Auto watering help needed.

xtsho said:

Dripworks.

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Thank you sir. that makes it easier for sure. Its all overwhelming. So overwhelming that im making it too difficult for myself. Im WAY overthinking this.

I guess i should just figure what size line to go with first. 5mm sounds about right. I think that is what is so confusing....i dont know how or why im making this so hard on myself.

If i go with pc drippers and a high psi pump , do i need different size lines or can i run it all on 1/4" line? Or do i need a 1/2 main to feed the smaller lines ?
I dont want to do the high pressure system but i see no way around it for the size i need. I need a couple hundred sites for everything in my setup including houseplants i breed. Im sure i can handle breaking into zones myself. once i figure out the main plan.

Thank everyone!

If I was making something for that scale I'd use 13mm 1/2" main with 5mm nipples + tube... Maybe 5mm taps?

Edit... The downside is it would require a uniform crop, but depending on the pump volume and pot sizes you could work around it with T, X pieces and 5mm taps.

Star Dog said:

If I was making something for that scale I'd use 13mm 1/2" main with 5mm nipples + tube... Maybe 5mm taps?

Edit... The downside is it would require a uniform crop, but depending on the pump volume and pot sizes you could work around it with T, X pieces and 5mm taps.

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Why does the crop need to be uniform ? Thank for you time sir!

getogrow said:

Why does the crop need to be uniform ? Thank for you time sir!

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Erm idk, good Question ... I was thinking the same amount will be delivered to each site, but with taps you could control individual pot volumes

getogrow said:

Thank you sir. that makes it easier for sure. Its all overwhelming. So overwhelming that im making it too difficult for myself. Im WAY overthinking this.

I guess i should just figure what size line to go with first. 5mm sounds about right. I think that is what is so confusing....i dont know how or why im making this so hard on myself.

If i go with pc drippers and a high psi pump , do i need different size lines or can i run it all on 1/4" line? Or do i need a 1/2 main to feed the smaller lines ?
I dont want to do the high pressure system but i see no way around it for the size i need. I need a couple hundred sites for everything in my setup including houseplants i breed. Im sure i can handle breaking into zones myself. once i figure out the main plan.

Thank everyone!

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I thought about going auto water system myself, but it wasn’t until I remembered why I hated growing hydro style back in the day that I started having seconds thoughts. Totally spaced out the fact that I need a water heater, ph controller pump kit, and hygrometer. If I was running 100 plants like you plan on doing I would probably invest in all of that, but for a 6 plant max system, I think I’ll stick to hand watering.

getogrow said:

Why does the crop need to be uniform ? Thank for you time sir!

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I think he meant that, basically, let's say you had 100 plants, and 60 of them were "medium" size cannabis plants in 2 gallon pots, while 4 of them were mother plants in bigger 3 or 5 gallon pots, and then you had 36 random sized and types of house plants in varying size containers. It could be difficult to figure out how to deliver the right amount of water to each of those "groups" of plants.
I'd think that'd be a challenge whether you chose a high pressure/pc emitter setup, or any other automatic setup though.

What @Star Dog mentioned about the "tap" (inline valve?) idea, I'm not sure if that'd work with pc drip emitters, because of how they work. Would they just somehow "adjust" to the pressure created by closing off the valve a bit or something? I don't know, it's just what I thought immediately.

But, if you wanted to use 1gph pc emitters for a bunch of 3 gallon cannabis plants, for example. Then you wanted a bunch of other plants that needed less water, but wanted to use the same "system" for them. You could give those plants 0.25gph by splitting the the 1/4" line into four after one of the 1gph pc emitters, and having one of them go to each of those plants. Or I guess you could buy 0.25gph pc emitters for those plants instead, too.

@2com your spot on that's exactly what I was thinking, you put it much better...

I think he meant that, basically, let's say you had 100 plants, and 60 of them were "medium" size cannabis plants in 2 gallon pots, while 4 of them were mother plants in bigger 3 or 5 gallon pots, and then you had 36 random sized and types of house plants in varying size containers. It could be difficult to figure out how to deliver the right amount of water to each of those "groups" of plants I'd think that'd be a challenge

In a tent it's easy enough but trying to dial in bigger numbers would be a challenge right enough.

I was looking at some rv/diaphragm pumps. The reviews mention that there are some somewhat uncommon threads on these pumps. I think it's 1/2"-14 NPT (and they're both male). They sell branded connectors (adapters) that go from the pumps male thread to a 1/2" barbed connector. These adapters/fittings say they're 1/2"-14 NPT(F) (F for female I assume).

So annoying trying to find the right parts (preferably not metal) to switch from that thread convention to a more common style like is found on schedule 40 pvc, and basic/common poly adapters from home improvement stores/etc.

