Flooming Tested

I ordered a test kit to see if I could saturate the water without airstones, Max Dissolved Oxygen.

It depends on a few things so I found an online calculator.

DOTABLES Result

Oxygen Solubility Table Return to the DOTABLES main page.

Solubility of oxygen in water at various temperatures and pressures and a specific conductance of .05 (50 ppm) microsiemens/cm Values based on published equations by Benson and Krause (1980 and 1984).

°F, degrees Fahrenheit; in Hg, inches of mercury]

So, today at this pressure, at this ppm and temp the water can only hold 9.2 ppm or ml/l

I'd say flooming with an eco-185 does the job.

Darker than 8, lighter than 12, yep.

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Thanks for this information! Very informative!

I have a question or 2 though.

Was this tested on a single bucket system?

Would this work, with the correct size pump of course, on a recirculating dwc?

If so, and if you have the setup, could you do this test again with full size plants in the system to see how the air carries through the whole system? I fear that if I went down this route without airstones that the first plant would get oxygen but then further down the line the oxygen would decrease at too much of a level...

Also where would one get such a test for analysing DO? Are they expensive?

Oops, just noticed that was more than 2 questions, sorry...

Thanks

chemtrailsrbad said:

Thanks for this information! Very informative!

I have a question or 2 though.

Was this tested on a single bucket system?

Would this work, with the correct size pump of course, on a recirculating dwc?

If so, and if you have the setup, could you do this test again with full size plants in the system to see how the air carries through the whole system? I fear that if I went down this route without airstones that the first plant would get oxygen but then further down the line the oxygen would decrease at too much of a level...

Also where would one get such a test for analysing DO? Are they expensive?

Oops, just noticed that was more than 2 questions, sorry...

Thanks

Click to expand...

It was from the 10 gal in the tote in the picture. Just the little eco pump pointing up. Nothing magically about it, I guess. I also have the same size pump flooming an insulated 6 bucket set, with 2" ID x 6" PVC interconnect pipes with Uniseals. I'm re-circulating through a 1/4 chiller to the back of the bucket chain, with a 1080 gal per hr pump in front bucket, along with the flooming pump (and a wire box of lava rocks to filter root particles and keep the impeller open)

High re-circ rates are essential for this. Mine is on the high side, but not over kill, at 44 times per hour. 25 - 30 is said to be minimum. So far it is working. But, with the roots? Good point.

And I constructed the outlet of the chiller such that is within 1" of the bottom of the last bucket. More flooming. That causes more flooming even as pulses in the other buckets, like a wave. I can always add another little pump I have.

I thought all the little aquarium pump I bought were worthless. No. It was that 222 liter air pump for $100 and $60 worth of stones.

I'll test that 90 liter rdwc pond later today, and report.

Ooops. http://www.marinedepot.com/Salifert_Dissolved_Oxygen_Test_Kit_Specialty_Test_Kits_for_Saltwater_Aquariums-Salifert-SF1131-FITKSI-vi.htm

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Hey, bro. Quite frankly I had not thought yet about testing throughout this grow. Fantastic Idea.

I have thought to have the flooming on the sides and not under the net pots.

You bring up another very good point about O2 uptake as the plants mature. I know they will begin to transpire a lot of water.

Thinking this through, aren't the girls drinking water with dissolved oxygen and that makes them happy to eat like pigs?

So, if all the water has dissolved oxygen, and it is offering constant surface to mass exchange 30-40 times per hr, it seem though they eat like pigs they still can't drink all the water. Is that right logic? So they can't deplete the O2? Hardly.

IAC, it depends on 4 rates, doesn't it?

- The rate I can expose surface,
- the rate the mass transfer occurs over the exposed surface
- the rate the girls drink, (or can they, in fact, draw it O2 direct from the water without the transpiration??)
- and the rate the DO dissipates on its own, if it does.

I'll keep testing. This $22 test is good for 40 runs.

IAC, it is the same problem for stones when roots mass up. It is just lifting water. A pump is much better, but old concepts die hard.

You have a valid point there with the ratio of water uptake to the ratio of DO. Now that I think about it, logic tells me that the water uptake of the plants is the main reducer of DO, so IMO I'd say that this may be a good supplier of enough Oxygen to the plants over the course of the grow.

You mention moving the pump to the side, I would discourage this due to the fact you want to ruffle up the roots to promote even Oxygen levels to all the roots, you don't want stagnant water build up in the middle of the root ball.

I have seen many different methods of introducing DO to the systems, and the waterfall effect seems to do the trick as well as this method. However, I prefer your method due to the reduced noice levels of not having water pouring onto water (making me need the toilet all through the nite as I grow in my bedroom lol)

I am just starting my first proper soil grow. I have only grown with poor equipment in the past and am now making the leap into getting all the right stuff to increase quality.

After I get all the experience and knowledge I am going to play about with RDWC once I can afford a water chiller to complete the setup, I could get the whole setup minus chiller just now but I am very OCD about everything being right and water temps are important for DO and nutrient uptake.

