The decline in healthcare begins

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
Yes it's about time everyone had health insurance. i am glad no one escapes
You should be too
I didn't say that everyone will have health insurance, what I said was that everyone will pay for it. It is fact that not every US citizen will have insurance. But everyone will pay in one form or another. A VAT tax is just around the corner because it has to be paid for somehow. You can't really believe that you can give everyone a credit and not pay for it somehow. If you think so you are dreaming on a large scale.

And I'm not glad. I find it so very disappointing that personal freedoms are disappearing and most here can't understand what that really means. But in the end they will come to understand it and by that time it will be too late and they will be ensnared and can't get out.
 

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
I'm kinda lost how I'm going to be paying for Joe blow down the street to get on Obama care ww?
after all, I thought the new law was get insurance or pay the not tax tax of $600 some $$, not get insurance or the guy up the street will have to pay the not tax tax of $600??
What am I over looking here?

I also don't see how my insurance coverage I have through a job is going to get me worse treatment because Joe blow down the street has Obama care.. again, I fail to see what I'm over looking here..
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
Physician and New York Times bestselling author Atul Gawande wrote in The New Yorker magazine on January 26, 2009 that the plan “remains extremely popular” among the citizens of MA and that “a large majority would not want to go back to the old system.” Recent polls show that 84% of MA residents are satisfied with the plan!

http://mittromneycentral.com/resources/romneycare/
WAIT! Now you use Romney as a support for your argument? LMAO.

You have to go all the way back to 2009 to find a quote you like. LMAO

About that poll you pointed out:


They only polled 696 hand picked people and still this is what they found The poll of 696 people found that 31 percent of individuals had had a healthcare provider reject their insurance plan and 23 percent were told a doctor was not taking any new patients.

Premiums ranged from $10 to $151 a month, and only 17 percent of those surveyed said they had problems paying their medical bills. It has already been stated that insurance premiums will be much bigger than this. Have questions? Read post #233

The survey also found that individuals enrolled in Commonwealth Care used the emergency room at about the same rate as all other residents. So that excuse of reduced emergency room usage is a made up number too. obamacare won't reduce it.


 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
How about the government mandates you go vegan? No more burgers, bacon or chicken. That'll be hilarious. I'd actually go out and vote for once just so I can laugh at all you liberal dolts who would cry foul and "hey my meat eating is healthy!" That's your opinion, bro. It no longer becomes "opinion" once you're forced to do it. Since you love gubbermint so much, you should feel ashamed you're enabling elementary kids to get on meth, because after all, it's a gateway drug. Like how Utah practically bans pornography and has pictures of rattlesnakes biting you if you dare think of looking at pussy. ( I actually saw a billboard of a snake with the caption "pornography just as dangerous," while driving through Utah.)
Remember Moochele? Look at what she has done to the school lunch program. The kids are hungry and won't eat that stuff and it's all wasted.
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
I'm kinda lost how I'm going to be paying for Joe blow down the street to get on Obama care ww?
after all, I thought the new law was get insurance or pay the not tax tax of $600 some $$, not get insurance or the guy up the street will have to pay the not tax tax of $600??
What am I over looking here?

I also don't see how my insurance coverage I have through a job is going to get me worse treatment because Joe blow down the street has Obama care.. again, I fail to see what I'm over looking here..
This is why you will pay in one form or another for Joe Blow down the street. This will make the US have a VAT tax (obama adviser has been suggesting it) and then the true poor (those not making $32k a year) really won't be able to afford to live even as poorly as they have it now. Everyone will pay.
Unfortunately, the experts working for Medicare’s actuary have (yet again[SUP][1][/SUP]) reported that in its first 10 years, Obamacare will boost health spending by “roughly $621 billion” above the amounts Americans would have spent without this misguided law. Forbes