If any plumbers/pipefitters, etc., could share a link or something, that'd be great. I don't want to force the wrong part to make it fit.

@Beehive Hey man. Can I ask you a question regarding using these diaphragm pumps (eg: shurflo)?
For this particular model, I see/read that they have a cutoff switch at 45psi. And these also don't like low flow, for example, if used in an rv and when a faucet is just barely turned on, they'll "chug" or "stutter on-off-on-off. And due to the 45psi cutoff, if the system (pipes, tubing, emitters, hosing, etc.) is "allowed" to reach 45psi, then they'll shut off. Then probably back on again, seconds later, and repeat that cycle.

So, how did you get around these issues? Do you install some kind of "return" back to the reservoir with valve and then adjust the valve to where the pressure never reaches 45psi while the pump is running? (And also install a pressure gauge in a tee on the output side of the pump?

Thanks for any help.

Edit: Hmm, maybe an inline pressure regulator directly after/on the output side of the pump? Say, 35 or 40psi? That might keep the pump running during our timing/on cycle without having it cut out.
Though after writing that out, I don't know that adding a "pressure *limiting* device" there would work the way I was thinking. The pump would still reach it's internal 45psi limit and cut off...maybe... Maybe just sooner than before, haha.

So how much pressure does it take to open the .5gph pc drippers ? A certain number of psi ?

Once i get the parts in my possession, i will be able to control the different zones with different amounts of water to each but for now i just need the basic stuff to get me started....
I think i'll just be wasteful on my order an grab a bunch of stuff and a bunch of extra line. I'll order just enough drippers and one pump.

Surely the first thing coming off the water pump will be a pressure regulator of some sort ?
maybe one regulator per zone ect...

getogrow said:

So how much pressure does it take to open the .5gph pc drippers ? A certain number of psi ?

Once i get the parts in my possession, i will be able to control the different zones with different amounts of water to each but for now i just need the basic stuff to get me started....
I think i'll just be wasteful on my order an grab a bunch of stuff and a bunch of extra line. I'll order just enough drippers and one pump.

Surely the first thing coming off the water pump will be a pressure regulator of some sort ?
maybe one regulator per zone ect...

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What brand of pc dripper (and what model)? They should list a psi range (minimum to operate, and maximum to stay below). I think the floraflex ones, for example, are 15-50psi. Some of the netafim ones are similar, or something like 15-40psi. Don't take those numbers as real though, double check with the store, or the manufacturer's website.
Your water pump will list a "max" psi too, which I think is measure with "open flow" - no backpressure from hose, etc. If that number is under the max psi of your drippers, I'd say you're probably safe without any type of pressure regulator (like some inline reg., if that's what you mean).

Those rv diaphragm pumps, though, I'm not sure about. Like I explained in an previous post, I think you have to make sure you have enough flow, because they actually cutoff when they reach their max psi, and you don't want that.

2com said:

What brand of pc dripper (and what model)? They should list a psi range (minimum to operate, and maximum to stay below). I think the floraflex ones, for example, are 15-50psi. Some of the netafim ones are similar, or something like 15-40psi. Don't take those numbers as real though, double check with the store, or the manufacturer's website.
Your water pump will list a "max" psi too, which I think is measure with "open flow" - no backpressure from hose, etc. If that number is under the max psi of your drippers, I'd say you're probably safe without any type of pressure regulator (like some inline reg., if that's what you mean).

Those rv diaphragm pumps, though, I'm not sure about. Like I explained in an previous post, I think you have to make sure you have enough flow, because they actually cutoff when they reach their max psi, and you don't want that.

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I was looking at both netafim and floraflex i believe.. Thank you , that answers that question.

Just to double check though: So in your example , a pump with a max psi of say 35-45 would work fine with a dripper ranging from 15-50?

Not quite sure what a rv diaphram pump is. I was going to grab one used in this thread or ask again about which style to grab.

kingromano said:

i use this one
View attachment 4815094
thats a must with PC drippers

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I was going to go with the Shurflo # 2088-594-154
or this one in the pic

curious to see if it work with diaphragm pump + netafim pc drippers
i read the 594-154 push around 3.0bar at 3gal/min
it could work

surface pumps are the way to do but they are noisy, main problem imo

getogrow said:

I was looking at both netafim and floraflex i believe.. Thank you , that answers that question.

Just to double check though: So in your example , a pump with a max psi of say 35-45 would work fine with a dripper ranging from 15-50?

Not quite sure what a rv diaphram pump is. I was going to grab one used in this thread or ask again about which style to grab.

