Hitler Was A Leftist

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UncleBuck

UncleBuck

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Windsblow said:
I'm outta here.........
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yet you come back 10 minutes later.

not getting enough attention and your religion forbids you from spanking the monkey?

i would get all uptight and start inane threads in that case, too.

mussolini was a righty.
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
vh13 said:
You guys are really getting into this! :lol:

If ya'll can't agree to the definitions of the terms, neither of your arguments will address the other.
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I had begun to define my point, but the steam from that poor guy ears is clouding his monitor. If he really want to discuss the topic he needs to stop calling people names.
 
BendBrewer

BendBrewer

Well-Known Member
Windsblow said:
I had begun to define my point, but the steam from that poor guy ears is clouding his monitor. If he really want to discuss the topic he needs to stop calling people names.
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"

  • Hitler was a leftist"
You're funking funny. In a ridiculous kind of way.
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
yet you come back 10 minutes later.

not getting enough attention and your religion forbids you from spanking the monkey?

i would get all uptight and start inane threads in that case, too.

mussolini was a righty.
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Welcome my 200 lb. gnat friend. I love your meaningless angle of argument. I would call them clever if they were.

Mussolini was a righty? Says Who, and how. Please explain and don't resort to "every smart person in the world says so that why". Think it through.
 
vh13

vh13

Well-Known Member
Johnnyorganic said:
Take away the Genocide and Nationalism and the Nazi agenda was quite Progressive. Have a gander at the Nazi policy initiatives during the 1930's.
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That's what I was saying.

Johnnyorganic said:
As long as you are in Wikipedia anyway, look up Fascism and see how similar it is to the Progressive agenda.
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All too true, the similarities seem quite strong on the surface.

But be fair, Fascism requires blind devotion to a single person, which by definition is not progressive. The two are distinctly independent phenomena.

It is entirely possible for a fascist dictator to exercise rightist philosophies/agendas... but those rightist ideas would be similarly perverted as leftist philosophies/agendas are perverted by fascism.
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
vh13 said:
That's what I was saying.



All too true, the similarities seem quite strong on the surface.

But be fair, Fascism requires blind devotion to a single person, which by definition is not progressive. The two are distinctly independent phenomena.

It is entirely possible for a fascist dictator to exercise rightist philosophies/agendas... but those rightist ideas would be similarly perverted as leftist philosophies/agendas are perverted by fascism.
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In the American Political spectrum the farther right you go the less Government you have. So an extreme right dictatorship just can't exist. If you have a "right wing dictatorship" it has to be relative. It is to the right of what? Stalin that what. Jsut because your right of Stalin doesn't mean you hold the Values of Thomas Jefferson. But isn't Jefferson to the right of Stalin? Yup.
 
Jeffdt1966

Jeffdt1966

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In his right Hiltler was a great leader and inovator . The whole interstate system as we know it came from the German concept of how to get men and supplies across Germany faster . Several medical breakthroughs where made from horrific experimintations .. He was an evil genious so to speak who pushed the envelope on technologies and the medical fields . Its sad that all the progress was made for the wrong reasons and in horrible ways but ... its no accident that industrialization made giant leaps after the war . I am in no way a fan of Hitler or his beliefs but have sympathy for the devil .... He did have a large part in shaping the world we know it and enjoy today . I do have a little respect for the genious in him .... but totally outweighed by the wat he accomplished these things ......
 
vh13

vh13

Well-Known Member
Windsblow said:
As I understand the Political spectrum the farther right you go the less Government you have. So am extreme right dictatorship just can't exist. If you have a "right wing dictatorship" it has to be relative. It is to the right of what? Stalin that what. Jsut because your right of Stalin doesn't mean you hold the Values of Thomas Jefferson. But isn't Jefferson to the right of Stalin? Yup.
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The same logic can be applied to progressivism and fascism. A perfectly progressive fascist state would tear down a dictator (with so many taxes, oversights and obligations) rendering his powers useless... and thus there would be nothing fascist about the state.

But to discuss left/right in such extremes is only an exercise, they don't exist in reality.
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
QUOTE=UncleBuck;5747022]mussolini was a righty just the same way hitler was a lefty and terrorists are religious.

fucking duh.[/QUOTE]

Great articulation of a very complicated subject!:clap:
 
vh13

vh13

Well-Known Member
Left/Right is a matter of policy, agenda, action or inaction by the state.

Fascism is a structure of leadership.

The two concepts are independent... unless you think rightism has no leadership. :lol:
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
vh13 said:
The same logic can be applied to progressivism and fascism. A perfectly progressive fascist state would tear down a dictator (with so many taxes, oversights and obligations) rendering his powers useless... and thus there would be nothing fascist about the state.

But to discuss left/right in such extremes is only an exercise, they don't exist in reality.
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It is not an exercise. The American Founders saw and philosophized ever aspect of economics and politics in this context. To say it was an just an exercise is to ignore the very words on the Declaration of Independence. Now if we are talking Geo-Politics things become relative to many things but mostly the King Of France.
 
mame

mame

Well-Known Member
What is your intention with this thread? Does associating Hitler with the left make you feel better about your own political positions? I mean, it's not just with Hitler either. Johnny brings up Fred Phelps as an obvious attempt to associate Democratic policymakers with fringe elements. I mean, while Phelps calls himself a Democrat and has apparently associated himself with Democrats he has never won office as a Democrat despite trying multiple times - so he in no way is representive of the Democratic party... Just as Hitler is no representation of the U.S. Democratic party either. Sure, the left clowns on Sarah Palin but she is relevant to some extent... She holds clout with at least a portion of her party. But Phelps? Hitler? Cmon, you can do better than that.
 
Nitegazer

Nitegazer

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Maybe this would be a more productive conversation if the definitions of left-wing and right-wing are posted (as Windsblow requested a bit earlier)

Ala Wiki:
Left Wing - Left, left-wing and leftist are generally used to describe support for social change to create a more egalitarian society.

I would generally not rank Hitler's successes at egalitarianism very high....
 
Windsblow

Windsblow

Well-Known Member
My intention is to have a debate and to discuss what I think is a perversion of the concepts of American Philosophy. My intention is not to equate Democrats or the American left with NAZI's. It is an attempt to discuss American concept of Independence and freedom in it's true context and it's place on the spectrum of Statist Politics.

I have many thing in common with the American left. I not try to slam myself.
 
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