Cannabinoid Hyperemesis Syndrome, questions

ttystikk said:

Bullshit. Before I ever heard of neem oil this want a thing. I used Azamax and suddenly there was an issue. Stopped using it and it went away. So much for 'bro science'.

Click to expand...

I can't say I support @Bri62 comments because I have no reference for his statements, I'd love to see the paper/article/science journal it was published in...

But that said, I used neem oil, had the issues, stopped using neem oil, and the issues went away... so I think that you and I might be by definition 'bro science' -- if we claim our experiences are universal. We are just two data points, which nothing conclusive can be made of. You won't ever use Azamax again, I won't ever use Neem Oil again, because we weigh heavily on our own experience, as we should. Since I haven't seen conclusive science done, I think the idea is to collect enough anecdotal data to formulate our own hypothesis.

Peace.

Dr Magill said:

My daughter in law is a pharmacist. PhD. She says there is always an underlying element that acts with the cannabis in this disease - typically other drugs - but other things as well. Other physiological events going on in your system that you might not be aware of.

Click to expand...

oftentimes, when I smoke weed together with tobacco, I feel ill + throw up.
pure cannabis - never, ever. more to the opposite, if I'm having something gastrointestinally small problems, mj will get rid of it within minutes.

Humanrob said:

I can't say I support @Bri62 comments because I have no reference for his statements, I'd love to see the paper/article/science journal it was published in...

But that said, I used neem oil, had the issues, stopped using neem oil, and the issues went away... so I think that you and I might be by definition 'bro science' -- if we claim our experiences are universal. We are just two data points, which nothing conclusive can be made of. You won't ever use Azamax again, I won't ever use Neem Oil again, because we weigh heavily on our own experience, as we should. Since I haven't seen conclusive science done, I think the idea is to collect enough anecdotal data to formulate our own hypothesis.

Peace.

Click to expand...

Bro science is, 'my bro told me so it must be true'.

Anecdotal evidence based on observation is, 'I did this and noticed X result, and when I didn't do it I got Y result'.

The two approaches could not be more different.

The main difference between the anecdotal/evidence based approach and a full on scientific method based experiment is basically better documentation and often blind or double blind testing.

The bro science fools still be jamming screwdrivers through the stalk because 'my bro said they finish better' lol

Kassiopeija said:

oftentimes, when I smoke weed together with tobacco, I feel ill + throw up.
pure cannabis - never, ever. more to the opposite, if I'm having something gastrointestinally small problems, mj will get rid of it within minutes.

Click to expand...

I've smoked tobacco only on very rare occasions and it always made me want to retch. Not exactly a buzz I'm looking for!

I have heard that native American shamans used it to get vivid dreams. No idea if there's anything to that.

shorelineOG said:

It starts when you develop an allergy to marijuana. If you get hives from skin contact and the smell triggers sneezing and sinus reactions it's from overexposure, exhausting receptors.

Click to expand...

This does not square with my experience, and I have chronic allergy issues.

I'm not saying you're wrong, only that my personal experience is very different.

I only recommend the use of Azamax or neem oil in veg well before bloom, so none of it ends up on parts people will ingest.

ttystikk said:

Bro science is, 'my bro told me so it must be true'.

Anecdotal evidence based on observation is, 'I did this and noticed X result, and when I didn't do it I got Y result'.

The two approaches could not be more different.

The main difference between the anecdotal/evidence based approach and a full on scientific method based experiment is basically better documentation and often blind or double blind testing.

The bro science fools still be jamming screwdrivers through the stalk because 'my bro said they finish better' lol

Click to expand...

I think we are actually in complete agreement, which is why I said "if we claim our experiences are universal". Your reply that I quoted sounded as though you were saying your experience was conclusive evidence of something, but I probably misread your meaning. No worries, and thanks for clarifying.

I have chs and have been diagnosed. I use neem heavily in my veggie garden and that is about when the symptoms started. I think with the spider mite issue people are using neem more heavily. I am going to try and go off my medicine and see if I get sick without using neem

poundofyourfinest said:

I have chs and have been diagnosed. I use neem heavily in my veggie garden and that is about when the symptoms started. I think with the spider mite issue people are using neem more heavily. I am going to try and go off my medicine and see if I get sick without using neem

Click to expand...

Neem and its derivatives like Azamax and Azatrol have been fingered pretty conclusively as at least one cause of CHS, and likely the primary cause.