I hope that throughout your grow you maintain maximum DO levels and am keeping a close eye on your results when you get them!

Thanks posting this and wow I don't half ramble lol

I'm after consistency for each site, and don't think I need 6 flooming pumps, one for each bucket. Even if I did, the idea of pushing MDO water up through the roots, that defeats the concept, I'd say, of exposing the wide surface area.

So, very good idea, I'm sure but wouldn't be good at letting air pressure across a surface transfer the O2 molecules. It is broken up with the roots. So, one side can be swept free of root mass and should still present enough surface....or will it?

Here's my thought: I'm going to "FLOOM" off my circulation pump in UC. (Sorta)

Rather than just waterfalling back into the epicenter, I'm going to run a top manifold
to each bucket with 1/2" PVC. I'm doing a 6 site DIY UC with 8gal EZ Stors/2" pipes.
If I plumb the outlet from the mag drive pump into a 7 point manifold water-falling
into EACH bucket, I have flooming in all 6 buckets right?

Then add airstones to my epicenter for extra DO. I'm sure I'll hit max saturation.
Also, the waterfall in each PLANT bucket should create water turbulence, allowing the root mass
to open up more and uptake more O2.

LivingCanvas said:

Here's my thought: I'm going to "FLOOM" off my circulation pump in UC. (Sorta)

Rather than just waterfalling back into the epicenter, I'm going to run a top manifold
to each bucket with 1/2" PVC. I'm doing a 6 site DIY UC with 8gal EZ Stors/2" pipes.
If I plumb the outlet from the mag drive pump into a 7 point manifold water-falling
into EACH bucket, I have flooming in all 6 buckets right?

Then add airstones to my epicenter for extra DO. I'm sure I'll hit max saturation.
Also, the waterfall in each PLANT bucket should create water turbulence, allowing the root mass
to open up more and uptake more O2.

Click to expand...

That is interesting. I did some more tests last night and i think I at maxi on 2 pumps and the pulsing lift on each bucket.

And I have been studying. There is a lot drama, myth and lore about any cropping. And this one especially. We do things in the classic sense. They were done before.

So, an employeed researcher, I applied the counter logic technique. Zero Water. Does it exist? Where to get it? Is there a use for it? How to make it? Etc? That side is called de-gassing.

It turns out again, we don't see it properly.

I measured my RO water and was almost saturated. That makes sense. Cool freshwater is most naturally aerated to max.
by exposure to air and a normal, not Hurricane or Altitude, low pressure. And we make RO drip by drip over a long period and a wide barrel surface of water.

So, where is Zero Oxygen water. It is at the warmest, deepest place in a body of still water. A warmed deep lake at altitude. No even easy to collect it for sample.

How to make it? Heat water in a narrow pot. That drives off the gas. Low pressure steam going up and water dripping down with create the de-gassed water necessary for non- corrosiveness live steam.

So, the O2 and the water are quite difficult to keep apart. It is just not the problem we think it is. I was pumping too much air and heat just to lift water with bubbles.

Now, we know the most areated enviorment is the rushing stream. Still water, not turning over, de-gases. Think Swamp.
So, turbulence at the surface does two thing. A roiled surface is much more area. And get this, the random waves lifting against the air pressure, cause a momentary over pressure and that forces in more O2.

The froth and bubbles are not working and are just an after product of the pressure lift. Cool? So, broad thing flow over a rock bed, over-pressing the surface is ideal.

And when you think of a flooming pump, if you get it to the point where it is coning out of the water but not breaking up into spray, that is ideal. You get the over pressure and the tall cone surface area at the same time.

It is only about pressure and surface. Hopefully today I can get to testing some tap water, from an outside tap that has
been flowing in pipes and no air surface. I have to get to it before the faucet aerators.

And I found out about over-stauration. Not good. So, I was running 1 large can sized stone per bucket on a hot pump.
And then a chiller. Over working against myself.

LivingCanvas said:

Here's my thought: I'm going to "FLOOM" off my circulation pump in UC. (Sorta)

Rather than just waterfalling back into the epicenter, I'm going to run a top manifold
to each bucket with 1/2" PVC. I'm doing a 6 site DIY UC with 8gal EZ Stors/2" pipes.
If I plumb the outlet from the mag drive pump into a 7 point manifold water-falling
into EACH bucket, I have flooming in all 6 buckets right?

Then add airstones to my epicenter for extra DO. I'm sure I'll hit max saturation.
Also, the waterfall in each PLANT bucket should create water turbulence, allowing the root mass to open up more and uptake more O2.

Click to expand...

Falling creates turbulence and foam but does lift the bottom of the bucket water. That is the key. Lifting the water, exposing it to surface.

If you are going that far, and I have considered this, with just a little more effort you can take those to one inch from the bottom and floom up.

Pumping from the bottom up, is flooming. Top down is called cascade.