COVID-19 WILL SEIZE YOUR RIGHTS & DESTROY OUR ECONOMY

TheRealDman said:

Thanks! Of course I worry about both my kids, that’s what parents do, right! My Son wears a mask and gloves, just like the other 6 lockdowns at his facility in the last 2 years....so kinda biz as usual for him. That’s the state of the old folks system, they suck! They’re petri dishs for this kind of respiratory virus. My other kid still lives at home, so by extension her exposure, is our exposure. I feel I answered your question, so now a couple of my own. If it’s as bad a risk for the general population as they say, why are 600,000 people still riding the TTC everyday? The Feds deployed 16,000 troops to Borden in case of critical emergency need, right?. They didn’t go to any hospitals to relieve overworked staff, the didn’t have to build field hospitals, they didn’t have to deliver groceries...they are being sent to nursing homes, exactly where they are needed, as this is where the true problem with this virus lays. The rest of us are caught up in fear mongering dipshit politicians, who were way late to get a handle on where the real problem was festering. The overstepped, and people fell in line no questions asked....cuz how could the Gov ever get it wrong?!?!

Click to expand...

We do understand the risks...this is the problem. We know this can go several ways. We are trying to combine the best way to stop this from spreading and keeping things running. That seems easy to see Dman. Nobody want to stay home and I can clearly see the authorities are not comfortable ordering it either. I feel fear mongering is the wrong description. To me they have been perfectly straight forward and honest. This is Canada I'm speaking of.
Yes, were they too late to ramp up....for sure in some parts of the world. I think we were reasonably surprised and simply we're learning as we went.

I've heard this gov admit it got some stuff wrong. Seems pretty unusual to hear actually. Trudy has been pretty good at telling it like it is imo. Is he perfect ..no.
Now Druggy ford has really surprised me. His REAL concern is obvious daily. The guy really cares and is worried.
Believe me....I'm the last guy to embrace authority. But I also see things for how they are. I'm far from panicking or being told what to do. But I can also be reasonable and see what is best for me.

TheRealDman said:

Thanks! Of course I worry about both my kids, that’s what parents do, right! My Son wears a mask and gloves, just like the other 6 lockdowns at his facility in the last 2 years....so kinda biz as usual for him. That’s the state of the old folks system, they suck! They’re petri dishs for this kind of respiratory virus. My other kid still lives at home, so by extension her exposure, is our exposure. I feel I answered your question, so now a couple of my own. If it’s as bad a risk for the general population as they say, why are 600,000 people still riding the TTC everyday? The Feds deployed 16,000 troops to Borden in case of critical emergency need, right?. They didn’t go to any hospitals to relieve overworked staff, the didn’t have to build field hospitals, they didn’t have to deliver groceries...they are being sent to nursing homes, exactly where they are needed, as this is where the true problem with this virus lays. The rest of us are caught up in fear mongering dipshit politicians, who were way late to get a handle on where the real problem was festering. The overstepped, and people fell in line no questions asked....cuz how could the Gov ever get it wrong?!?!

Click to expand...

I don't feel they have told us the risk is bad. They are saying that it's possible to spread this is if we aren't careful. They are saying they don't really know the risk so let's be cautious. Sounds good to me.

TheRealDman said:

Thanks! Of course I worry about both my kids, that’s what parents do, right! My Son wears a mask and gloves, just like the other 6 lockdowns at his facility in the last 2 years....so kinda biz as usual for him. That’s the state of the old folks system, they suck!

Click to expand...

Thank Goodness your Son is doing what he's doing. He's really really needed right now. His cooking makes a big difference to those in there. Life and death right? He leaves...who will do it. Imo his effort is outstanding. He could choose to protect himself but instead he helps those who need him bad. . He's a real soldier. Didn't desert his post.
We Dman for his sake I'm glad most of Canada is doing what it can to stop this fast. Folks like your son deserve our help in doing what we can. My sacrifice is small and humble.

