Snake Oil, Horticultural Myths, Horticultural Urban Legends, and Persuaders

B

beans davis

Well-Known Member
UB too funny i just snapped to your sign off:tio bendajo=uncle and your play on pendajo using ben.
I thought you were spelling it wrong now i see the light.
 
Total Head

Total Head

Well-Known Member
boneheadbob said:
American Pride by Fox Farm organic nutes

I would like to mix this in a bag of organic soil such as roots or OFGreat

for all types of flowers, time-released American Pride Dry Fertilizer (9-6-6) includes earthworm castings, bat guano and cottonseed meal to produce dark green foliage and abundant blooms. American Pride is also specially formulated with alfalfa, iron and linoleic acid, making it particularly beneficial to roses. As it decomposes, American Pride develops more nitrate nitrogen which is more suitable for flowers than vegetables.

Cottonseed Meal, Blood Meal, Earthworm Castings, Bat Guano, Ammonium Sulphate, Calcium Nitrate, Ammonium Phosphate, Treble Phosphate, Potassium Nitrate, Potassium Sulphate, Potassium Chloride, Ferrous Sulphate, Zinc Sulphate, Copper Sulphate, Manganese Oxysulphate, Calcium Carbonate, Alfalfa Meal, Ureaform, Urea, Potassium Nitrate, Zinc Sulphate, Copper Sulphate, Manganese, Oxysulphate, Calcium Carbonate, Magnesium Carbonate
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i bet it's good stuff. i gave it a look but i ended up going with the peace of mind organic stuff (5-5-5) and mixed it into gardner's gold soil.

basically i got sick of having to pay so damn much attention to my plants. feed this day, water that day. pain in the ass. i just want to look at my plants and determine if they are doing "good" or "bad", not hold their hands. i have shit to do. i was using dyna gro (which is by far the finest synthetic plant food i have ever used) and my results were good, but if i didn't keep on top of things i'd get the damn salt issues later in flower and keeping the leaves green required more effort than i was willing to expend. for all i know it's my tap water, but since i'm not a scientist and wouldn't know what any of the crap on a water report means i decided to try a time release type thing. i went organic to see if my salt issues were in my head.

long story short i'm 6 weeks into flower on my first run with the stuff and i've poured nothing but plain water on them and they are doing great. i still have some dialing in to do with ratios and timing a top dress, but i'm going to go down this road from now on.

i'm the laziest tightwad you'll ever meet, and i figured out a cheap and easy way to grow better pot than i did before, and i spend around 30% less per plant per cycle.
next on the list is to see if azomite will kick it up a notch. a lot of these time release organics lack micros so that stuff should round out the menu.

and although UB might take issue with some of what i've said here, his philosophies and tidbits are actually what inspired me to go cheaper and lazier. the organic deal was my idea though. i plan on moving in a year or so and i can't be bothered to figure out if something's up with my water to cause salt buildup so going organic was the next best thing.
 
sharpshoota

sharpshoota

Active Member
UB,
Im about to run this ratio for bloom from day 1 to finish.. and i have micros just not listed.
n-115
p-113
k-236
mg-66
ca-126
s-49

should i increase or decrease any of the above listed ppms, during any stage of growth or just keep it where its at start to finish???


Now from what Ive heard, is there an advantage to running different nutrient ratios during different stages of flowering. For example, run higher P early, then higher K during mid to late???
I think this idea comes from the advanced nutrients 'scientist' and there many products. like bud blood (0-39-25) Big Bud (0-1-3) Overdrive (1-5-4)
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
sharpshoota said:
UB,
Im about to run this ratio for bloom from day 1 to finish.. and i have micros just not listed.
n-115
p-113
k-236
mg-66
ca-126
s-49
Click to expand...
That'll work, unless you get leaf drop then increase the N.

Now from what Ive heard, is there an advantage to running different nutrient ratios during different stages of flowering. For example, run higher P early, then higher K during mid to late???
I think this idea comes from the advanced nutrients 'scientist' and there many products. like bud blood (0-39-25) Big Bud (0-1-3) Overdrive (1-5-4)
Click to expand...
The advantage is only for the vendor. You buy into the vendor hype that cannabis needs different stuff at different times and he makes money off another sucker. That's the game, and it is a game, a tawdry one at that.

I use only one food from start to finish and I guarantee you, I'll out produce any one in this forum with healthy plants that are a fine green and retain 99% of their leaves until harvest, which is what drives good production, not some additive or supplement. For example, I use a slow release, 10 month, 18-5-9 with micros from start to finish. Here's a late shot regarding how they look and the fact that they are already going into a preflowering mode. Outdoors, solstice is still 3 weeks away with August producing a strong flowering response.

GroupShot5_12.jpg
 
budman111

budman111

Well-Known Member
The 'myth' that gets me beyond the 'B vits' and 'defoliating' for frosty budz is advanced shysters tells noobs that use AN products and the plants flower time is 7 weeks, 1 week less than competitors.

Now seeing as the plants flowers most weight comes in the last 2 week, most noobs must be harvesting way too early. learn to read plants.
 
Nutty sKunK

Nutty sKunK

Well-Known Member
@Uncle Ben

Random question here but I see you know your shit. Would you advise a flush on a 11 week strain grown in Coco? Or feed until chop, just lower feed?

