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Lucas Formula. should i be adding a "bud booster" ? is lucas worth it?

Discussion in 'Hydroponics / Aeroponics' started by budtoker0987, Oct 20, 2013.

  1.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Boosters will give you bigger buds because they are adding higher doses of Phosphorus and Potassium. The downside is that it is easy to burn your plants if you dose it too high and if you are unfamiliar with how much nutes your strain can take. Another downside is the bloom boosters can produce iregularly shaped buds with fox tails and clusters coming out of the flowers; rather than the normal round and coned shape of typical flowers. But if you don't dose it too high and burn your plants it will produce higher yields. There's no doubt about that.
     
  2.  
    effect

    effect Active Member

    the real question is whether or not you need to add so much P in a medialess grow.

    the traditional reasoning in soil (and "soilless") is because the roots can't absorb it more than ~1mm away without fungal aids, and to overcome the ionic attraction of the media itself, you could add some more during times of high need. but in a pure hydro setup with turbulent water, both of those core issues are resolved.

    i run straight cns-17 bloom (2-2-5) in ebb-n-flow and 5g dwc, same great results. on the other hand, i've run straight maxibloom (1-3-3) in pure coco with great results. my experience over the years seems to reinforce this principle of P availability.
     
  3.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member


    • You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to BCOGYODA again.

      Ya dude so the ones i DID take down were at a week. put em in jars, and they do smell better than when they were hanging definetely. But the ones i took down, the stems were snapping. these were mostly like the smaller buds at the bottom of the stalks. but there were basically two lines worth that were snapping and dry feeling. ALSO NOTE that these buds didnt get TOOOO dense. so they are a little "airy" in the buds. Too many nodes and i left too much small shit on there. Also remember that it took us about 2.5 days to complete harvest with work and shit in between. so the ones that got took down were the first nights plants. 7 gram short of a LB on those lines :) I liked that :) and i think my dry room is probably dryer RH wise that the therms say. its SO DRY and COLD here right now. it honestly doesnt take much at all for it to be dry in there i bet. i dunno. all i can think of. cuz the numbers i gave you are exactly what they have been saying. most likely end up jarring up the rest tonight. most of the main tops from the last couple plants trimmed.

      I wanted to ask you. what should my temps be in the curing jars? I got these tight little RH lids for mason jars http://www.ebay.com/itm/17119177662...eName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

      I think right now the jars are sitting at like 50% give or take a couple. And i seen dudes saying to have them at like 62% around that.. ?????? ANd they were buying these Boveda packs they stabalise RH to whatever number they set to. so i got the 62% packs. its supposed to pull it up to or drop it to 62% +/- 2%. Any thoughts on those? http://www.ebay.com/itm/370953762008?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649




     
  4.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Hey BT! Ya the small airy buds that aren't dense will dry WAY faster than larger dense buds. And if you have a lot of little airy popcorn buds down low on the branches that is definitely a sign that you can prune more leaves off next time to let more air and light get down to those lower small buds.

    Ya the humidity in canning jars should be a bit more than 50% because the idea is to very slowly cure the last bit of moisture out of the buds but this is a connoisseur thing that you will perfect by trying different things. I wouldn't go as high as 62 though. That is still moist. 55-58 IMO but I only keep very little bud around for my own stash in jars and I have never tested the humidity in them.

    When I dry I cure/dry just on the racks over a 15 day period so my buds only have 24% of their original weight/moisture left in them when they come off the racks. If I have very large tops I sometimes on the odd occasion have to put just those tops in rubber maid tubs for 24 hrs to help "pull" the very inside moisture out of them; then put them back on the dry racks for the last day or two of cure/dry.
    At a very slow cold rack dry the buds are curing themselves and will have a very dank smell to them. You have to make sure also the drying room is always in complete darkness.
    Warmth and light will degrade the smell and taste of your flowers.

    The addition of co2 to your grow room will also help with increasing yield.

    So what was the final outcome? Is it all dry now? What is the final total yield?
    How's the smoke? Taste, smoothness, high, etc?

    Pics of dried buds?
     