On a side note. Local news story this evening was showing the procedure for inserting the ventilator in ya when your gagging for air. Gee that looks like fun alright. Most patients need sedation they said. Just to tolerate the tube in your throat. For most folks it never gets to that....WHEW !!!! But who wants to take the chance. That news story fear mongered a big wad of it right up my ass. Tube down my throat...no thanks. Uncle buck might like though.

Rob Roy said:

If it's as contagious as touted, it seems likely most people will have it sooner or later. It's also likely for most people it won't be a near death experience and for many it might be like a cold, if that.

Click to expand...

For sure. They say many of us might have already had it this winter. Yup apparently most of us will be just fine. But not everyone and that's the wild card.

The Hippy said:

You can disagree all you want with politicians. Whether they listen or care is another thing though. Politicians have no "obey" powers over you. The can enact laws to limit folks from hanging out. I know this freaks out the insecure. Nobody is enacting martial law. The law is only there to get the fools who can't understand this is the best things right now.
It's to shorten this thing....not make people loose rights.

Click to expand...

Hmm, you must have missed my question. I asked if you'd want your kids or grand kids acting like they own other people. I wouldn't want mine to.

Yes, you can disagree with a politician, but to disobey them, can ultimately be a death sentence. Which is the thing people won't allow themselves to enter their conscious thoughts. It's quite a study in human emotions, but I'm digressing.

Also, you're incorrect. It doesn't matter if the intention is "to shorten this thing", if the result is to make people loose (sic) rights. T

That has been the result, people HAVE had their rights reduced to revocable privileges. A temporary kidnapping, restricting or suspension of a right, means one of two things, either you never had those rights, and you were lied to that they were your rights or the people suspending them are violating your rights.

The term martial law, may conjure images of tanks in the streets, but just because that hasn't happened (yet), doesn't mean a kind of near worldwide softer / initial martial law hasn't been enacted. What would happen to a person who refused to close his business, or to a group of people who gathered and refused to disperse ?

What will happen if politicians decide only vaccinated people can travel etc. and unvaccinated people try to travel anyway ? The stated end game is to "shorten this thing", it's the unstated part that will be lasting, to gain more control over people and reduce rights to privileges, subject to revocation at any time.

The Hippy said:

I haven't been asked to do anything unreasonable yet imo.

Click to expand...

It's interesting that in some places people haven't been "asked", they've been ordered.

Asking usually means there is an option without any duress to decline what is being asked. Meaning you could say, "no" and carry on unmolested with your life.

Being ordered means there is an "or else" involved. When a person has been ordered and prefers to say they've been "asked", there is some psychology at work there. Words have meaning.

Rob Roy said:

Hmm, you must have missed my question. I asked if you'd want your kids or grand kids acting like they own other people. I wouldn't want mine to.

Yes, you can disagree with a politician, but to disobey them, can ultimately be a death sentence. Which is the thing people won't allow themselves to enter their conscious thoughts. It's quite a study in human emotions, but I'm digressing.

Also, you're incorrect. It doesn't matter if the intention is "to shorten this thing", if the result is to make people loose (sic) rights. T

That has been the result, people HAVE had their rights reduced to revocable privileges. A temporary kidnapping, restricting or suspension of a right, means one of two things, either you never had those rights, and you were lied to that they were your rights or the people suspending them are violating your rights.

The term martial law, may conjure images of tanks in the streets, but just because that hasn't happened (yet), doesn't mean a kind of near worldwide softer / initial martial law hasn't been enacted. What would happen to a person who refused to close his business, or to a group of people who gathered and refused to disperse ?

What will happen if politicians decide only vaccinated people can travel etc. and unvaccinated people try to travel anyway ? The stated end game is to "shorten this thing", it's the unstated part that will be lasting, to gain more control over people and reduce rights to privileges, subject to revocation at any time.

Click to expand...