Neem is an oil and is therefore persistent; it stays on the plant, especially indoors where there's no rain. Therefore, do not use it after the first week of bloom, period.

what i have learnt about cannabis from A dealing with drug addicted kids and B going thru ivf addiction with cannabis can be pretty bad offering weeks with out sleep chronic stomach aches head aches migraines and so on which aint all that bad now we get into the ivf side of things funny how they say cannabis can help you but will destroy a embryo lower sperm counts change your genes and there is plenty more

I’ve been hospitalized multiple times and they claim this is my problem but the only relief I get is smoking or hot showers it happens every month or 2 and I smoke on a daily basis

ttystikk said:

Neem and its derivatives like Azamax and Azatrol have been fingered pretty conclusively as at least one cause of CHS, and likely the primary cause.

Neem is an oil and is therefore persistent; it stays on the plant, especially indoors where there's no rain. Therefore, do not use it after the first week of bloom, period.

Click to expand...

im also in one of these year old threads about neem oil that had ppl pretty much laughing at me. I was getting really sick for a while last year.
I switched dispensaries (I'm also in co) after they wouldnt give me a straight answer if they used neem oil or not and my symptoms went away.
It should be noted I was smoking a minimum of an ounce a week from the same place. I believe it just built upin my system to toxic levels over several months of heavy smoking.

localhippy420 said:

I’ve been hospitalized multiple times and they claim this is my problem but the only relief I get is smoking or hot showers it happens every month or 2 and I smoke on a daily basis

Click to expand...

hot showers were also one of my only ways of getting relief. I used to just lay in there for like an hour at a time sometimes a few times a day. It was mostly the stomach problems. I could barely eat anything without it tearing me up. Thats all gone now.

is there a way for me to find out if neem oil is present in herb i purchase? microscope? signs to look for?
i know its not in my garden, but that only accounts for 1/3 of the smoke i smoke, id love to be able to find out for myself without a labtest

fragileassassin said:

im also in one of these year old threads about neem oil that had ppl pretty much laughing at me. I was getting really sick for a while last year.
I switched dispensaries (I'm also in co) after they wouldnt give me a straight answer if they used neem oil or not and my symptoms went away.
It should be noted I was smoking a minimum of an ounce a week from the same place. I believe it just built upin my system to toxic levels over several months of heavy smoking.

Click to expand...

Everything about your reported symptoms and timeline fits the profile.

Just because something is 'natural' doesn't mean it's good for you.

Belladonna is organic but it will still kill you.

Here's my original post on it if anyone wants to read through it. Some good convo in there.
I actually questioned if CHS is even a real thing or if we were just being slowly poisoned by neem oil.

ttystikk said:

Neem is an oil and is therefore persistent; it stays on the plant, especially indoors where there's no rain. Therefore, do not use it after the first week of bloom, period

Click to expand...

yes, it's persistant - and no good thing comes out if an oil is turned to fumes by a flame...

Kassiopeija said:

yes, it's persistant - and no good thing comes out if an oil is turned to fumes by a flame...

Click to expand...

So many people have a hard time with that part and dont realize how things change when theyre burned, how our lungs absorb things different, and dont have same the benefit of filtration via the liver as you do when you eat something.
"I can eat it, so it must be safe to burn and inhale it."

Kassiopeija said:

yes, it's persistant - and no good thing comes out if an oil is turned to fumes by a flame...

Click to expand...

Or, if it's concentrated into dabs.

Just now learning of this and all the conversations around neem.

Does anyone know how this would relate to the use of neem (and in my case also Karanja if it has any relevance) in super soil mixes? I have been using neem in my soil lately as I was looking for the benefits of both pest control and a good input amendment in general.

Now you've all got me wondering how it would relate to what is taken up by the plant and retained throughout the life of the grow and what would be left in the final product.

I really liked it as an amendment - I had mites once early on while learning and ever since then I do preventatives with neem and at least one other product at the beginning of going into the flowering space. When I started doing the super soil/SIP deal I've been using it a bit as well - even liberally as a primary N input for early veg/mid flower.

I am currently using mild hyperemesis to lose weight Have restarted smoking after 4 years off, as soon as my intake got serious i got nausea, massive reduction in appetite, and so far have vomited twice in about a month. No sprays on my weed, grown in coco using the CX range of nutrients and additives/smokenfeathers, flushed with only ph6 water for 8 days before harvest.