  5.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    YA i think i THOUGHT they were denser at first. Its just like all those little buds that make up a corndog top nugget never really CONVERGED to make that one bud. so i dunno i just think they dried quicker than we thought. and the fact that its SO DRY in my climate right now (and we do have air getting pumped into that basement from outside so we have fresh air so that brings in more dry air, but its fresh :) ) so maybe next time ill go a little higher on the RH since its pretty easily getting pulled out of the room. What do you think? My TEMP was perfectly fine. highest it got was 63. hovered at like 60 61. We were pulling them down when they were snapping off the main stem. OR if they would be pulled off with just a little pull. If i had to twist the stem around a bunch of times to break it or if I pulled the bud off and the stem peeled down the main stem i left it hang another day.

    Ok so final outcome of dried buds was 2lbs 1.75oz. From 7 plants. Equals out to just under 5 per plant. which is less than what i did the first run. I had a couple stragglers in this run that brought down the average for sure. Kinda pissed at myself for not marking out where each plant ended on teh strings. So i had to just do the average overall.

    Final outcome, very pleased still!! All is dry now and curing in jars. No more plant smell either!! I WAS the stems. At the same time they dont smell fruity or really WREAK like i would have hoped. But i know they got cut at the very least a few days early. The smoke is very smooth actually :) Taste is.... good. Not GREAT, it doesn't really have a STRONG flavor one way or the other. BUT ITS NOT BAD AT ALL. Theres no harshness or bad after tastes or anything, its just not as flavorful as i hoped it would be. Its definitely potent tho :) It's more an upbeat high i would say. Like you could fuckin start cleaning the house and shit lol. NOT GETTING CARRIED AWAY OF COURSE but at the same time I'll find myself watching football after smoking for a few hours and finding it pretty easy to nod off for a bit if i want to. Soooo,,,, more upbeat, smoke and go shopping high :)

    Had a picky friend pick these ones over some other stuff i had that IN MY HONEST OPINION smelled better than MINE DO. AND again told me they were bomb like a half hour later lol I was very happy. Anyways bro here are some pics :) I just strive for perfection i think lol. So maybe im extra critical of my own stuff. lol others seem to really dig it so far :)

    DSC01548.jpg DSC01547.jpg DSC01546.jpg DSC01549.jpg DSC01550.jpg DSC01551.jpg DSC01552.jpg



    This is from the first batch that got pulled off the lines. Two lines worth of buds equaled out to just under a LB :) Beautiful site to see all those buds in a bucket!! lol So this is ABOUT 2 plants possibly a little bit more.

    IMAG1347.jpg IMAG1346.jpg IMAG1345.jpg IMAG1344.jpg IMAG1343.jpg IMAG1342.jpg IMAG1349.jpg
     
  6.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Very Nice BT!! :grin:
    Ya I think if you are finding that it's mostly heady up high and you still had some clear but mostly cloudy trichs that shows you could have prob gone another week no prob.
    Some strains just don't have a powerful deep dank smell to them no matter what you do. Do a lot of reading on growers reports on what they find the best for potency, yield, and dank smell if that's what you are after. There's so many out there...

    I'm the same as you being criticle on my own quality sometimes when others aren't. I think that's natural if you are an over achiever and strive for the best always. Nothing wrong with that! That's how you get yourself to produce the best product possible.

    If you blast your temps down for a bit longer before you chop next time for 4-5 days you will find you get the buds to sugar up a bit more, color up more, and can help with more dankness too. I blast the fuck out of my temps down looooww before I chop. But I have powerful a/c's in my rooms so it's easy for me to do. If you have a dim-able ballast you can also help bring temps down by dimming it for the last 4-5 days too.

    Over 2 lbs per light man is nothing to be let down about especially if you had a couple stragglers! How long of veg did those 7 plants have before flipping to flower?

    You used the liquid GH booster this round right? If I could suggest one thing only it would be to try a run with powdered Advanced Nutrients Big Bud for your booster. Or if you want to stick with GH then try the powdered Kool Bloom rather than the liquid. I know we talked about it before and you had some liquid left so it was good to use it up on this run.
    Also if you need to buy a new clearing solution for your next grow try Final Phase to compare it to the one you just used.

    It would be great if you could eventually seal up your room and add co2 to your growing. You would be amazed at how much more your plants grow with co2 enrichment. 30%-40% more growth and yield isn't an over estimate.

    Great work man!! Enjoy the fruits of your labor!
     