Well I can't answer that Q because I don't know anyone who acts like that. I know assholes with all kinds of traits. But I'm pretty confident and have no feelings of "being owned" That's ridiculous. I'm not weak minded so that's never a problem. Politician haven't change much in my lifetime. Only the faces.
So here's my answer seeing as you insist. If either my kids or grandkids had the traits you suggest then of course that wouldn't be nice. But let's face it, they could have many other characteristics that would make them dicks so the question is rather pointless.
I don't feel my rights have been violated. I've been asked by smart and reasonable people/authorities to help out and kill this thing. I didn't need to be ordered to stay home. I was happy to do so. It's helped and I'm proud of that.

In my city folks are out and about. But you can clearly see it's lessened than normal. I don't feel restricted. People walking. Dogs being walked. Cyclist. Saw a guy fishing near a river alone.
You only need to think first.

The Hippy said:

Well I can't answer that Q because I don't know anyone who acts like that. I know assholes with all kinds of traits. But I'm pretty confident and have no feelings of "being owned" That's ridiculous. I'm not weak minded so that's never a problem. Politician haven't change much in my lifetime. Only the faces.
So here's my answer seeing as you insist. If either my kids or grandkids had the traits you suggest then of course that wouldn't be nice. But let's face it, they could have many other characteristics that would make them dicks so the question is rather pointless.
I don't feel my rights have been violated. I've been asked by smart and reasonable people/authorities to help out and kill this thing. I didn't need to be ordered to stay home. I was happy to do so. It's helped and I'm proud of that.

Click to expand...

It's interesting that you still maintain you were asked, while other people have been ordered. Hmm, how'd that happen?
I'm willing to admit, I wasn't asked to do some things, I was ordered to. I don't have any obligation to obey a person who threatens me if the threat is a violation of my rights.

If what I was ordered to do, was what my choice would have been anyway (as in your case) , it still doesn't make me overlook being ordered. I'm not a slave or a serf.

I don't have the right to order other people around, unless or until they begin to violate my rights. Then I can order them to stop or suffer the consequences. That's how real equal rights work, everybody has them and nobody has a right to abuse others rights. I can suggest or try to persuade people to follow my ideas, like a good leader would, but if I order them to, I've overstepped and have become a master.

Leader is to master as "ask" is to order.

I don't consider people who violate others rights to be smart and reasonable, nor do I believe anybody but me is an authority over my body.

I think it's good you're happy to help people. I don't think it's good you're avoiding the obvious, you liked that other people were ordered to do something, despite it violating their rights. Please reconsider that part.

The Hippy said:

I agree with you Freddi and thanks for your service to the country. We will get through this and if folks stay away from each other it will be faster.
They just predicted a 60,000 death toll by August in the USA.
Thank goodness here in Canada we are on this better than down there. Canadian are simply more co-operative. We could have been quicker but didn't do bad compared to some other countries and places.

Click to expand...

Well lol it's April and they already have over 50k dead. By the time August comes I'd put money on it that USA has over 200k deaths. Especially now there dumb enough to remove restrictions.

And trump won't last long saying inject disinfectant. What an arsehole of a guy , he cudnt run a nursery let alone a fucking country.

The guy is absolutely fucking clueless and should not be in charge of your country..

Watch this space guys n gals , America is set to start another bout of this disease.

All these ppl dying is just Natural selection at its finest.
If they listened and stayed home the infection rates would not be near as bad so I have zero sympathy except for the elderly that are dying in care homes,, they are the matriarch's of society and we let them all die unnecessarily. So much for our governments saying we need to protect the elderly and protect the vunerable when they themselves can't do it.

Population cull,, that's why your government is slow to act and don't care.
They want you all dead.

Sorry...2M people are still riding TTC daily...think about that! You can’t congregate in a park, but by all means cram yourself into public transportation. Give me a fukin break. If it was so bad, they would shut down all public transportation!

The TTC said it has seen an 80 per cent decline, with 10 million daily riders dropping to 2 million.

Click to expand...

You

TheRealDman said:

Sorry...2M people are still riding TTC daily...think about that! You can’t congregate in a park, but by all means cram yourself into public transportation. Give me a fukin break. If it was so bad, they would shut down all public transportation!