Thanks man
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
Nutty sKunK said:
@Uncle Ben

Random question here but I see you know your shit. Would you advise a flush on a 11 week strain grown in Coco? Or feed until chop, just lower feed?

Thanks man
Click to expand...
Feed until chop. Flushing is a myth IMO, a feel good, self atonement for overdoing plant food in the first place. :)
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
Nutty sKunK said:
Thanks for the reply dude.

Also another question. How do you go about drying your buds? Any top tips?

Cheers
Click to expand...
No tips. Just dry it slowly. I don't get worked up on all this curing chatter. I do bag when the smallest stems snap when bent in half and then burp the baggie every couple of days until it's dry enough to smoke. The entire process depends on RH and temps too.....your call.
 
Katatawnic

Katatawnic

Well-Known Member
I have been searching the 'net for Osmocote's full analysis info, and have had no luck. All I have found is what is already on the label, which is not specific enough.

I grow in pots with coco coir... my area is very heavily populated with gnats, and if I use any kind of soil, my nursery gets infested within a week or two. This is *with* gnat/pest control, such as neem oil doses every 1-2 weeks as needed, cedar oil granules, etc., as well as that nifty little Hot Shot contraption hung from my nursery ceiling. With these and coco, I rarely see a single gnat in my nursery, but with soil I cannot keep them from colonizing in my roots. (Sad, really. Being on a fixed income, I'd much rather use the much cheaper soil that has some/most/all of Mother Nature's foods already in it. But, ya gotta make the best you can with whatcha got.)

I have been using a different brand of slow release pellets (Lilly Miller Multicote) that I got at my neighborhood nursery three years ago that is 18-6-12. Just empied the 2 lb. jar yesterday. I haven't found the same brand since, so I ordered Osmocote last week, which arrived today... perfect timing, as I need to do some transplanting today or tomorrow. :)

Of course growing in coco is technically a hydro method, as coco is 100% inert, so any nutrients my plants get are strictly what I manually feed them. So, I have also been using about 1/2 to 3/4 doses of Jack's 30-10-10 for veg and 20-20-20 for bloom, along with a dash of cal-mag or else epsom salt, as I know that Jack's doesn't have quite enough of those for hydro and/or coco. The slow release pellets have been great because I can water without manually adding ferts much of the time, with Jack's & cal-mag once every 1-2 weeks. (It is constantly stressed not to use water alone with coco, but to always have at least a trace amount of ferts in the water; the pellets take care of that concern. However, I don't know whether or not this is a myth/paradigm.) After three years of doing this, my plants have been very happy, which of course makes me very happy. :)

What I am trying to find out is whether Osmocote is enough on its own for coco growing like it can be in soil. Hence my quest for their full analysis info. I need to know if all the essentials are in there.

I need to grow the "laziest" way possible, because I have severe CNS & autoimmune issues, and have extremely limited strength & mobility. If Osmocote could be enough for most, if not all, of my feeding needs, I could simply water with my long watering nozzle and not struggle nearly as much as I do when hand watering with nutrients. Being able to do just that, with the inevitable occasional tweak as needed, would enable me to get more work done with a much lower price (pain/immobility) to pay afterwards. Also, the less physical work I can get away with, the longer it will be before I can no longer grow my meds on my own anymore... any injury I sustain, including overexerting myself too much or too often, leaves me more disabled than before the injury or severe relapse/flare; I simply never fully recover from them. So it is indeed in my best interest to keep my gardening at the lowest physical exertion possible.

Plus, if Osmocote would be enough on its own, then adding other ferts would mean over feeding; something I abhor and avoid like the plague. ;)

**************************************************

ALSO, I ordered both 19-6-12 and 14-14-14 Osmocote, figuring I'd add a little of the latter to flowering plants for a slight increase of P & K, but still more N since the former will already be in the pot during veg. SO, I open my Amazon package today, and see that Osmocote's 14-14-14 only talks about outdoor gardens; whereas the 19-6-12 specifically says for outdoor and indoor both...

Does this mean that the Flower & Vegetable food (14-14-14) is NOT good/recommended for indoor/potted plants? I don't see why it would cause harm, but I'd rather be safe than sorry. ;)

**************************************************

I do plan on doing a side-by-side comparison when my current batch of cuttings take root, one with my established feeding regimine, another with only Osmocote, and another with only Osmocote and some supplemental ferts as needed for tweaks/fixes. However, I'd grately appreciate any advice in the meantime, for the plants I already have growing in my medicine cabinet so I can ensure continuing growth/health with as little physical strain possible.

Thanks in advance! Sorry so long and rambling... my condition has affected my cognition (very common with chronic illness and pain), and I cannot articulate myself with brief statements anymore. I have to "think out loud" if I am going to have even a chance of getting my point across. :roll: :lol:

And yes, I say nursery instead of grow room... my son and his 34 month old daughter live with us, and we would rather her refer to Grandma's room with plants as a nursery. "Grow room" sounds stoner-ish and has stigma attached to it that I don't want put on her nor her dad & grandparents... and a grow room is indeed a nursery, after all. :mrgreen:
 
indikat

indikat

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben said:
No tips. Just dry it slowly. I don't get worked up on all this curing chatter. I do bag when the smallest stems snap when bent in half and then burp the baggie every couple of days until it's dry enough to smoke. The entire process depends on RH and temps too.....your call.
Click to expand...
you wanna move away from plastic baggies UB get yerself a nice Jar or 10
 
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