NEED HELP DIAGNOSING - LEAVES DIEING TWISTED NEW GROWTH

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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Hey all I need help figuring out whats going on. The plant first started showing signs of what I thought was a cal-mag deficiency with yellowing and yellow veins in the leaves, but now I am not so sure. New leaves are stunted, growing in twisted and some only have one, two or three big fan leaves. Old leaves are yellowing and dieing. THis is my first grow inside and was just about to transfer to bloom room before this happened. Help please. Some of the signs possibly look boron related but this is indoor grow. The soil ph was around 6.5 and have watered with cal-mag elemental with RO filtered water with ph of 6.5. Can anyone please help?


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Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Where did this plant come from?
If it's a clone, have you seen the mother or other plants from it's source do OK?
Feed it what?
How often?
How much?
Media is what?
If soil - list the brand and the type.

State you are in? I take it it's Maine? This got more interesting!

And for the big one. Lighting is what? Set for how long?

Looks like it could be several things.
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Dr. Who said:
Where did this plant come from?
If it's a clone, have you seen the mother or other plants from it's source do OK? It was a clone but have used from this source many times for outdoor grow with great genetics. Really think the clones mothers are good healthy plants....but havent seen these ones mom.

Feed it what? Roots uprising grow, cal mag elemental from roots uprising

How often? Water, water, feed, repeat

How much? Dont remember off head but 2 tsp per gallon. Usually give them about gal and half of water at feed.

Media is what? Hp pro mix

If soil - list the brand and the type.

State you are in? I take it it's Maine? This got more interesting!
Yes in maine

And for the big one. Lighting is what? Set for how long? 18/6 for veg 600w mh

Looks like it could be several things. I really think it is a few things.

I did treat for powdermold and it appeared to start after i treated.
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Richard Drysift

Richard Drysift

Well-Known Member
Definitely overwatered. It could be that you simply need to pot up. Many times if you find you are having to water more often than you used to the roots have consumed most of the container. Then it's like you have to overwater just to keep them happy. Roots need both air and moisture at the same time; more room means moisture is more easily self regulated.
Doesn't look like a calmag issue to me.... looks more like an absorption problem. You said it's in soil so I wonder why you ph the water...runoff ph tells you nothing either; you would need a decent soil probe to accurately check ph at the root-zone. Not saying your ph is off either just that ph-ing your water and checking runoff would not help detect a ph issue if there was one...the soil itself should be balanced already.
I think if you try transplanting to a fresh mix and water only as they need to keep the soil just as moist as a damp towel you'll see improvement.
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Overwatering would cause twisted growth and new growth to only be one or two big fan leaves? I could have perhaps been overwatering at feed time but always waited for soil to dry before I watered again. I did not test water run off for ph I used a probe and checked soil ph just to make sure. I simply put I was using a 6.5 ph water because i researched the stats from the bottlers of the water brand I use.
 
Richard Drysift

Richard Drysift

Well-Known Member
You buy bottled water and then ph it? Ok maybe that's fine I dunno. There's no need to ever adjust ph of water if you grow in soil but that's probably not the cause of this.
No question this plant IS overwatered right now. Whether or not it is the cause of your issue I have no idea but many times new growers will try to get away with using the same size pot they have been vegging in for awhile. I'm saying it's possible that IF the plant is in too small a pot most times you will have to overwater to compensate for thick root growth. Transplanting to a larger pot would solve most of the problems if that was the case. Twisted growth is typical of N toxicity but it doesn't look like nute burn. It could also be related to bad drainage...what kind and size of pot is it in and what kind of soil do you use?
 
Buba Blend

Buba Blend

Well-Known Member
Richard Drysift said:
You buy bottled water and then ph it? Ok maybe that's fine I dunno. There's no need to ever adjust ph of water if you grow in soil but that's probably not the cause of this.
No question this plant IS overwatered right now. Whether or not it is the cause of your issue I have no idea but many times new growers will try to get away with using the same size pot they have been vegging in for awhile. I'm saying it's possible that IF the plant is in too small a pot most times you will have to overwater to compensate for thick root growth. Transplanting to a larger pot would solve most of the problems if that was the case. Twisted growth is typical of N toxicity but it doesn't look like nute burn. It could also be related to bad drainage...what kind and size of pot is it in and what kind of soil do you use?
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BlazeMaine420 said:
Overwatering would cause twisted growth and new growth to only be one or two big fan leaves? I could have perhaps been overwatering at feed time but always waited for soil to dry before I watered again. I did not test water run off for ph I used a probe and checked soil ph just to make sure. I simply put I was using a 6.5 ph water because i researched the stats from the bottlers of the water brand I use.
Click to expand...
I think Blaze is saying the water he buys has a PH of 6,5 not that he adjusts it.
You have an interesting problem blaze, Dr, Who and Richard are two of the good ones. Stay with them they will help,
What is the exact brand of your water? Sometimes bottled water like the small bottles sold in large quantities have additives.
I'm also wondering if HP Pro mix is a good choice for your style of growing. It is a peat based mix that I think is used by hydroponics growers.
I'm not the expert, just asking questions that might help them figure it out.
 