Ridership and revenue on TTC, GO in steep decline during COVID-19 pandemic

Ridership on two of Ontario's largest transit agencies is down between 80 and 90 per cent since the start of the COVID-19 pandemic, in a situation a national industry group said mirrors the experience of many local services.

www.google.ca

Click to expand...

You seem contradicted. I thought you were pissed off at the ramp down on people. But now you want the TTC closed. I understand your point and agree though.
But let's face it they are trying to compromise best they think it will help the most. Mistakes are made for sure. But they have tried to mitigate the interactions on those forms of transport. Limits to the numbers on the bus and rear entering and exiting. for sure FAR from perfect. Driver protection with shields. Plus much more wipe downs than ever in the past. Perfect...nope. Alternative is too shut it down and force folks out of work or whatever.
I though for what they are spending on the transit with no riders you could cal everyone a cab for about the same money.

Rob Roy said:

It's interesting that you still maintain you were asked, while other people have been ordered. Hmm, how'd that happen?
I'm willing to admit, I wasn't asked to do some things, I was ordered to. I don't have any obligation to obey a person who threatens me if the threat is a violation of my rights.

If what I was ordered to do, was what my choice would have been anyway (as in your case) , it still doesn't make me overlook being ordered. I'm not a slave or a serf.

I don't have the right to order other people around, unless or until they begin to violate my rights. Then I can order them to stop or suffer the consequences. That's how real equal rights work, everybody has them and nobody has a right to abuse others rights. I can suggest or try to persuade people to follow my ideas, like a good leader would, but if I order them to, I've overstepped and have become a master.

Leader is to master as "ask" is to order.

I don't consider people who violate others rights to be smart and reasonable, nor do I believe anybody but me is an authority over my body.

I think it's good you're happy to help people. I don't think it's good you're avoiding the obvious, you liked that other people were ordered to do something, despite it violating their rights. Please reconsider that part.

Click to expand...

Oh what an alarmist you are. I'm still able to go anywhere I want basically. There isn't any Gestapo hanging around my neighborhood. I can get it my car and even come to see you. Who's gonna know. Would I.....no. Because it's not the smart thing to do right now. Your acting like the cops are sitting at the end of your driveway. Don't be ridiculous. There are no police at every intersection asking where your going. I said before you just need to be smart about where you go and how many outings you take.
What's the matter with you ? You can't see how to compromise? Your so butt hurt being asked to stay at home to protect others in case your a carrier? How hard is that? You see if you are a carrier you can infect other innocent folks including your own family. You gotta know that right?
Have you been tested? I bet not. Me either. But I'd take one to just to know if maybe I'm a menace to you or my own family. That's called mature consideration for your fellow man.
The only ones who take the stay at home order threatening are those who don't understand it's first a sensible request. second it's an enforceable order for those who endanger others. Because if there's one thing I've learned through this thing so far is that the truly stupid seem to be the most knowledgeable of all medical issues. DUH. Maybe you should follow trumps lead....he's brilliant.
I saw folks lined up outside the beer and liquor store yesterday. What happened to your forced stay at home there? I told ya ....folks are out there they are just being smart and low key. It's far from order cop enforced continuous lock down.

Rob Roy said:

I don't think it's good you're avoiding the obvious, you liked that other people were ordered to do something, despite it violating their rights. Please reconsider that part.

Click to expand...

I'm not avoiding the obvious. It's you who's not seeing the obvious. You juxtapositioned and mixed that part up.
Violated your rights...oh come on. That could come but for now your ok. Try dropping the " oh my rights are gone " glasses. They're only gone if "you" think they are. When the cops are directly ordering you around let me know.
You'll get more sympathy from me then.
Let's get something straight. If actual WIDE spread civil disobedience was to break out, the government would be next to powerless to stop it.
We don't have the cops or military to control the amount of folks we have in Canada. So Rob...you should be fine.

Here are some of my tin hat conspiracy theories.

