High Ec or no? Let’s debate
- Thread starter MrX2017
- Start date
Budzbuddha
Well-Known Member
No need to complicate shit - plants will tell you .
I personally never push it over - 1.6 to 1.8 flower
( truncheon ). I try not bloat the plant with over feed plus i wind down ppm around week 8 thru end as plant and medium ( soil ) is still charged and am more interested in plant exhausting any excess. For coco or my hempy - i just adjust liquid feed same way .
I personally never push it over - 1.6 to 1.8 flower
( truncheon ). I try not bloat the plant with over feed plus i wind down ppm around week 8 thru end as plant and medium ( soil ) is still charged and am more interested in plant exhausting any excess. For coco or my hempy - i just adjust liquid feed same way .
Spindle818
Well-Known Member
I feed between 2.5 and 3 depending on the stage, but I allow the ec in my medium to build up to 6-7 before I reset. I’ve had a couple strains that get a slight tip burn, but most don’t have any trouble with the feedings. Certain strains are heavier feeders than others so you just have to pay attention.
Budzbuddha
Well-Known Member
I used to run hot peppers at high 2-3 .
I pretty sure some species of plants could probably run in that 4.0 soup but would think uptake would be the water over the nutrients.
Just seems over wasteful and not really trying to maximize grow effort. Less is more .
I would Rather make sure flowers ( bloom stage nutes ) are in a good range than hyperload it for extra green matter or nute toxic growth.
Those glossy green harvest plants always smoke like shit.
I pretty sure some species of plants could probably run in that 4.0 soup but would think uptake would be the water over the nutrients.
Just seems over wasteful and not really trying to maximize grow effort. Less is more .
I would Rather make sure flowers ( bloom stage nutes ) are in a good range than hyperload it for extra green matter or nute toxic growth.
Those glossy green harvest plants always smoke like shit.
Scuzzman
Well-Known Member
Good subject, Have just started pushing high E.C 2.2-2.5 in flower( learn to read the plants alter to suit) - personally I think it all depends on the lights - quality LEDs will allow high e.c/ppm's, alot of issues I see these days are plants being under feed and stressed in my view
MrX2017
Well-Known Member
It’s just a running debate on my discord. Some guys get reallly butt hurt if you say something abasing their style.
Not me personally, as I never went over 2.2 with FF in coco.
But
Yes some push this crap past 4! 6.5-7, one dude 10!
yes lights and environment have so much to play before high feeds.
I agree the plant will tell you
Not me personally, as I never went over 2.2 with FF in coco.
But
Yes some push this crap past 4! 6.5-7, one dude 10!
yes lights and environment have so much to play before high feeds.
I agree the plant will tell you
Rurumo
Well-Known Member
I never started getting the results I wanted until I stopped "pushing" high EC and instead started doing the opposite and pushing the lowest EC I can get away with while still having lush/healthy leaves. Even 1 EC is too much for some plants-all of these EC arguments ultimately come down to the particular genotype of plant you are working with. High EC grows gave hydro buds a bad rap as "chemical tasting", while those grown in low EC taste just as good as anything organic. Now we have a lot of studies indicating that high EC feeds lower THC content, while low EC feeds increase it-I can try to find the study I'm talking about but I've seen this referenced many times, it's all part of the basic pattern with Cannabis where an abundance of anything will reduce cannabinoids-such as the study that showed Fulvic acid reduces THC content, same principle. A recent study looked at phosphorus specifically and found only a 20% increase in yield going from 30 ppm P to 90 ppm P, in other words, 30 ppm P had 80% the yield as 90 ppm. Beyond 90 ppm, the yield was either static or decreased. I wish people would start with a low ec DTW grow as a baseline, then increase it if they care to and just see what results they get. If a new grower starts with a high EC, they may just keep on using it forever and never realize they can get amazing results while using less nutrients and spending less money.
I'd like to see studies regarding high ec feeds leading to lower THC production.
Those p studies afaik are done in DWC type setups where phosphorous is always available. In something like coco drain to waste as you let medium dry out you can get some precipitation of calcium and phos locking it up. Not saying high P is the way to go just seen that point brought up in regard to low P studies.
Those p studies afaik are done in DWC type setups where phosphorous is always available. In something like coco drain to waste as you let medium dry out you can get some precipitation of calcium and phos locking it up. Not saying high P is the way to go just seen that point brought up in regard to low P studies.
Billy the Mountain
Well-Known Member
I agree wholeheartedly with the P requirements. I've read a few studies as well and iirc, there's little, if any, benefit of having P over 50ppm.
Bugbee recently commented on that as well and his numbers were similar. High P levels simply lead to high P levels in the leachate; i.e. the plants are not using it.
I've based my nutes entirely on established tomato and pepper feed recipies, none of which call for P > 50 ppm.