On that fine you think will be $600, it is $600 or 2.5% of your income. I think for you that would be $1,500 or more and I think that is on the very lite side, my brother is an engineer too and makes well over $100k and guess what you get nothing for it except you helped pay for someone else's insurance and you'd still not have insurance. The Dems have stated that single payer is where they are going. Do you really think you will be able to keep you employer based insurance?
 

pSi007

Active Member
[h=1]Obamacare's average monthly cost across U.S.: $328[/h]
(Reuters) - Americans will pay an average premium of $328 monthly for a mid-tier health insurance plan when the Obamacare health exchanges open for enrollment next week, and most will qualify for government subsidies to lower that price, the Obama administration said on Wednesday.
The figure, based on data for approved insurance plans in 48 states, represents the broadest national estimate for how much Americans will pay for health coverage under President Barack Obama's healthcare reform law next year. The prices of the new plans are at the heart of a political debate over whether they will be affordable enough to attract millions of uninsured Americans.
Prices were lower in states with more competition among insurers and higher in states with fewer players, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) said in its report. Americans will be able to sign up for the new plans via online state exchanges beginning on October 1.
"For millions of Americans these new options will finally make health insurance work within their budgets," HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said during a briefing with reporters.
The Obama administration is counting on signing up 7 million Americans in the first full year of reform through the state exchanges, including 2.7 million younger and healthier consumers who are needed to offset the costs of sicker members.
Debate over whether Obamacare will prove affordable for millions of uninsured Americans has been sharp during the past few months, as states have announced rates. States that have supported the law said it will lead to lower prices. Others that have opposed the reform - including Georgia, Florida, and Indiana - warned of "rate shock" for consumers compared to what they could buy on the individual insurance market a year ago.
HHS said the average price was 16 percent lower than its own projections on premiums. In addition, consumers who earn up to 400 percent of the federal poverty level, or $62,040 for a couple, will qualify for subsidies that will lower the price further.
TEXAS RATES BELOW AVERAGE
The data is mostly based on 36 states where the federal government will operate the insurance exchange. About 14 other states and the District of Columbia are running their own exchange.
Politics aside, states with the lowest average premium tend to have more insurance companies offering plans, the report said. It said eight issuers on average were selling plans in the states with average premiums in the lowest 25 percent, while states with average premiums in the top 25 percent had only three insurers on average.
Texas has been among the Republican-led states most fiercely opposed to Obamacare, but its monthly rates came in below the national average, HHS said. In Austin, Texas, with 76 plans to choose from, a 27-year-old would pay $169 per month for the lowest cost mid-tier plan. In Dallas-Fort Worth, with 43 plans to choose from, that price was $217 per month, the report said.
"The rates in Texas are looking good," said Gary Cohen, who is charged with overseeing the exchanges at the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services.
Enrolling enough consumers is key to making the healthcare overhaul work economically, with price considered the most important factor driving enrollment, according to insurance industry surveys.
Another concern has been that insurance companies will limit access to doctors in order to keep prices low. Cohen said that these so-called "narrow networks" were a trend before the Affordable Care Act went into effect.
The law was adopted in 2010 but two of its main pillars, the health exchanges and the expansion of Medicaid, take effect in 2014. Household names like UnitedHealth Group Inc, Aetna Inc, WellPoint Inc and Humana Inc will sell plans on at least some exchanges. Newcomers such as Medicaid specialist Molina Healthcare Inc will also play a role.
(Reporting by Caroline Humer in New York; Additional reporting by Lewis Krauskopf in New York; Editing by Michele Gershberg and Lisa Shumaker)
http://news.yahoo.com/obamacares-average-monthly-cost-across-u-328-040209815.html




If you refuse to pay for this, they will take away your; Home, Job, Car, Life Savings, ECT... YOU WILL HAVE A MANDATORY INSURANCE, IF YOU CAN PAY, THEY WILL MAKE YOU PAY.

