GD-SDS .Short notice / update..

2 posts today and member since Mar 2009 ?

Weird ...

And this "mkmll" ...

Kinda ...


No...
Probably my imagination ....
It can't be you ....

Anyway ....

i followed you for a long time....

Me ,too ....
¡Hola! ,brother !

...


Photosynthesis driven at setting " R ya crazy,dude ? "

....I have to back -off a bit with the nutes,also...

stardustsailor said:

View attachment 2654688View attachment 2654690View attachment 2654689...


Photosynthesis driven at setting " R ya crazy,dude ? "

....I have to back -off a bit with the nutes,also...

Click to expand...

SDS

The metal plate on top where the fan is...

What type of metal is that and what's the gauge ?

Also..how did you make the hole for the fan ?

Did you use a cobalt screw bit for the fans nuts and screw ?

It is not a metal plate exactly..
It is called " Aluminium composite sheet/panel " ...
A sandwich of Aluminium-polymer -Aluminium ...
Light and way strong ....


...

I oven -paint it with ceramic ( mica iron-oxide ) spray-can paint ,at ~80°C ..
(After ..quite of a few ... "surface preparing & cleaning " procedures...)
....


I've been using the 5-6 mm thickness ...
Now I like more the ~3/4 mm thickness for the cover ...



.....


For making the holes I 've used these :


....


Did you use a cobalt screw bit for the fans nuts and screw ?

I'm not sure that I've understood the question ....
???If you mean screwing/tighten/fasten the screws ? ....
-No I do it by hand..
I like my own brain's torque meter..And the feeling of fastening/tightening ....

Thanks SDS !

A "Cobalt Bit " is a type of bit to go thru steel . I can see from the pics your bit isn't a cobalt bit but it's not needed for
"Aluminium composite sheet/panel ". Cobalt bits are used for steel .

Now I will see if I can find some Aluminium composite sheet/panel .

Thanks and great job !

stardustsailor said:

It is not a metal plate exactly..
It is called " Aluminium composite sheet/panel " ...
A sandwich of Aluminium-polymer -Aluminium ...
Light and way strong ....

...

I oven -paint it with ceramic ( mica iron ) spray-can paint ,at ~80°C
View attachment 2654721....


I've been using the 5-6 mm thickness ...
Now I like more the ~3/4 mm thickness for the cover ...



.....


For making the holes I 've used these :

View attachment 2654728
....


Did you use a cobalt screw bit for the fans nuts and screw ?

I'm not sure that I've understood the question ....
???If you mean screwing/tighten/fasten the screws ? ....
-No I do it by hand..
I like my own brain's torque meter..And the feeling of fastening/tightening ....

Click to expand...

It is used in building construction ..
Here ,lots of(if not most...) Super -Markets ,are totally covered (outside walls ) with that material ...
It costs about ~50$ / square meter ( 9 sqr.feet ) ,for a thickness of 3-4 mm ...

Firstly,I thought it was difficult to obtain ....
(first piece was found in a scrap-yard ...)
In fact ,it was quite easy ....

It became immediately one of my favourest DIY materials ...
Strong ,easy-to-work-with ,lightweight ,corrosion/heat resistant ....


Worth to search for ...


-Most of the bits
(here,at the country I live, when we say "bits " -we say actually "bits"! -
we mean screwdriver-flat,pozidriv,philips,etc- / allen / hex / etc bits that are attached to the electric screwdriver/drill ...

For the drills we say ..drills ....

And "cup-drills " ,the big white ones ...

All of them are HSS-G type (the 'cup-drills' are quite expensive ..) ..
For use in steel ,etc ....(Water cooled and at low rpm ... )

Only the small 3mm drill is made of Cobalt steel ...

Still they make quite "clean-cut" holes on aluminium or soft materials ,with ease ....


Edit: A water -jet computer-controlled cutter,is amongst my most-desired tools ....

And a bit of this "test group grow" 's history .....


22/4 all three seeds germinated .Cotyledons closed .

"Lights " switched on ....

Lights ,were :

-1x Astir panel ,full of Cool Whites 6000-7000 K ..
(24x 8mm Seoul type,asian leds at ~320mA )

-1x GD-SDS box (flowering type ) with only two of the three led arrays ,working ...

( 8x hyper reds LH CP7P T3 & 16 x LCW CQ7P.CC JTKP( => lower photometric power bins ) -5U8X(=> 2700 K ) )


Lights remained like this until 5/5 ....


( In fact at 4/5 two GD-flowering boxes,full working ,were installed and the "Astir full of CW",remained in situ )


Growth was realllllyyyy slooooooowwwwwww.........
Too much blue ....
PS rates ,dropped down, to almost zero ....
Well it seemed so ....
"Freezed " ,there ....
From 22/4 up to ~5/5 ,growth rate was really low / slow ....
Like ...Winter Sleep ....
If you know what I mean ....


