Amino Acid Nitrogen just Soy Protein Powder?

BigDavid

Well-Known Member
At the risk of sounding stupid, I was curious if anyone knew the answer to this. I've been seeing Soy Hydrosolate based Amino acids for Nitrogen in organic farming for a hot minute. Now, I see Brandon Rust using his own product called Amino N+.

From what I can tell, it's just soy protein powder?

 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
At the risk of sounding stupid, I was curious if anyone knew the answer to this. I've been seeing Soy Hydrosolate based Amino acids for Nitrogen in organic farming for a hot minute. Now, I see Brandon Rust using his own product called Amino N+.

From what I can tell, it's just soy protein powder?

would an SST achieve the same goal?
what does the process of making it a hydrosolate remove? Is it making something more plant available?
 

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
If it's true soy hydrolysate, the amino acids have been separated into their L forms. Not all soy protein is soy hydrolysate, BUT I think regular soy protein might work nearly as well. NPK sells a product called "Raw Omina", and as far as I can tell it's just soy protein too. Any of the dry "amino acid" products for plants with an NPK of around 14-0-0 and 80% amino acids are all regular soy protein. I bought a pound of it from GS plant foods (or something similar, forgot the name) for around $12, compared to $15-$20 for the NPK stuff. Don't spend a lot of money for these products. I use 1/4 teaspoon per gallon during bloom. I love amino acids for plants, both soy hydrolysate and fish hydrolysate, and there are studies that actually compare them to each other-they are some of the only products that have a noticeable positive effect on plants, besides just being the ultimate source of nitrogen. I'm not sure how they improve terpenes, essential oils, etc, but my plants are always better when I add some Neptune's Harvest hydrolysate to my base nutes, whether cannabis, tomatoes, berries, etc. It might have something to do with the sulfur containing amino acids, or maybe because it feeds the microbiome so well, or maybe some combination of those and other factors.
 

Wastei

Well-Known Member
If it's true soy hydrolysate, the amino acids have been separated into their L forms. Not all soy protein is soy hydrolysate, BUT I think regular soy protein might work nearly as well. NPK sells a product called "Raw Omina", and as far as I can tell it's just soy protein too. Any of the dry "amino acid" products for plants with an NPK of around 14-0-0 and 80% amino acids are all regular soy protein. I bought a pound of it from GS plant foods (or something similar, forgot the name) for around $12, compared to $15-$20 for the NPK stuff. Don't spend a lot of money for these products. I use 1/4 teaspoon per gallon during bloom. I love amino acids for plants, both soy hydrolysate and fish hydrolysate, and there are studies that actually compare them to each other-they are some of the only products that have a noticeable positive effect on plants, besides just being the ultimate source of nitrogen. I'm not sure how they improve terpenes, essential oils, etc, but my plants are always better when I add some Neptune's Harvest hydrolysate to my base nutes, whether cannabis, tomatoes, berries, etc. It might have something to do with the sulfur containing amino acids, or maybe because it feeds the microbiome so well, or maybe some combination of those and other factors.
Awesome stuff! Amino acids act as PGR's in their effects if used as foliar. I've played around a little bit with different strengths and I see the same signs of using only aminos and PGR's combined with aminos as foliar.

High auxin release and auxillary dominance. Leaflets curling down while it keeps on growing in the same speed and growth is not affected negatively. Symptoms disappears in 1-2 days in most situations.

As a root additive it's good for microbal growth and diversity. All the L-amino acids has different effects in humans and plants should be viewed in the same way in plants IMO. Cheers!
 

MustangStudFarm

Well-Known Member
At the risk of sounding stupid, I was curious if anyone knew the answer to this. I've been seeing Soy Hydrosolate based Amino acids for Nitrogen in organic farming for a hot minute. Now, I see Brandon Rust using his own product called Amino N+.

From what I can tell, it's just soy protein powder?