Land of the free... BULLSHIT...
 

pSi007

Active Member
On that fine you think will be $600, it is $600 or 2.5% of your income.
which ever is higher.. I posted these stats before the pigs tried to smoke and mirror my words.. If you make 100k a year in 2016, you will pay 2.5% of 100k if you don't have insurance, annually. It`s 2.5% OR $695 by 2016, ~WHICH EVER IS HIGHER~

...so $2,500 in "fees" if you make 100k

the "fees" are said to increase after 2014-2016.. Maybe they want 10% of your annual income if you refuse to pay Obama Care.




Remember Moochele? Look at what she has done to the school lunch program. The kids are hungry and won't eat that stuff and it's all wasted.
Moosehead is the most horrid first lady since Nancy and the bag of bones.. I just look at Moosehead and I think to myself, I bet her meat farts and shits blow the roof off the white house.. ..more like the shithouse now.. You are right, most kids will not eat that shit.. Parents who want a healthy choice for their children will usually do what my parents did, pack a lunch.

How many "Healthy Choice" parents will rely on cafe food for their children? yuk... handled by idiots, little checks and balances, is the food toxic? who fucking knows, but hell.. It`s "healthy" right?
 

pSi007

Active Member
Someone will piss on yours after you die too. That is the nature of time within this brane. As for your health care reference I believe you meant health insurance. But who am I to quibble with your eggsmellent vocabulary.

It is obvious that talking would be as foolish as your "Brane"... lololol.... ..idiot..



It`s funny, they want me to take pictures of myself.. hahjahahhahah!!!! I have a 9.4 inch penis, want a private picture of that? hahahah... its real... you can also see my flat belly! my girl loves to photo my impressive penis. I can send a private picture with "SUCK IT BITCH, above the names: BUCK, FAG, and BITCH.. whatever your names were.. want that? there is plenty of room near my tatoo that says, "Worlds Tallest Tree". ;)


is calling a thin guy a fat guy helping anything? Or.. do you need to see the penis in a private message?
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
Based on a Manhattan Institute analysis of the HHS numbers, Obamacare will increase underlying insurance rates for younger men by an average of 97 to 99 percent, and for younger women by an average of 55 to 62 percent. Worst off is North Carolina, which will see individual-market rates triple for women, and quadruple for men.

But those states were largely blue states that had set up their own, state-based insurance exchanges. The big data dump that we’ve been waiting for, since then, is from the majority of states that didn’t set up their own state-based exchange. That data is the responsibility of the Obama administration, namely HHS. Finally, with less than a week to go before the exchanges are supposed to go on-line, HHS has released a slim, 15-page report and a press release that summarize some of the premium data.
“Premiums nationwide will also be around 16 percent lower than originally expected,” HHS cheerfully announces in its press release. But that’s a ruse. HHS compared what the Congressional Budget Office projected rates might look like—in 2016—to its own findings. Neither of those numbers tells you the stat that really matters: how much rates will go up next year, under Obamacare, relative to this year, prior to the law taking effect.


Former Congressional Budget Office director Douglas Holtz-Eakin agrees. “There are literally no comparisons to current rates. That is, HHS has chosen to dodge the question of whose rates are going up, and how much. Instead they try to distract with a comparison to a hypothetical number that has nothing to do with the actual experience of real people.”

The HHS report offers only the cheapest bronze, silver and gold plans, and the second-cheapest silver plan.


We look at rates for 27, 40, and 64 year olds; and rates for men and women. (Under Obamacare, rates for men and women are the same, which has the net effect of disproportionately increasing rates for men, who generally paid less under the old system.) The HHS report offers rates for 27-year-olds; and rates for the average-aged exchange participant, a figure that varies by state, but seems to generally land in the mid-thirties.


So, we conducted two comparisons between pre-ACA data and post-ACA data, as reported by HHS. The first comparison is between the cheapest plan available to 27-year-olds pre- and post-Obamacare. The second is between the cheapeast plan available to the average exchange participant, and to the typical 40-year-old pre-Obamacare. We would have liked to have compared rates for older individuals, but HHS didn’t report that data.