At 6/5 complete system of three GD-SDS boxes system ,took over

Today ,is one week later ,under the system's light ....

7 days ,under those 108 Oslons ....

Plants just exploded ...

-Topping done at 7/5 ....

-Plus the light induced -stressing, of the re-adaptation to a new spectrum of light..

(plus some always-mysterious leaf curling/drying up ....)

Still.....

KA-Boooooommmmm!!!!!! )

We say "Hole Saw" which is "Cup Drill" to you .

stardustsailor said:

2 posts today and member since Mar 2009 ?

Weird ...

And this "mkmll" ...

Kinda ...


No...
Probably my imagination ....
It can't be you ....

Anyway ....

i followed you for a long time....

Me ,too ....
¡Hola! ,brother !

Click to expand...

yes weird..

i follow this and other mmj forums carefully. i learned a lot skills on forums, especially here.

and actually i dont like too much unnecessary talk

thanks for interest again

mkmll said:

yes weird..

i follow this and other mmj forums carefully. i learned a lot skills on forums, especially here.

and actually i dont like too much unnecessary talk

thanks for interest again

Click to expand...

Got it ....
I ask for apologies ,about the much unnecessary talk..
Respected ....

Your Welcome,brother ...

......

stardustsailor said:

Growth was realllllyyyy slooooooowwwwwww.........
Too much blue ....
PS rates ,dropped down, to almost zero ....
Well it seemed so ....
"Freezed " ,there ....
From 22/4 up to ~5/5 ,growth rate was really low / slow ....
Like ...Winter Sleep ....
If you know what I mean ....

Click to expand...

Did you check your plants roots...? How about that ?

mkmll said:

Did you check your plants roots...? How about that ?

Click to expand...

Please ," break that into pieces", for me ....
What exactly do you mean ?

? ...How exactly to check 'em ?
Dig the substrate ,unplug the plants from it ,check the roots and then re-plant them ?
PSU says ,I'm torchering them ,when once I posted something like that ....

But anyway ....

You mean moist -nute levels of the substrate ,temperature ,etc ...?

But still ....If it was something with the roots ......

Those GD-SDS boxes ,for sure seem to have "cured" it ....
..

No ...
I insist .....
Blue light ...
Overestimated bunch of photons .....

At least regarding mj .......
Which naturally grows at Summer time ,annually ....

She does not survive the winter ...

Lady ,has evolved efficient light harvesting & utilising mechanisms ,for the "precious" to Her ,warm light ....
The one of the direct summertime noon sunlight..
Her best moment of the day ...
Sun's zenith .....
From Spring to Autumn .....

The power levels ( umols/sec ) that most blue (or some Cool whites,even ) leds emmit ,
can easily exceed the ones of natural Sunlight's _levels at the blue portion,tropics at noon .. ....

Way too much .....
To make things even worse ,
those blue photons are not dispersed enough ,
from some kilometers of atmospheric layers and thus 'forming' a beautiful blue sky ,
but come in the shape of a cone ......A really cell-oxidising cone ....
PS rates drop to null .....

But ....

That's my opinion ....

actually same here...slow grow here too.. my bitches stop growing.

day 14 from seed... og ghost train haze #1


and i need your help and advice... i have diy lamp like this.. 6x6500k+12xRed (oldschool evo style)


and i want to some upgrade on this lamp next days. and i want to cover only 60X90 area..enough for me. Pls tell me what i need..

my supplier has LCW CR7P.EC ww and LCW CR7P.PC nw and 6500k.

and last question my driver enough for a new one module (+6x led) or how many?

Thanks..

Summer bright day ...
...



Red line is radiometric power in mWatts ....

Check Blue ,Green, Red wls ....

Most power of summer's sunlight is at green area ( ~470 -590 ) .....

If you take a look at different PS/accessory pigments absorption graphs ,
almost all "droop " at that range ..

Why ?

Afterall ,there is where all the Sun -Power is ....

( Tip : Photo-inhibition,light Saturation ,etc ....Light power x Time (duration ) during day = Energy ... )

But ,utilisation of that green light energy is maintained at high levels ( Action Spectra -RQE ) .....
'Cause that is the main energy source ,of sunlight,throught out the whole day .......

"Slow 'n Steady--Easssyyyy nowwww- let all the leaves to share - aka ' green window' "
^^^Photosynthetic attitudes/strategies of plants ,towards green light and harvesting energy from it ......

.....Cause is powerful and always present ,from dawn till dusk ......


Now ..

Power of reds comes next in row ....
Usually,building up in power during morning , peaking at noon ,to lower at power,as day moves towards dusk..

High absorbance and high Utilisation (RQE ) Scheme ,from plants ...