  7.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    And yes man if you can stretch your drying out to 14-15 days for your medium to large size buds you will find a much more dank smell than a week dry. My stuff always smells almost twice as dank as my friends crops who dry much faster and warmer than I do. That's where the magic happens; low temp and sloooooow dry! You will perfect that in no time I'm sure man.
     
  8.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    They got 9 weeks veg. Due to my wierd schedule i had going. now im gonna have a couple mothers.

    I did use the liquid koolbloom. I think ill have to use it one for run cuz i still got aobut just over half the gallon of it. unless you think I hsould just chuck that stuff and get some powder? I'm down. Now is the time to get upgrades and re up on some nutes so lemme know lol.


    I wanted to ask you more about the whole sealed room thing. I DO want to have a sealed room here eventually. Basically what we did was take an opnen room in the basement that was already sheetrocked out as a bedroom and made a wall going thru it so if and when this room is done it will be a nice walkin closet. Its got a door and it's "ghetto sealed" at the tops with cardboard and spray foam lol **shakes head** we wanted to get shit done now, not later lol and had no money. :) I'll take a few pics of the new flowering ladies and the room so you can get a visual. Its about 7'x9' and i think about 7' - 8' tall. I'll have to measure. concrete slab floor. And on the wall that faces outside we had a bunch of ants in the summer. lots of ant traps. I REALLY want to have a sealed room like your saying tho. C02 is my GOAL!!
     
  9.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    Also, i wanna be maximizing my space too! if I gotta go SOG i will. BUT i've spent quite a bit of money on this hydro system now. I dont go cheap either. Got two Bluelab Guardian meters. Those were $520. Two Brains for control buckets. $400. Then just a bunch of pumps and other shit that adds up.. So I WOULD LIKE to use these things but if a point is made that ill be getting more out of SOG or another method I"LL DOO IT.

    Right now I have 9 5 gallon buckets in that 7x9. Well, they go from the 5x5' tent in veg to the 7x9' bud room. I could try and go fewer larger plants. OR many more smaller ones. Go smaller gallon buckets, more of em. I dunno. I just ordered another raptor hood so ill have 2 1000's running during cold months and then ill run 600's in hot months. At least that is the plan lol. so im gonna have this whole bud room NICELY covered with light very shortly. I jsut need to figure out now how to max out the space under em :)

    I have been looking into mainlining! That shit is pretty fucking sweet man. Just take a quick peek. Beautiful fat buds. My next plan WAS to mainline all the next ones.

    I dunno . lol thoughts?
     
  10.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

  11.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    This has been on my leaves in flower the last 3 runs. Little less each time. But last time i thought it was because i was burning them. This time, they looked beautiful and lush green going from veg to flower. They were in flower for not even a week and i saw some leaves having just a little of this. Now its on a few MORE. MOST are fine a look great. But like last time it seems to spread thru out flower. This res change they just started preflowering so they got the same mix they had in veg 6/6/6 and I added 1/4 strength liquid koolbloom and sweet.

    Check em out:
    IMAG1569.jpg IMAG1570.jpg IMAG1568.jpg IMAG1572.jpg IMAG1571.jpg

    Most of my leaves look very green and lush like these two.
    IMAG1574.jpg IMAG1575.jpg IMAG1576.jpg
     
  12.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Hey BT ya man the mainlining looks great. I like multiple large main colas. The more larger, hard buds, the better!! When it comes down to it we should all be striving to make the best medicine while getting the best yield possible in the least amount of time.

    There's lot's of different ways to do that. Especially now days with so many growers experimenting with so many different growing styles.

    I don't think that's nute burn on those leaves in your pics. Leaves can react different ways to different ingredients in your nutes. Don't worry too much about it unless you see your plants reacting negatively by stalling growth, burning, molding up, etc..Too many growers freak out when they see their plants do something odd they aren't sure about. If you inspect your leaves and see no bugs I wouldn't worry too much about it. It could be a reaction to ph fluctuation also. When you start adding other ingredients like boosters, carbs, etc. your plants can react that way with variations in ph levels etc. Not a big deal.

    If that's what you thought was burn so you backed off on your ppm strength I wouldn't worry about that. The leaves will burn from the tips inwards and they will go crispy as they burn more and the leaf dies.
    You can increase your ppm if they weren't burning. Dif strains will burn at different ppm values. I got Chemo going that burns at anything over 1400ppm and I got OG going that can take up to 2000 ppm without any burn. Just depends on the strain.
     
    budtoker0987 likes this.
  13.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    Ok cool. So i just did a pretty heavy trim on the new ladies last night :) Check it out. Basically took off all the fan leaves. Looks a little drastic but i honestly think they gonna bush right back out with whats still left on em.