The high P logic so common in the cannablis world is fatally flawed.
xtsho
Well-Known Member
"Fertilizer rate studies conducted in marijuana have indicated that increased fertilizer rates during the vegetative phase did not increased THC concentrations, while higher fertilizer rates resulted in reduced THC and CBG concentrations when applied during the flowering stage"
journals.plos.org
"HA was found to reduce the natural spatial variability of all of the cannabinoids studied. However, the increased uniformity came at the expense of the higher levels of cannabinoids at the top of the plants, THC and CBD were reduced by 37 and 39%, respectively."
"Increasing fertilizer rate was found to have a dilution effect on THC, THCA, and CBGA; therefore, excessive organic fertilizer application during the flowering stage should be avoided despite increased biomass yield."
https://journals.ashs.org/hortsci/view/journals/hortsci/52/12/article-p1796.xml
Response of essential oil hemp (Cannabis sativa L.) growth, biomass, and cannabinoid profiles to varying fertigation rates
Five essential oil hemp (Cannabis sativa L.) cultivars (Cherry Blossom, Cherry Blossom (Tuan), Berry Blossom, Cherry Wine, and Cherry Blossom × Trump) were treated with six fertigation treatments to quantify the effects of synthetic fertilizer rates and irrigation electrical conductivity on...
"HA was found to reduce the natural spatial variability of all of the cannabinoids studied. However, the increased uniformity came at the expense of the higher levels of cannabinoids at the top of the plants, THC and CBD were reduced by 37 and 39%, respectively."
"Increasing fertilizer rate was found to have a dilution effect on THC, THCA, and CBGA; therefore, excessive organic fertilizer application during the flowering stage should be avoided despite increased biomass yield."
https://journals.ashs.org/hortsci/view/journals/hortsci/52/12/article-p1796.xml
xtsho
Well-Known Member
Who knows where the high P originated but the cannabis specific nutrient companies have ran with it and all offer high P bloom additives. They don't care about people's plants they care about selling high margin products. MKP is extremely cheap and mixing it with water, putting it in a bottle, and marketing it as a bloom booster is nothing but profit.
DrOgkush
Well-Known Member
I was running 3.3 ec with a and b and additive plus enhancements included. Studied some Rasta Jeff stuff. And he actually runs his a and b first feed. Then enhancements only second feeding. Iv been doing this for almost 3 weeks flowering now. Ec 2.0 at first feed. .8.9 second feed with just big bud. Bud candy. And terpinator. Superthrive and recharge once a week. Don’t check run off cause they aren’t telling me. No problems. The only time I have problems is when I fuck up drainage. And a plant sits for more than a few hours in her piss water. Other than that. Minor tip burns if any. But assumed that’s a mixture of high ambient temps as well. Idk. I’d never preach my practice. But it’s working for me in a very positive way.
Billy the Mountain
Well-Known Member
Bud candy?
Terpinator?
Superthrive?
There's no demonstrable benefit for any of those products
It's not hard to find a better source of information than Rasta Jeff
Star Dog
Well-Known Member
Ime high ec = burnt plants and there's no corralation to weight (quite the opposite) my best results are with low ec regularly.
I'm aware that there's a period in veg/early flower plants can take a crazy ec and not show any problems but as sure as shit there's problems coming, my thinking is after leafs are burnt the plant can't run at 100% leafs play lots of roles besides catching light.
Feeding is like drying to me it's a marathon not a sprint
I'm aware that there's a period in veg/early flower plants can take a crazy ec and not show any problems but as sure as shit there's problems coming, my thinking is after leafs are burnt the plant can't run at 100% leafs play lots of roles besides catching light.
Feeding is like drying to me it's a marathon not a sprint
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
Are you sure it was fulvic, and not humic? I've seen a humic acid study which suggests this, but not fulvic.
Spindle818
Well-Known Member
I think it really depends on your environment and inputs. If the fertilizer you use isn’t balanced and you feed high you will lock nutrients out and cause others to burn. I follow vpd very closely with high ppfd and co2. If I feed lower than 2 my plants will yellow and suffer within a couple days. People pushing high ec will need to be running drain to waste so that the nutrients are always balanced.
ProPheT 216
Well-Known Member
I'm at like 2-2.1 in veg, 2.2 in transition, and 2.4 for the first 3 or 4 weeks of flower
DrOgkush
Well-Known Member
Lmao Rasta Jeff is not my source for information. But I promise you he’s doing a lot better then you are. All this hate on established breeders is a joke. Make fun of your own time.
I’m just contributing to the threads question. I don’t care what anyone uses nor do I care what anyone thinks I use. Iv proven to myself this stuff works in comparison grows. For me and my circle. Your problems can remain your problems. My use of terpinator should not contribute to your frustration. As I’ll continue to use. Happy growing bud. Enjoy yourself