that stuff. As was said, top dress and water the crap out of them to get it down in there.

I think it's a little late in the grow to do what LacyGirl suggest, but I'd sure listen for the next grow..

Wet

Im just thinking in my area I dont know about liming. Ive been using mostly tap. My water report says theyre PPM of TDS is about 1000. I dont remember calcium specifically. Im thinking of flushing again and giving some epsoms. Maybe foliarly. But I dont know if I want that on the buds. I never used to use epsoms but the only thing that makes sense is Mg deficiency. Or maybe N is locked out somehow. I dunno, maybe I damaged roots somehow with over fert and they cant take up N now? SHit its gotta b sever Mg need for some reason.

lime will PH out the soil and will not let the PH go above 7... so many problems are caused by PH problems..your plant cant uptake the micro nutes it needs unless the PH is right and basicly poisons your plant.stop feeding them...flush them with ph water and lime(most utility water PH is around 7.after you flush with lime drop some earth juice micro blast or AN revive on them.
it will not completely repair the damage but you will see them start to throw green again and straighten out some. good luck

Hey everyone. Ive been watching this thread because it seems like Ive been having some of the same problems that other people have been having.

Im certainly confused right now as my problems seem to be coming from either 1)overwatering, or 2)ph lockout.

I guess it could be that my ratios are off, but Im pretty sure my recipe is good.

I use FFOF soil, which is good for the most part, but it stays wet for a REALLY long time. I should have added perlite, but I didnt.

So, here are my questions:

1)I have some plants that are 5 inches tall, up to 18 inches right now, all in veg. I was thinking of repotting in sunshine mix with earthworm castings and perlite mixed in(??). Is it possible to repot a pretty big plant like that? HOw do I do it without killing it or killing the roots?

2)I usually have my PH on my soil at 7 solid. I use a soil tester, and I know they are not very accurate, but my soil is CONSTANTLY at 6.8-7 by that meter. I ph my reservoir to about 5.8-6 whenever I feed.

3) I usually do Feed, water, water. I usually water 2 times a week, maybe 3. I think I have been using too much water each time I water, so Im going to cut down to allow it to dry more between waterings and see if that helps.

4)now my recipe:

for my base i either use the GH 3-part (in veg), or House and Garden 2 part soil (in flower). I add greenfuse, carbo load, cal mag(with the GH, not the H&G), and sometimes humic acid supplement. I also have this seaweed iron supplement I use sparingly. That is during veg, in flower I add cha-ching and floranectar, and budswel. The recipe has been good to me so far, its just been on this batch that I have been experiencing some problems.

Finally, the deficiencies are manifesting themselves as yellowing on new leaves, and some yellow on older leaves, with brown spots. Some dryness and crispy on older leaves. Newer leaves are nice and soft and mostly green, with a yellow tinge. I am at a loss and dont know what to do. Someone please help!!

businessmen said:

Thanks for the advice lacey. I cant imagine repotting a plant that should be ready in a few weeks though. Dont think they even grow new roots. What do I rip off the old soil? If that doesnt kill em I dont know what would.

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Bottom line, you don't know what the plants are seeing regarding NPK and micros and pH. What you can (and should) do is pop one out and have a look at the root system. Your soil structure may be the pits.

Good luck,
UB

Top dressing with dolomite lime won't help at this point....

You need it mixed thoroughly in the soil for it to really take effect.

I use guano's all the time and don't really have problems. They are strong though and I think best used as tea or a slight scratch in. And people using PH meters in soil don't have their mix perfected. Unless your water source is way out of wack a good mix will buffer and take up nutrients at a variety of ph levels.

Here is what works for me, and it's not like I invented this mix:

60% Pro Mix (or FFOF if that's what you have)
20% EWC (or mushroom compost/homemade compost)
20% Perlite

And I add 2 TBS POWDERED Dolomite lime per gallon. It must be powdered for best results. (or 1 cup per CF mix). The lime mainly adds much needed Mg/Ca plus helps with the acidic peat. Most companies like Fox Farms or Pro Mix don't add enough in the peat based mixes.

Even cheaper is using 5 Parts pure sphagnum peat moss
3 parts perlite and 2 parts EWC/Compost..... With the same amount of lime stated above.

With these mixes you should not get any ph problems as they are proven. They are also nearly impossible to over water in later stages of the plants life.

These mixes are great for starting seeds/clones as they have very minor nutrients and you can feed them in a variety of way's and control what they get. I use areated compost teas and guano with kelp to feed.