chemphlegm

chemphlegm

Well-Known Member
notice how green she is? try feeding heavier for more of the same?
if I water too much in veg my leaves dont get greener and twist, they get yellow and die
from no 02 in the root zone.
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Richard Drysift said:
Definitely overwatered. It could be that you simply need to pot up. Many times if you find you are having to water more often than you used to the roots have consumed most of the container. Then it's like you have to overwater just to keep them happy. Roots need both air and moisture at the same time; more room means moisture is more easily self regulated.
Doesn't look like a calmag issue to me.... looks more like an absorption problem. You said it's in soil so I wonder why you ph the water...runoff ph tells you nothing either; you would need a decent soil probe to accurately check ph at the root-zone. Not saying your ph is off either just that ph-ing your water and checking runoff would not help detect a ph issue if there was one...the soil itself should be balanced already.
I think if you try transplanting to a fresh mix and water only as they need to keep the soil just as moist as a damp towel you'll see improvement.
Click to expand...

He's running HP pro mix - so he's soillless.

BlazeMaine420 said:
Overwatering would cause twisted growth and new growth to only be one or two big fan leaves? I could have perhaps been overwatering at feed time but always waited for soil to dry before I watered again. I did not test water run off for ph I used a probe and checked soil ph just to make sure. I simply put I was using a 6.5 ph water because i researched the stats from the bottlers of the water brand I use.
Click to expand...
Adjust all in-going fluids to 6.0 pH for that Pro Mix. Increase the time between watering, and go to a water, feed, water sched.

What did you treat the plant with for the PM?
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Thanks everyone. Yes I do not ph the water and i was saying that was the ph level of the water as told to me online by bottlers. Typically I feed my plants water from my faucet which I know is good because I have an RO filter for my home water. I will try to up the pot size I think maybe originally was a defficiency but i overwatered with phed water to try and flush the plant. The clawed appearence looked like maybe nitrogen lock? I haven't changed pots from i believe 5 gallon size, not sure im not home to check and possibly the roots now dont have enough 02 and arent properly draining?
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
I used greencure fungicide for pm. 1.5 tsp per gallon I believe or it was exactly as they specified and did a foliar spray at night before the lights turned off
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Some of the leaves appear to me to look slightly burnt but it definitely isn't the lights and was wondering if maybe it looks that way due to the possibility of as mention me for not enough drainage comma over-watering because I tried to flush and possibly a nitrogen lock up? Would that make sense? I guess it seems my next step is up to pot size. When I'm repotting should I use nutrients or no?
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
Not so sure why everyone stuck on the water thing I only made the comment just to eliminate the possibility of watering with something that's too acidic or too alkaline. I only use the water one time because I knew had a perfect pH balance and wanted to flush the plants
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
chemphlegm said:
"I did treat for powdermold and it appeared to start after i treated
ding ding ding?
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Even though I said it appeared to start after I treated I really think I just started noticing the signs then and the two coincide it seems it was a deficiency and the signs were slow to come
 
chemphlegm

chemphlegm

Well-Known Member
BlazeMaine420 said:
Not so sure why everyone stuck on the water thing I only made the comment just to eliminate the possibility of watering with something that's too acidic or too alkaline. I only use the water one time because I knew had a perfect pH balance and wanted to flush the plants
Click to expand...
the devil is always in the details. Usually take a few pages before we get the whole picture. Providing every detail goes along way to a proper diagnosis I'd say. Until then we just throw darts and play the guessing game, slowly dialing in at the same rate the details come forth.
 
coreywebster

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
I'm wondering if its a lack of Iron from the RO water, reason been the small inner leaves been affected and the twisted growth amongst other things.
What brand of CalMag have you used? Most contain Iron but I don't think they all do?
 
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BlazeMaine420

New Member
I will check the bag but if it does its a very small amount and any other nutes I gave wouldnt contain iron. I used roots uprising elementals cal-mag mix. Typically i use roots uprising grow and foundation for veg, all powders. I am thinking the switching to liquid fertilizers through General Organics. My concern was yes I believe it's over water now because I tried too much to flush but over-watering wouldn't give me that new Twisted growth with only one, two, or three big fan leaves, correct? Because of how the old leaves yellowed and died, the appearance of possible burn, and really the way the new growth is that's me doesn't seem like signs of over-watering but more of a deficiency or nutrient lock of some sort???
 
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