Experienced Electrician! Here to Answer Any and All Growroom Electrical Questions

1ostbo1z · Nov 12, 2009

wyteboi said:
one 60amp panel is not enough for 8000 and both 60 amp panels is pushin it if u plan on living there....appliances....ect...
plus A/C for all them lights.
now if u run them all 220 (thats 16 breaker spaces) then u can do it. thats just alot of light for 80! i would say 4 1000's topps. do u have 16 available spots in your breaker boxes ?

nope i dont have enough space in the breaker box.it could only fit a total of 6 breakers in there. so there is no way i can change the amperage to 100amps on that 6 gauge so that i can run all 8 lites. i freakn set everything up and now probably have to take it down.

oh this might not b the appropriate place to ask but if i have a closed room with lights, exhaust fans and ac running do i still have to have fresh air going in to the room?

Mr.Therapy Man · Nov 12, 2009

Hey bro,Ive got a juice box that buzzes lately and Ive had more watts running than Im running now.My question is why is this started buzzing louder lately and how dangerous is this?......peace

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

Mr.Therapy Man said:
Hey bro,Ive got a juice box that buzzes lately and Ive had more watts running than Im running now.My question is why is this started buzzing louder lately and how dangerous is this?......peace

im sorry im stupid but whats a juice box? the fridge? or a chiller?

Mr.Therapy Man · Nov 12, 2009

Breakerbox that runs the power to your home!

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

bmiquet said:
wyteboi

You hit the nail on the head

1 2
3 4
5 6
7 8

is the breaker formation in the box. 1,2,5,6 work fine and the other four don't. I am going to get a tester tomorrow, but I assume your hypothesis is true. Assuming so what would I do next?

Thanks

sorry it took so long , but u have "blew" one phase of your panel . If u were to test the main breaker , only one side is gonna be putting out 120 volts, the other side will be "dead" or not reading right.
To fix we must have a tester (that reads how many volts) i need to know where exactly we "lost" the second phase?
First with leather or rubber gloves , turn main breaker off and then back on ...... the movement might be enough to turn it back on, or the main breaker might just be bad.
cause when one side of a 2 pole breaker "pops" then both sides should "pop".
Is this 100 amp panel a sub ? (coming off another panel)... if so we want to check the breaker feeding your 100 and the big wires going to/from the 100. usally if u look close enough u will find the problem. now if this is your only panel in the house then the problem may be in the meter base outside ? come back when u have a tester.........
(dont forget the big wires feeding your 100 amp panel are hot no matter if u shut off the 100 amp breaker)

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

Mr.Therapy Man said:
Breakerbox that runs the power to your home!

<--- me

alright we do not want ANY buzzing coming from the box. if it dont bother u , then turn off each breaker one by one until u find out which is buzzing. "Buzzing" is ussally the first sign of a fire .... no joke. the buzzing u hear is more then likely , sizzling or arcing , probably caused by a bad/loose breaker . U NEED to get on that one...
let me know how it goes bongsmilie

curioushiker · Nov 12, 2009

Roland said:
80 % applies to continuous loads ... since your lights are on for mor than 3 straight hours you shoildn't exceed 80% of that circuit breakers maximum amperage

I don't think the chiller wold be considered continuously running ... the pump might be

U CAN get breakers that are rated for continuous maximum alllowable load .. is that including 220/230 V lighting ? ... 80 amps is a LOT of power

a 2 hp chiller = 760W x 2 = 1520 Watts ...@ 220 V .... 1520/220 = 6.9 amps

The figure I came up with was TOTAL amps. This includes any future expansion if I decided to go that route.
If I did go with a chiller it would undoubtedly be installed outside so I would at that point wire it into the main panel with a dedicated breaker.
Depending on the light cycles some equipment would be on and off at different times but would overlap on the on cycles. (hope that makes sense)

curioushiker · Nov 12, 2009

Wytboi and Roland, just wanted to thank you guys again for helping us out. I know it can be riskiy giving out this info but I am betting you guys may have already saved some of us from disaster.
Thanks again for helping us out.

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

curioushiker said:
The figure I came up with was TOTAL amps. This includes any future expansion if I decided to go that route.
If I did go with a chiller it would undoubtedly be installed outside so I would at that point wire it into the main panel with a dedicated breaker.
Depending on the light cycles some equipment would be on and off at different times but would overlap on the on cycles. (hope that makes sense)

then u will be fine , if u did ur math right. the way u put it , the only time u will ever hit 80 amps is during the "overlap" so u are fine like that. you are not in the fire hazard range . especially if everything is new , wires breakers ect.....
(if i planned on 80 amps i would upgrade to a 200 amp service but thats just me tryin to save a couple bucks on the bill , not much but a little......... its not necessary to upgrade , i am just sayin what i would do... :bigjoint:

)

curioushiker · Nov 12, 2009

wyteboi said:
then u will be fine , if u did ur math right. the way u put it , the only time u will ever hit 80 amps is during the "overlap" so u are fine like that. you are not in the fire hazard range . especially if everything is new , wires breakers ect.....
(if i planned on 80 amps i would upgrade to a 200 amp service but thats just me tryin to save a couple bucks on the bill , not much but a little......... its not necessary to upgrade , i am just sayin what i would do...)