But too much -prolonged - exposure under power extremes -can cause serious "trouble " ....

If in a steady power ,during the whole "daytime " cycle ,red photons have to be plenty ,but on a "leash " ...
Released free only when needed ....(see flowering/fruiting /maturing )

Otherwise things tend to burn -up ,specially when plants are young ....

.......
Blue power...

Ha ....

yeah ...
Way low ,ain't so ? .......


Now ....

Blue line at graph represents the number of photons ( μmol-umol ) ,per nanometer at same sunlight ....

Poor blue photons ....Not so many of them at Earth's Surface ....

They stayed up in the sky,bouncing happily here'n' there .... .....!

IYKWIM ....of course .....


That's why most of PS / accessory pigments have huge/wide absorption/absorbance peaks at blue region ....

They seem to kinda " search " for blue photons .....
Like guards ....
(Most of times to PROTECT the plant's PS fragile systems, from them !!! )

'Cause those aren't so many ,anyway .....


Still RQE of blue light is hilariously low ....

Not used for driving PS ,that much ....
Blue light is Not the main energy source .....

Blue light has ,probably, other "main" functions/effects to most higher plants ...

-Produces internal heat (water molecules vibration / photon conversion to longer wls =>heat)
-Phototropism.
-Terpene/wax/resin/antioxidants production-biosynthesis .
-Photomorphogenesis.
-Maybe play some role at Circadian Rythms.( CRY )


....



So much ,for the blue ....

Winter at 30-40 ° Latitude ....Low power ,short duration ,Blue wls dominate ...
Spring ....Green-yellow wls take over .....Power increases gradually , as duration,also does ...
Summer ....Full power ,max duration,(warmish ) white light ...
Autumn ....Red wls .....Power-duration decrease gradually ..

Some plants live for some months,only ...
Every year ...( Annual )
Others during Autumn-Winter-Spring ....(long day flowering- mainly :annual green leafies )
Others during Spring-Summer-Autumn ....(short day flowering-mainly : annual fruiting plants)...

It is logical,to have evolved quite different "mechanisms " ,
for harvesting & utilising energy,
as efficient as possible ,from available light ,
depending on their ..season of life cycle ..

Click to expand...

mkmll said:

actually same here...slow grow here too.. my bitches stop growing.

day 14 from seed... og ghost train haze #1

View attachment 2654875
and i need your help and advice... i have diy lamp like this.. 6x6500k+12xRed (oldschool evo style)
View attachment 2654879View attachment 2654883View attachment 2654884

and i want to some upgrade on this lamp next days. and i want to cover only 60X90 area..enough for me. Pls tell me what i need..

my supplier has LCW CR7P.EC ww and LCW CR7P.PC nw and 6500k.

and last question my driver enough for a new one module (+6x led) or how many?

Thanks..

Click to expand...

-First things first ....

Yes, is absolutely normal for the plants to show slow growth at that stage ,with all that red power ...

-Main Root probably,is already at the bottom of the pot ,'searching' where to go next..
-Stomata are closed ,after 3-4 hours of exposure , under that light ..
Photosynthesis slows down ,really much ...


( NIR photography can easily reveal that thing !
Trust me ..Been already there ,...
NDVI / NRG pics can tell a lot ,to the trained eye !

...After ~12 hours under leds ..."
"Green Window" strategy , is also evident !
Top layer -canopy is light -saturated ....PS rates have dropped ...
But remain high ,in the deeper part of canopy..)

Young plants to be exposed on such red-heavy spectrum ...
Can't handle the power yet ......
-PS II is constantly being destroyed and re-builded ...Bad circle ..

Now ....At vegging ......
Green and Yellow light power mainly ,followed by red/deep red/far red with a touch of Blue ....
" SDS's recipe ".....
......


........

LCW CR7P.EC ww ( 3000 K ) is a great vegging/flowering "base " led ....
An all-around "base " .providing mainly a broad range of green-yellow-amber-red wls ...
And CR7P are really powerful leds ...

Great choice for "all-around base " ..

But not providing the "punch" needed ,neither while during vegging -regarding blue/green wls - ,
neither during flowering or fruiting ,-regarding amount of red/deep reds/far reds ....

A great "base " ,though .... (As "Base" is(are) defined the led(s) used in most quantity/power , both while vegging & flowering )

I personally use that type ( 3000 K ) as 'base led ' for my middle box ..

As for the LCW CR7P.PC nw and 6500k.....

While powerful ,too much blue/green wls in their light.( at least for my taste ....)

Currently ,I use the LCW CQ7P.CC NW 4000 K ...

I wish I could find the LCW CR7P.CC NW 4000 K

..And the -so beloved- LCW CR7P.CC 2700 K ...Pure Flower-power ,there !!!


Also the LCW CQ7P.EC NW 4000 K or LCW CR7P.EC NW 4000 K,can be used instead just fine ....