27-year-olds will face rate increases as high as 279 percent
As you can see from the map above, many 27-year-olds will face steep increases in the underlying cost of individually-purchased insurance under Obamacare. For the states where we have data—the 36 reported by HHS, plus nine others that we had compiled for our map that HHS didn’t report—rates will go up for men by an average of 97 percent; for women, 55 percent. (In the few cases where HHS reported on states that our map includes, we went with HHS’ numbers.)


Worst off was Nebraska, where the difference between the cheapest plan under the old system and under Obamacare was 279 percent for men, and 227 percent for women: more than triple the old rate. Faring best was Colorado, where rates will decline for both 27-year-old men and women by 36 percent. The only other state to see a rate decline in this analysis was New Hampshire: 8 percent for both men and women.
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
which ever is higher.. I posted these stats before the pigs tried to smoke and mirror my words.. If you make 100k a year in 2016, you will pay 2.5% of 100k if you don't have insurance, annually. It`s 2.5% OR $695 by 2016, ~WHICH EVER IS HIGHER~

...so $2,500 in "fees" if you make 100k

the "fees" are said to increase after 2014-2016.. Maybe they want 10% of your annual income if you refuse to pay Obama Care.
You pay a fee for services - there will be no services rendered.
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member




40-year-olds will face rate increases as high as 305 percent

40-year-olds, surprisingly, will face a similar picture. The cheapest exchange plan for the average enrollee, compared to what a 40-year-old would pay today, will cost an average of 99 percent more for men, and 62 percent for women.


For this cohort, men fared worst in North Carolina, with rate increases of 305 percent. Women got hammered in Nebraska, where rates will increase by a national high of 237 percent. Again, Colorado and New Hampshire fared best, with 17 percent and 5-8 percent declines, respectively.


Remember that here, we aren’t conducting an exact comparison. Instead we’re comparing the lowest-cost bronze plan offered to the average participant in the exchanges, to the cheapest plan offered to 40-year-olds today. This approach artificially flatters Obamacare, because the median age of an exchange participant is, in most states, below the age of 40.


In both the 27-year-old and 40-year-old comparisons, we adjusted the pre-ACA rates to take into account people who would be charged more for insurance, or denied coverage altogether, due to a pre-existing condition, using the same methodology we’ve used in the past.
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
For most people, subsidies won’t counteract rate shock
All of the analyses I’ve discussed thus far involve changes in the underlying cost of health insurance for people who buy it for themselves. Many progressives object to this comparison, because it doesn’t take into account the impact of Obamacare’s subsidies on the net cost of insurance for low-income Americans.


I’ve long argued that it’s irresponsible to ignore the change in underlying premiums, because subsidies only protect some people. Middle-class Americans face the double-whammy of higher insurance premiums, and higher taxes to pay for other people’s subsidies. However, it is important to understand how subsidies will impact the decisions by Americans as to whether or not to participate in the exchanges.


If you click on the “Your Decision” tab on our interactive map, you will now find the results, as assembled by Yevgeniy, for the 13 states plus D.C. in our original database. Here’s the bottom line: most people with average incomes will pay more under Obamacare for individually-purchase insurance than they did before.
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member


In the 13 states plus D.C. (which I will abbreviate as 13+DC), a 27-year-old would have to make 59 percent of the median income of his peers, or less, to come out ahead with regard to Obamacare’s subsidies. A 40-year-old would have to make less than 57 percent of the median income for his peers. On the other hand, older people fare better; the average 64-year-old who makes less than 111 percent of the median income for 64-year-olds will spend less on premiums than he did before.
However, the overall results make clear that most people will not receive enough in subsidies to counteract the degree to which Obamacare drives premiums upward. Remember that nearly two-thirds of the uninsured are under the age of 40. And that young and healthy people are essential to Obamacare; unless these individuals are willing to pay more for health insurance to subsidize everyone else, the exchanges will not serve the goal of providing coverage to the uninsured.
The bottom line: Obamacare makes insurance less affordable



For months, we’ve heard about how Obamacare’s trillions in health care subsidies were going to save America from rate shock. It’s not true. If you shop for coverage on your own, you’re likely to see your rates go up, even after accounting for the impact of pre-existing conditions, even after accounting for the impact of subsidies.