You mean upgrade my sub panel to a 200 amp? My main is a 200 amp already. I was thinking that I should have gone with a 125 amp sub panel.

curioushiker · Nov 12, 2009

sorry for the ignorance. How does the higher amp panel save money?

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

curioushiker said:
sorry for the ignorance. How does the higher amp panel save money?

i dont think YOU can upgrade to 200 with a 200 main , but u can go 125.
The less resistance , the lower the bill .
this is very hard to explain but here goes:

IF u were to use every other breaker in the box , then u would be putting all your load on one phase of the power .... which puts a huge load on your neutral wire. so if one of your phases is only using 2 amps and the other one is using 40 amps then the load on the neutral should be 38 amps. which will make your bill alot higher then, say one phase is using 20 amps and the other phase is using 22 amps that means the load on your neutral is only 2 amps. thats alot less resistance which means a little less bill. (disclaimer: i am not a "master" i am just a residential electrician so i still have alot to learn , so im sorry if my info is hard to understand or if i am not 100% right )
maybe roland/bigballs can help me here.....

JohnQPub · Nov 12, 2009

JohnQPub said:
Had a question or two for whoever wishes to chime in.

I'm bringing in a 100A sub-panel into my basement with a #2 Aluminum feeder line. The main has 200A service, 20A of which is being used at any given time.

The first picture is of the sub-panel. My first questions are:

1. I couldn't fit the entire ground wire into one screw port, so I split it over two on the bus. Will this cause issues?

2. Should I cut the hot leads so they don't bow outwards or is my current setup alright?

As for the main panel, I plan to remove an unused 50A double pole breaker (as circled) and replace it with a 100A of the same brand to feed the basement.

1. I think I may be out of room for a ground/neutral line, how can I find which of them is unused?

2. Any foreseeable issues with this arrangement?

Thanks in advance.

No one wants to ring in? :sad:

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

JohnQPub said:
Had a question or two for whoever wishes to chime in.

I'm bringing in a 100A sub-panel into my basement with a #2 Aluminum feeder line. The main has 200A service, 20A of which is being used at any given time.

The first picture is of the sub-panel. My first questions are:

1. I couldn't fit the entire ground wire into one screw port, so I split it over two on the bus. Will this cause issues?

No it should not cause issues , but an inspector wouldn't like it. (It FITS its just a bitch sometimes, u have to take the screw all the way out so u can see what u are doing and of course the wire has to be nice an tight "perfect cut", but u are just fine like u are :bigjoint:

)

JohnQPub said:
2. Should I cut the hot leads so they don't bow outwards or is my current setup alright?

just gently push them back in the box as far as u can. (just gives more room to work with all the wires comin in)
i would leave it just like that , it gives u extra room for future remodels/new panels an shit.

JohnQPub said:
As for the main panel, I plan to remove an unused 50A double pole breaker (as circled) and replace it with a 100A of the same brand to feed the basement.

1. I think I may be out of room for a ground/neutral line, how can I find which of them is unused?

not really sure what u are saying? are u asking how to find a spot in the old box for your #2 neutral ? they make an adapter to add a bigger wire to those lil spaces, also u could just do like u did on the 100 amp...an split it up. If u have no empty spots on the ground/neutral bar then u can take and put 2 of the existing ones in one space to free up space. (you can put 2 wires under one screw IF they are both the same gauge wire , this apply's to 14, and 12 gauge wire only) example: 1 12 wire and 1 14 wire can not go under same screw.

JohnQPub said:
2. Any foreseeable issues with this arrangement?

Thanks in advance.

looks good to me :joint:

JohnQPub · Nov 12, 2009

wyteboi said:
No it should not cause issues , but an inspector wouldn't like it. (It FITS its just a bitch sometimes, u have to take the screw all the way out so u can see what u are doing and of course the wire has to be nice an tight "perfect cut", but u are just fine like u are )

just gently push them back in the box as far as u can. (just gives more room to work with all the wires comin in)
i would leave it just like that , it gives u extra room for future remodels/new panels an shit.

not really sure what u are saying? are u asking how to find a spot in the old box for your #2 neutral ? they make an adapter to add a bigger wire to those lil spaces, also u could just do like u did on the 100 amp...an split it up. If u have no empty spots on the ground/neutral bar then u can take and put 2 of the existing ones in one space to free up space. (you can put 2 wires under one screw IF they are both the same gauge wire , this apply's to 14, and 12 gauge wire only) example: 1 12 wire and 1 14 wire can not go under same screw.

looks good to me

Thanks so much. May all your grows be bountiful. bongsmilie

Gorgonic · Nov 12, 2009

Hey brickhouse. My first post on the board. Right now I'm researching the best way to do this. My question is one aimed at reducing evidence by means of power records that could be accessed by local police and used to get a search warrant. I've read that though it isn't routinely released information, power companies can track spikes in power usage that could indicate lights powering on and off cyclicly.