I am of the opinion that this covid 19 situation is a governmental deep game play and that multiple governments are involved. They do indeed want to erode our rights and freedoms. why wouldn't they?!

There are multiple social and economic reasons why this would be used, Im not even going to pretend that I know or understand all the reasons.

You say social distancing , I say conditioning people to be suspicious and fearful of others (long term end goal, population control, more law enforcement cooperation

you say vaccine, I say MORE chemical warfare on the general public (end goal, population control, possibly increased tracking a surveillance --to benefit law enforcement).

You say destroyed economy, I say someone benefits .

This is 100% a man made event that is no accident.

The Hippy said:

What's the matter with you ? You can't see how to compromise? Your so butt hurt being asked to stay at home to protect others in case your a carrier?

Click to expand...

The matter with me, is I distinguish between a right and a privilege, they aren't the same thing. I also distinguish between being asked and being ordered. You seem unwilling to acknowledge the difference and gloss over that. Hard to have an honest discussion if the meanings of words aren't fixed.

I'm not willing to compromise my rights or yours. I am willing to respect a person that wants to quarantine themselves, that's their right and their business. Why aren't you willing to respect other peoples right to make a living and decide for themselves if they will associate with other people who are willing to associate?

I'm not butthurt, when people ask me. I do get butthurt when people order me. I think that's a reasonable position and don't intend to change it.

A lockdown isn't like when somebody says hey wanna get a pizza and you can say sure or no I don't want to, without a lockdown, you can choose without potential repercussions.

A lockdown is like when somebody says, close your Pizza business or we'll break your legs.
If I had a Pizza business that was ordered to be closed, I would probably disobey that order.

What do you think would happen to a person who did keep their business open despite being
asked ORDERED to shut down ?

Rob Roy said:

The matter with me, is I distinguish between a right and a privilege, they aren't the same thing. I also distinguish between being asked and being ordered. You seem unwilling to acknowledge the difference and gloss over that. Hard to have an honest discussion if the meanings of words aren't fixed.

I'm not willing to compromise my rights or yours. I am willing to respect a person that wants to quarantine themselves, that's their right and their business. Why aren't you willing to respect other peoples right to make a living and decide for themselves if they will associate with other people who are willing to associate?

I'm not butthurt, when people ask me. I do get butthurt when people order me. I think that's a reasonable position and don't intend to change it.

A lockdown isn't like when somebody says hey wanna get a pizza and you can say sure or no I don't want to, without a lockdown, you can choose without potential repercussions.

A lockdown is like when somebody says, close your Pizza business or we'll break your legs.
If I had a Pizza business that was ordered to be closed, I would probably disobey that order.

What do you think would happen to a person who did keep their business open despite being
asked ORDERED to shut down ?

Click to expand...

First off your pretty shortsighted imo. Ya someone's out to get ya...ya right. Must suck to think your that important or any of us for that matter. Geez man. Can't you read between the lines?
Anyway...
So what's your grand plan to fix this then smart ass! Let's hear your master plan to stop this. Folks have sacrificed and put themselves out to slow this down. Thanks to them!
You haven't lost any rights. 99% of us see it for what it is. A sensible request to stop a spreading disease.
That's nice your not butthurt when asked. So what you're saying is your reasonable then? Good. That's what we all need to be. And if everyone was we wouldn't have had to ticket and threaten folks with fines. Which by the way they are relaxing a bit. See it worked! Are we out of the woods yet...hardly.
Unfortunately the stupid often need lead by the hand to figure shit out. So apparently they need threatened to figure it out too.

Rob Roy said:

The matter with me, is I distinguish between a right and a privilege, they aren't the same thing. I also distinguish between being asked and being ordered. You seem unwilling to acknowledge the difference and gloss over that. Hard to have an honest discussion if the meanings of words aren't fixed.

Click to expand...

A right and a privilege are almost the same thing....... I see my rights as great privileges.
But I know what you were asking.
lol....nobody is trying to control you. Such a foolish notion.