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I was looking at those both as well, and am gonna go with netafim "Woodpecker" with "CNL" (check valve type feature). They might be called WPCJ, or other. I think they have slightly different names depending on the market. There are some good info pdfs/pages on some of these features, and netafim has a youtube channel with some *great* videos on related (drip/irrigation) things.

Yes, a pump with a pressure inside the min and max dripper psi should wourk. 35-45 *should* be good.

The pump you list below (Shurflo # 2088-594-154) is a diaphragm pump. The 12V variations of these diaphragm pumps are often used in RVs or on boats, etc. Where the power source would likely be 12V DC (from the/a battery), instead of 120V AC.

getogrow said:

I was going to go with the Shurflo # 2088-594-154
or this one in the pic

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Yea, I've seen a few pics of someone using this pump for this purpose. I've got one ordered, to play around with too.
If you go on amazon and put in RV pump, you'll see lots of these - though the majority will probably be 12V - so unless you want that, make sure it's 120V AC.
Diaphragm refers to the actual mechanism of the pump - how it functions. Youtube "how a diaphragm pump (or RV pump, maybe) works". It works similar to how a diaphragm air pump works (as opposed to a piston style air pump). The more common style of water pumps (like aquarium water pumps) are "impeller" style, where an impeller rotates and pushes the water.

PS: good luck finding that particular gardena water pump. I know gardena is sold in the US/North America, but I really couldn't find any solid listings of it anywhere - especially in canada. But on the "dripworks" website, they list two pumps used for there system (which isn't pressure comp. emitters, but is pressurized spray emitters). One is the seaflow brand of diaphragm pump, same as the shurflo - maybe better brand (company, warranty wise. not sure). The other is a "superior pump" (that's the brand name). I think it's of the same "style" as the gardena that @kingromano uses, which I still am not sure on the proper name of. I think the industry name might be "jet pump". They have high flow *and* high pressure, and I think they use an impeller.

yes the gardena i posted is a surface/jet pump
and yep 2com you're right i go it in europe, i don't know if they sell in US

its just a cheap 3.6bar surface pump, any other pump with same characteristics will work
the advantage of the gardena is that impeller/parts in contact with water are made in plastic .. not metal

for our applications it is preferable IMO

it also only cost 85 euros .. not negligible

kingromano said:

yes the gardena i posted is a surface/jet pump
and yep 2com you're right i go it in europe, i don't know if they sell in US

its just a cheap 3.6bar surface pump, any other pump with same characteristics will work
the advantage of the gardena is that impeller/parts in contact with water are made in plastic .. not metal

for our applications it is preferable IMO

it also only cost 85 euros .. not negligible

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$85 eur, that's only $125 cad. If I could find it in canada for even $150 or so I'd buy it. Cool.

You done yet, Ricky?

2com said:

You done yet, Ricky?

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fuck no....still in the same spot as before ....hand watering with a pump instead of jugs..... im into 50's tech now.

I think my brain is so full of other info that i cant fit anytrhing else up there.....or an even better explanation would be that i am not interested in this subject at all.... i was just hoping one of you guys could part it together and i can buy it HAHHAHAHAHA my bad. im still trying though.

Do you think a diaphram pump is a bad idea? (other then the fact there is no way a diaphram can outlast an impeller...)

I recently had a shitty crop and found russet mites.... thats whats been on my mind for a lil over a month. I seen a plant or two with them on there and got rid of um .....didnt see anymore but the room took a major loss. ive never seen anything like it (without messing up the food)

getogrow said:

fuck no....still in the same spot as before ....hand watering with a pump instead of jugs..... im into 50's tech now.

I think my brain is so full of other info that i cant fit anytrhing else up there.....or an even better explanation would be that i am not interested in this subject at all.... i was just hoping one of you guys could part it together and i can buy it HAHHAHAHAHA my bad. im still trying though.

Do you think a diaphram pump is a bad idea? (other then the fact there is no way a diaphram can outlast an impeller...)

I recently had a shitty crop and found russet mites.... thats whats been on my mind for a lil over a month. I seen a plant or two with them on there and got rid of um .....didnt see anymore but the room took a major loss. ive never seen anything like it (without messing up the food)

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Oh, man. That's terrible about the mites. I came across this video recently, I wasn't looking for anything related, but I thought it'd be useful for others who have mites or something.
And it's not the first time I've heard of this either. https://www.amazon.com/Fruit-Fly-Bar-Parent-Pack/dp/B07CR9B27M/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=bar+pro+fruit+fly&qid=1624647066&sr=8-5

I can't remember the active ingredient, "dichlorvos" something. Here's their website too, https://www.fruitflybarpro.com/

From what I hear, those things are nothing to fuck around with.