I've looked into generators and emergency backup storage devices. They are mostly expensive and the cheaper ones have a short lived supply. I don't expect you to tell me all the nuts and bolts but is there a direction you can point me, assuming its effective, for a home built power storage system, one that would capture power in a constant state? My uneducated guess is that a person could draw from the battery bank and this would eliminate the power spikes as would exist in a direct power flow.

Hope I have explained this properly. Cheers, gorgo

wyteboi · Nov 12, 2009

Gorgonic said:
power companies can track spikes in power usage that could indicate lights powering on and off cyclicly.

the only thing they can read is how much power u use every month not every "spike"
the only time one worries about the power company is when u have had a very consistent small bill (for years) and then it jumps up to alot (lets say from 50 to 180)
then they might call you and ask you if u know why ur bill is so high . (just to let u know that it is way above normal)
now if your bill is 50 then 150 then 70 then 210 an so on, then they might tip the police that something aint right.
Most of the time when someone gets busted from the power company then it is because they are trying to steal power or do somthing plain stupid. (one example of stupid would be : if they do call and ask u if u know why ur bill is higher then normal , then u say "i leave my lights on at night" or "yea i got 5 computers running" ....... thats just not enough to raise it so then they know ur hiding somthing.
(i know i didnt really answer the question but thats my 1.5 cents on it :bigjoint:

Roland · Nov 12, 2009

curioushiker said:
Oh yeah, and why do I hear so much about "throwing up red flags" if our power bill is too high? If we pay it, and assuming that what we are doing is legal then why worry?
I have read that there is a concern with todays new smart meters.
Is this a valid concern? Are we to believe that the power companies and the law are in cahoots?

haha of course they are ... wyteboi said it right .. in some areas the law has asked the power co's to report increased usage .. then they come by or fly over ... such a relief that Obama told the fed's to back off on medicinal growers ... I hate bein paranoid .... hahahaha

bmiquet said:
wyteboi

You hit the nail on the head

1 2
3 4
5 6
7 8

is the breaker formation in the box. 1,2,5,6 work fine and the other four don't. I am going to get a tester tomorrow, but I assume your hypothesis is true. Assuming so what would I do next?

Thanks

did you look at the main panel ? and reset the breaker that feeds your subpanel ? turn the two pole breaker OFF then back ON ?

JohnQPub said:
.

The first picture is of the sub-panel. My first questions are:

1. I couldn't fit the entire ground wire into one screw port, so I split it over two on the bus. Will this cause issues?

U need a # 2 lug ..that bolts in to your grd Bar ....U can get one wherever u got your sub panel ...it may work .like it is .. but it's sloppy and neatness counts haha

2. Should I cut the hot leads so they don't bow outwards or is my current setup alright?

No .. don't cut the hots back ... let them hang naturally and don't kink them or bend at right angle ... u can bundle them loosely with cable ties if they are bulging too much

As for the main panel, I plan to remove an unused 50A double pole breaker (as circled) and replace it with a 100A of the same brand to feed the basement.

OK .. as long as the wire is rated for 100 amp feeders

1. I think I may be out of room for a ground/neutral line, how can I find which of them is unused?

DO NOT disconnect a neutral .. every neutral in that box MUST be connected to the neutral bar

it is ok to land three same size grounds in one hole ... if u abslolutely HAVE to ... !!! But ,,, the green screw in the low right of your picture has a strap that you can use to add a ground bar

2. Any foreseeable issues with this arrangement?

Thanks in advance.

U need to get a # 2 lug to bolt into the ground bus bar and twist that #2 wire into a single stranded cable .. why did you go with aluminum ? u should use noLox on the wire and be sure the lug is OK for Aluminum ... aluminum has heat issues over time ... I know al. is cheaper ...wyteboi is prob right ... it probably will work the way you have it .... but .... credit is given for more workmanlike work

Roland · Nov 12, 2009

Gorgonic said:
Hey brickhouse. My first post on the board. Right now I'm researching the best way to do this. My question is one aimed at reducing evidence by means of power records that could be accessed by local police and used to get a search warrant. I've read that though it isn't routinely released information, power companies can track spikes in power usage that could indicate lights powering on and off cyclicly.

I've looked into generators and emergency backup storage devices. They are mostly expensive and the cheaper ones have a short lived supply. I don't expect you to tell me all the nuts and bolts but is there a direction you can point me, assuming its effective, for a home built power storage system, one that would capture power in a constant state? My uneducated guess is that a person could draw from the battery bank and this would eliminate the power spikes as would exist in a direct power flow.

Hope I have explained this properly. Cheers, gorgo

A battery storage system requires a battery charger .. then an inverter to convert it back into AC power .. it can be done .. also takes a transfer switch to switch back and forth between inverter and regular supply ... gets expensive

Roland · Nov 12, 2009

Hey wyteboi .. how do you do the multiple answer in a single quote ... ?

Good job keepin' up on things!

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