I saw that podcast. I think that they were also saying that they use it chelate micronutirents. I'm using Bryant Mason as my soil agronomist now, the same guy that Rust is using. Are you familiar with Future Cannabis Project podcast??? Bryant Mason got me using soy bean meal and I am VERY happy with it so far. I never would have used it otherwise...
 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
I saw that podcast. I think that they were also saying that they use it chelate micronutirents. I'm using Bryant Mason as my soil agronomist now, the same guy that Rust is using. Are you familiar with Future Cannabis Project podcast??? Bryant Mason got me using soy bean meal and I am VERY happy with it so far. I never would have used it otherwise...
I have watched most of that podcast. So are you strictly using it during flower, or for root developement, or is there an organism(s) you're trying to grow??
 

BigDavid

Well-Known Member
I saw that podcast. I think that they were also saying that they use it chelate micronutirents. I'm using Bryant Mason as my soil agronomist now, the same guy that Rust is using. Are you familiar with Future Cannabis Project podcast??? Bryant Mason got me using soy bean meal and I am VERY happy with it so far. I never would have used it otherwise...
So where do you get your soybean meal?
 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
If you were a fella' who would get raw meal and put it through the process. Any feed mill will have it on hand. 50 lb sack would be 18-22 right now. Also, since you are breaking it down you wouldn't have to worry about sourcing. The soybean hull might have Glyphosate or another Herbicide on them because of a process known as desiccation (they spray round-up or something else to kill the crops early, to start field drying). As far as "round-up ready" beans, that's a gene trait. By breaking down proteins it wouldn't be something to be concerned about. However, there have been studies that show reduced nutrient values in GMO crops and a slower decomposition rate.
Crops known to be sprayed heavily are Rice (from everywhere), soybeans, corn, and cotton. Ones that aren't, winter wheats, oats (except at harvest), cereal rye, buckwheat, and barley.
 

youraveragehorticulturist

Well-Known Member
Roots Organics includes (non GMO) soybean meal in their "Uprising" dry fertilizers and their "Terp Tea" dry/tea brewing fertilizers.

Roots and Down to Earth also sell straight up soy bean meal too.
 

MustangStudFarm

Well-Known Member
I have watched most of that podcast. So are you strictly using it during flower, or for root developement, or is there an organism(s) you're trying to grow??
Well, Bryant Mason asked if I was open to trying a new N source and I told him "yes". I was low on nitrogen, so this was mostly to fix N-P-K on the soil test that I had done. He had me use Neem and Soy bean meal for a N input and it seems to be going very well now. I was dealing with yellowing pretty bad and I'm dark green again.
DSC01581.JPG
 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
Well, Bryant Mason asked if I was open to trying a new N source and I told him "yes". I was low on nitrogen, so this was mostly to fix N-P-K on the soil test that I had done. He had me use Neem and Soy bean meal for a N input and it seems to be going very well now. I was dealing with yellowing pretty bad and I'm dark green again.
View attachment 4846282
Are you noticing any benefits pest-wise because of the use of the neem?
I bought a small amount of solution grade at my local health food store but have only used it in the avocados so far.
 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
I just used Down to Earth box stuff.
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You should ask him if the hydrosolate process would nullify any or most possible negatives to feed grade soybean meal due to it's availability.
One thing grower should always think about is how long is the logistics train to get you what you rely on? There may even be like some amish family farm that has the same or better quality for cheaper. My hydro store has been out of DtE on more than one occasion.
 

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
You guys might be interested in this study https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7760353/. Both plant and animal based amino acids increased K and MG levels AND increased total phenolic compounds-more proof of what we've been saying for years. I give both soy protein and fish hydrolysate during flower, because they're cheap, and they really do have an impact on bud size and terpenes. If you are having issues with cal/mag type deficiencies and can't figure it out, I'd give amino acids a shot. Another great use for them is if your bloom formula doesn't have enough nitrogen to carry you through stretch, or even beyond, supplement with neptune's harvest and you get benefits way above and beyond the nitrogen boost.
 

living gardening

Well-Known Member
I'm attempting to stay away from animal by-products as much as possible.
The question I have that I never got an answer to was: What type of schedule would you feed to get maximum effect out of the order of what.
like molasses feedings to bring on the bacteria, then a lacto, a Kefir, or an SST ?? What order would you get max effect from?
 
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