    DSC01555.jpg DSC01556.jpg DSC01558.jpg DSC01557.jpg DSC01554.jpg DSC01559.jpg DSC01561.jpg DSC01560.jpg DSC01566.jpg DSC01565.jpg DSC01564.jpg DSC01563.jpg

    I wanna holler at you more about sealing my room off so i can add co2 eventually here. Waiting on my new stuff too. Just ordered another raptor hood so ill have two 1000k in there. REAL nice light spread then. Cant wait! Should we start a different thread? I would just PM you but then I cant attach pics. Or we can just keep communicating through this thread. Lemme know.

    Again man I REALLY appreciate the help and tips!! I wish there was something I KNEW to help you with lol
     
  14.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    Sup holmes! lol :)
     
  15.  
    selektor

    selektor Member

    nice top men :-)
     
  16.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Hey BT!! Ya man!! That's how the pruning is done! Excellent! Yes they will bush back up again on the 1/1/1 ratio. This time around I suggest tweeking to the 1/2/3 ratio a bit earlier and if you thought that other stuff with the leaves was nute burn (which it wasn't for sure) I would increase your max ppm levels for a bit longer towards the end of your grow.

    What did you max out your ppm last time around?

    Up to you man if you want to start a new thread but I think it's cool if you keep this one going. Those vegged plants are huge! Should be a great yield. Keep up the pruning but if I were you I would do another prune around week 5 of flower. It will open up air and light to all the flower sites at a great time in flower where they do a lot of growing from week 5 to 9 of flower.

    Now that you know how long a flowering strain you have (10 week from time of flip I think) you can better tweek your feed schedule.

    Ask me anything you want about sealed rooms man. It's my specialty. Been growing like this way before the word got out about how great it is. I'm pretty positive sealed room growing was born in BC Canada cause we started building our rooms like that long before anyone wrote about it even being possible. There were so many naysayers about it at the beginning cause most growers thought it was impossible to grow mj without exchanging air. Anyway it's the absolute best way to have a 100% controlled growing environment and not waste any co2.
     
  17.  
    budtoker0987

    budtoker0987 Active Member

    Not exactly sure what i maxed out at cuz i thought i was burning them but they were up to around 1300 i think.

    Finally got the new reflector and ballast. So NOWWW I got 2 1000w in there in raptor hoods :) :) :) :) :) I already had a 1000 Dual Arc from my first grow years ago. So the lower on has that in it and the one up a little higher has the straight super HPS in it. AND i moved them from short to tall so i COULD drop one a little lower. This is what its lookin like right now.
    DSC01572.jpg DSC01573.jpg DSC01574.jpg DSC01578.jpg

    And remember i was talking about making a couple mothers. Well i made them in HEMPY buckets. And shit do they seem to respond well to that stuff. I feel like much better than the straight up hydroton. I would like to maybe run SOG in this room with a shit ton of hempy buckets made but at the same time i gotta try and be able to use all this expensive equipment i bought for all this hydro stuff. So id like to try and think of a good way to setup auto feed for them.. How do you feed you ladies if you have so many??
    IMG_20140110_234348[1].jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  18.  
    BCOGYODA

    BCOGYODA Well-Known Member

    Right on BT looking great!
    The addition of the second light should make a big difference in bud size and yield per sq/ft

    I hand wand feed. Large reservoir, heavy duty pump, hose and 5' wand. Go up and down the rows of each bed. Takes time but with a lot of plants it's the only way to make sure all the plants are healthy and all getting fed the same amount.
    With auto feed systems with large rooms there's too much opportunity for a feed line to get clogged and plants not get fed.

    I've been wanting to try a tight sog with hydro for years but never got around to it. They make some tube style hydro sog setups I've seen but I don't know anyone that have tried them. The guys I know doing hydro are doing large med trees.
     
  19.  
    ptr123

    ptr123 Active Member

    Nice thread, Very informative. Thx BC
     
  20.  
    ptr123

    ptr123 Active Member

    BC, do you turn the lights on after 48 hrs of dark to chop or leave the lights off? How far are your lights from the plant top in flower?
     

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