The Obama administration knows this, which is why its 15-page report makes no mention of premiums for insurance available on today’s market. Silence, they say, speaks louder than words. HHS’ silence on the difference between Obamacare’s insurance premiums and those available today tell you everything you need to know. Rates are going higher. And if you’re healthy, or you’re young, the Obama administration expects you to do your duty and pay up.

FORBES
 

pSi007

Active Member
You pay a fee for services - there will be no services rendered.
This is why I am pissed off and feel pissed on.. Why is this mandated? I have witnessed TOO MUCH abuse in Health Care.. Why should a mandatory and LIMITLESS insurance program, in which I am forced to PAY against my will, facilitate abuse?


anyone who supports this shit, I will be doing some lawn watering on your graves.. ;)



I'm kinda lost how I'm going to be paying for Joe blow down the street to get on Obama care ww?
after all, I thought the new law was get insurance or pay the not tax tax of $600 some $$, not get insurance or the guy up the street will have to pay the not tax tax of $600??
What am I over looking here?


..Politics.. They will NEVER tell you the truth.. Obama Care is sold as "Universal Health insurance".. You are really paying into a slave driving nation and they will NEVER tell you the full fact. How popular would Obama Care be if they told you the truth, i.e. "IF YOU DON'T PAY, YOU LOSE EVERYTHING IN YOUR LIFE". It`s Martial Law.... and some people like BUCK are too dumb to see it.
 

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
This is why you will pay in one form or another for Joe Blow down the street. This will make the US have a VAT tax (obama adviser has been suggesting it) and then the true poor (those not making $32k a year) really won't be able to afford to live even as poorly as they have it now. Everyone will pay.
Unfortunately, the experts working for Medicare’s actuary have (yet again[SUP][1][/SUP]) reported that in its first 10 years, Obamacare will boost health spending by “roughly $621 billion” above the amounts Americans would have spent without this misguided law. Forbes

On that fine you think will be $600, it is $600 or 2.5% of your income. I think for you that would be $1,500 or more and I think that is on the very lite side, my brother is an engineer too and makes well over $100k and guess what you get nothing for it except you helped pay for someone else's insurance and you'd still not have insurance. The Dems have stated that single payer is where they are going. Do you really think you will be able to keep you employer based insurance?
So your brother is an engineer who makes 100k a year and doesn't have work paid insurance ?
I find that kind of hard to believe..
If its true maybe he should look into getting a job where his employer actually pays for insurance, like 99% of engineers in the us probably have..
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
So your brother is an engineer who makes 100k a year and doesn't have work paid insurance ?
I find that kind of hard to believe..
If its true maybe he should look into getting a job where his employer actually pays for insurance, like 99% of engineers in the us probably have..
My brother is retired and does contract work (nuclear plants) and has Medicare. He makes more than 100k. Your belief that you will continue to have employer based health insurance is wrong in a few years it will be a distant memory.

My neighbor just lost his retirement healthcare he worked for IBM. He was dumped into one of the exchanges just like the GE retirees.
 

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
My brother is retired and does contract work (nuclear plants) and has Medicare. He makes more than 100k. Your belief that you will continue to have employer based health insurance is wrong in a few years it will be a distant memory.

My neighbor just lost his retirement healthcare he worked for IBM. He was dumped into one of the exchanges just like the GE retirees.
If he has medicare, he has insurance and nothing will change for him. Why you so full of shit all the time?
 

Winter Woman

Well-Known Member
If he has medicare, he has insurance and nothing will change for him. Why you so full of shit all the time?
My discussion wasn't about my brother and I never said his insurance would change. He happens to be in the same field as Racer that's all.

Do you only skim the posts and then make assumptions? Seems like it to me.
 
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