Defoliation

AimAim said:

There is NO need for "light to hit the budsites".

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what little experience i have disagrees.

Garrett Richardson said:

I was told by someone to take 10% of leaves off every week

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oh man...
if you are in physical proximity of said person I suggest one or both of the following actions.
observe.
notice angle, trajectory, and velocity.


I suggest and approve of the second one.
much more emphatic and he's more likely to learn his lesson

Budsites do not need light. Calyxes do not carry out photosynthesis. That occurs in the leaves.

THIS.....

There is NO need for "light to hit the budsites".

Just grow a lush, even, green canopy. If lower leaves start to yellow leave them be. The plant is sucking nutrients out of those leaves. Way better than any fert you can provide. These are nutrients it has already expended energy assimilating, already on board.[/QUOTE]

in my experience the bud sites that do not receive enough lighting are popcorn buds... light and airy and yellowish.
Intense lighting will cause the buds to become dense and ripen.

-a rookies perspective.

Right from my reading it is my understanding that the budsites don't need direct light as it is the leaves that absorb the light for energy , I don't think the leaf that gets the light only uses that for the part of which it grows from I think the entire plant uses the energy as a whole ... could be completely wrong but that's what I've been telling myself in the simplest way lol

My problem has nothing to do with bud sites as I'm still on veg. Mainly my problem is that my vegetative growth is so dense on the interior of the plant that it is crowding new growth to the point that it is difficult for it to even find a place in the canopy. Leaves are being deformed because as they emerge and begin to push upward they are being g crushed by the resistance of all the growth in its way.

NanoGadget said:

My problem has nothing to do with bud sites as I'm still on veg. Mainly my problem is that my vegetative growth is so dense on the interior of the plant that it is crowding new growth to the point that it is difficult for it to even find a place in the canopy. Leaves are being deformed because as they emerge and begin to push upward they are being g crushed by the resistance of all the growth in its way.

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I would try spread her out , remember if she's still in veg she's due a good stretch which would also help make room for the growth , keep on top of training during the stretch as well , try do the best you can at solving your issue without damaging the plant , if your still not happy then fuck that bitch up !

NanoGadget said:

My problem has nothing to do with bud sites as I'm still on veg. Mainly my problem is that my vegetative growth is so dense on the interior of the plant that it is crowding new growth to the point that it is difficult for it to even find a place in the canopy. Leaves are being deformed because as they emerge and begin to push upward they are being g crushed by the resistance of all the growth in its way.

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what a trip.
It's in veg man, if you feel some of the leaves are causing problems, remove 'em. just don't go nuts.
Just gonna grow more anyway.

Are you running low temps that may be preventing it from growing vertically faster?
You might try raising temps depending on what your running now. try 78-80F if no co2.

idfuckmyplants said:

I would try spread her out , remember if she's still in veg she's due a good stretch which would also help make room for the growth , keep on top of training during the stretch as well , try do the best you can at solving your issue without damaging the plant , if your still not happy then fuck that bitch up !

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Definitely been trying to train her.. once I get a tad more stretch I can pull the 4 tops apart and reduce the crowding. Thanks!

HarveyHarvester said:

what a trip.
It's in veg man, if you feel some of the leaves are causing problems, remove 'em. just don't go nuts.
Just gonna grow more anyway.

Are you running low temps that may be preventing it from growing vertically faster?
You might try raising temps depending on what your running now. try 78-80F if no co2.

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Not running co2. Lights off temps between 65 and 69. Lights on temps between 73 and 78. RH fluctuates from 40% up to around 53% I did get her to stretch a little by raising the light and switching to bloom mode for more reds. For those who missed the pic a couple pages back here it is again.

73F for extended periods would surely prevent vertical growth. thats how i prevent sprouts from stretching... 73F.
I think I would try to run it between 78-80F with an 8-10 degree drop at night for a week and see how it reacts.
they like it warm.

HarveyHarvester said:

73F for extended periods would surely prevent vertical growth. thats how i prevent sprouts from stretching... 73F.
I think I would try to run it between 78-80F with an 8-10 degree drop at night for a week and see how it reacts.
they like it warm.

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I'll give that a try. Thanks!

Wow, you defoliation guys are looking at it all wrong.

HarveyHarvester said:

in my experience the bud sites that do not receive enough lighting are popcorn buds... light and airy and yellowish.
Intense lighting will cause the buds to become dense and ripen.

-a rookies perspective.

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Its true, with the more "concentrated" light on top, the more "concentrated" photosynthesis occurs on top, and the upper buds have higher pressures during osmosis when distributing nutrients, causing the closer (upper buds) to be bigger.

Thats why theyre bigger, but that doesnt mean remove what makes them bigger, for allowing the underdeveloped leaves below to receive the light. You do realize that even though you increase the size of the popcorn, you loose on over all yield, right? Less leaves means less photosynthesis occuring, "period"! ....Basic Biology

Thats like saying that if you cut off your arms, the food you eat will get to your feet better, but how are you gonna cook it with no arms, lol.

You certainly seem to know your stuff and I believe ya. but arent the top 2-3 sets of leaves doing the brunt of the work?
If I have a few leaves blocking light to a bud site that is at or above the screen and i cannot tuck or otherwise get it out of the way it is gone. healthy or not.
that's just me. I really try to avoid the upper sets though and they are usually the problem. I can usually tuck 'em under the screen to get 'em out of the way but during the first two weeks of flower i usually end up removing a handful (4-6) each feeding.

and does it not require a lot of energy to move those nutrients from the yellowing leaves it is evidently shedding anyway?
energy that could be better used in bud development?

-Learning, not arguing.

She did not complain one bit to me about removing healthy leaves above the screen to get more bud.

A good read on what actually is in play when it comes to bud production and density.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=281272

Garrett Richardson said:

hey guys want to know if you guys think I should take some leafs off this bushy plant or just let it go

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Damn with that title i was hoping for porn

Hi guys.new here but not new to growing. Personally I find some strains like to be pruned and some don't.

I always lst my girls. Depending on the needs for my grow space, and what i need the strain to do, i will FIM, top, super crop, lollipop, trim, stake and defol. I have seen dense nugs on the usually larf part of the plant on my buddys dwc setup. Solid nugs, that NEVER got direct light.