Limits : 5000 K - 80 CRI

Maybe max up to 5000 K ...Anything more than that is almost pure blue/green light
And up to ECphosphor choice ...

.PC & LUW phosphor leds ,are poor for plant cultivation ....

And that's only for For a really heavy blue/green-doped/enhanced ,vegging light ,maybe ....
And still for the blue photons to be "served softly" to plants ....

Maybe even at 150° angle , if go with those CRI/ chromaticity choices ....

Click to expand...

As for the driver ......
40 x 0.7 = 28 ...

Driver can power from 28 up to 56 Watts of a led string ....

White Oslons at 700mA have an typ. Vf ranging from 3 to 3.5 Volts ,depending on model ..
Say average 2.5 Watts ...

That driver can drive ~ 20-23 x white Oslons at it's max .....
Depending on led type/bin(Vf group )

Personally ,I would've not exceeded driving 16-18 leds(white Oslons ) ,at 700mA ,with that driver ..

Caution : Minimum amount of leds (Oslons ) it can drive is ~ 9-11 leds ..
(It seems so .....)

Click to expand...

thanks for all super detailed explanation..but im confused little bit here. pls tell me simple.

You can say like this. Go and buy 30x ww + 10x nw...like this

i have only 6x 6500+ 12x red now..

my suplier has modules like this 3x 6x 9x 12x and 18x

what i need for 60x90cm2 surface..?

my plan 2X18leds WW and 2X6leds NW and 1X6leds CW...then i have total 36xWW // 12xNW // 12xCW and 12xRed = 72x leds

is enough ?

thanks for interesting again. you are best

stardustsailor said:

As for the driver ......
40 x 0.7 = 28 ...

Driver can power from 28 up to 56 Watts of a led string ....

White Oslons at 700mA have an typ. Vf ranging from 3 to 3.5 Volts ,depending on model ..
Say average 2.5 Watts ...

That driver can drive ~ 20-23 x white Oslons at it's max .....
Depending on led type/bin(Vf group )

Personally ,I would've not exceeded driving 16-18 leds(white Oslons ) ,at 700mA ,with that driver ..

Click to expand...

so i can add more 6x WW/NW led on my heatsink and driver...thanks

mkmll said:

thanks for all super detailed explanation..but im confused little bit here. pls tell me simple.

You can say like this. Go and buy 30x ww + 10x nw...like this

i have only 6x 6500+ 12x red now..

my suplier has modules like this 3x 6x 9x 12x and 18x

what i need for 60x90cm2 surface..?

my plan 2X18leds ww and 2X6leds nw and 1X6leds cw...then i have total 36xww // 12xnw // 12xcw and 12xred = 72x leds

is enough ?

thanks for interesting again. you are best

Click to expand...

Ok ..
You made it simpler for me ,I'll make it simple for ya !

Forget the cool white leds and/or the PC family ...

You already have 12 x red leds ( Which ? LH CP7P or LR CP7P ? 660 or 630 ? )
In 2x 6 arrays ....

Try to install a dimming function or on/off switch at the 6x 6500 K array ..
You do not need that ,while flowering ...
Not that much blue ...

I would've gone for :

-3x 12 WW CR7P.EC 3000 K (or even better 3x 12 WW CR7P.CC 2700 K,if you can find them... )
( or 6x 6 WW arrays ....)

-1x 6 NW 4000 K CR7P.EC or .CC (or CQ7P )
And finally

-1x 12 LH CP7P T3/T4 ( or 2x 6 LH CP7P T3/T4 )

All together 72 leds ....
At 700mA ...

More than enough, for your ~ .5 m[SUP]2[/SUP] of grow area ....

Check this out,also
(For the CQ7P.CC 2700 WW & 4000 NW ...:

http://www.led-tech.de/de/High-Power-LEDs-Osram/Osram-Oslon-SSL-c_206_207.html
http://www.led-tech.de/en/High-Power-LEDs-Osram/Osram-Modules-c_206_209.html

And I would veg with :
-1x6 6500 K array
-1x6 NW array
-3x 12 WW array
and
1 x 6 red array ( preferably with LR CP7P s ,if you have those..the 630 nm ones )...

- 12 red leds stay "off " ,while vegging ..../.



As for flowering :
Early flowering : all arrays switched on

Middle and late flowering : all the arrays 'on' ,except the 1x 6 6500 CW one ...
That array goes 'off',now ...

Want to 'speed up' maturing,at the end ?
Then, turn off the 1x 6 NW array, also ...

***Or you can,even, have the NW & CW arrays (12 leds ) on the same driver ...
To simultaneously switch 'em on & off .....


Edit : 72 Oslons at 700mA ,need good cooling ..
That (passive) heatsink ,you use ,won't do the job ....