Hydro Ebb and Flow, 600w mh lights, how long to veg

Sorry if that link didnt work! But it is a good read about DO and how to get it in the water. I use it but not to add DO to my water and I use it sparingly to disinfect things.

waterdawg said:

Sorry if that link didnt work! But it is a good read about DO and how to get it in the water. I use it but not to add DO to my water and I use it sparingly to disinfect things.

Click to expand...

This link should work. It is a good read. The post also has another link for added information.
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/311670-guide-hydrogen-peroxide-hydroponics-systems.html

I have a bottle of the 35% hydro grade to treat any res or root problems but my system has been doing ok with just the air stones.

Quote:

• There are no doubts about the benefits of using hydrogen peroxide properly in a hydroponics system. This becomes especially true if your nutrient reservoir is kept above 72 degrees. Warm water holds less dissolved oxygen, and therefore encourages the growth of more viruses, fungi, and anaerobic bacteria. Using hydrogen peroxide adds oxygen to you water and cleans the water of pathogens. Benefits include healthier root systems, increased nutrient uptake, thicker stems, and bigger leaves.
  
  One expert claims it should be used on all soil gardens as well as in hydroponics sytems. Knowing as much as I do about beneficial fungus and micro-organisms and the benefits they provide to living plants, I am shy in taking this advice. However, when this first line of defense fails and plants become sick I often resort to using hydrogen peroxide treatments on my soil grown plants.​
  
  

I have also heard it is a viable treatment for fungus gnats in soil as well, as Im sure lots of soil growers have had. I did lol. But yes I'm sure the beneficial organisms would be quite unhappy!

MuckyDucky said:

My pots sit on the bottom of my table. Some say that is a no no. My table doesn't fully drain. It holds about 3/8" and the bottom of the pots and the roots sit in it. Some say that is a no no. I put a lot of holes in my pots so the roots will run out and tangle together. Some say that is a no no. I am still making changes to better my grow but I am not having any issues from any of the above.

I also run 2 air bars in my res all of the time. It keeps the plants happy and helps to keep the res healthy.

Click to expand...

Hey Mucky,
If the pots don't sit on the bottom of the table then what are they supposed to sit on???

I actually put a couple of shims on the far end of the table which slanted the table toward the drain....... did the trick to!!

MuckyDucky said:

This link should work. It is a good read. The post also has another link for added information.
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/311670-guide-hydrogen-peroxide-hydroponics-systems.html

I have a bottle of the 35% hydro grade to treat any res or root problems but my system has been doing ok with just the air stones.

Quote:

• There are no doubts about the benefits of using hydrogen peroxide properly in a hydroponics system. This becomes especially true if your nutrient reservoir is kept above 72 degrees. Warm water holds less dissolved oxygen, and therefore encourages the growth of more viruses, fungi, and anaerobic bacteria. Using hydrogen peroxide adds oxygen to you water and cleans the water of pathogens. Benefits include healthier root systems, increased nutrient uptake, thicker stems, and bigger leaves.
  
  One expert claims it should be used on all soil gardens as well as in hydroponics sytems. Knowing as much as I do about beneficial fungus and micro-organisms and the benefits they provide to living plants, I am shy in taking this advice. However, when this first line of defense fails and plants become sick I often resort to using hydrogen peroxide treatments on my soil grown plants.​
  
  

Click to expand...

So if you use the Hydrogenperoxide do we still need to be overly concerned with the res temp during the warm weather?

Illegalbreather said:

So if you use the Hydrogenperoxide do we still need to be overly concerned with the res temp during the warm weather?

Click to expand...

I believe that if your res temps are over 72 deg adding h2o2 and using air stones could make the difference for a successful grow. I found my temps were right at 72 deg. This was surprising since the the temp under the light has been 78 deg. Anywhooo, what was I saying now?

Illegalbreather said:

Hey Mucky,
If the pots don't sit on the bottom of the table then what are they supposed to sit on???

I actually put a couple of shims on the far end of the table which slanted the table toward the drain....... did the trick to!!

Click to expand...

Sorry. What I meant was was that my pots sit on the bottom of the tray and my roots sit in a little water because the res doesn't fully drain. I am learning but this is my 2nd run with the ebb&flow and I did n't have problems due to pots on bottome of tray or roots sitting in a small amount of water.

Now if you will excuse me I'll have another hit.

Hey Mucky,

I was already thinking ahead to the summer months and a chiller for the res. is very expensive. Saw a cool video on youtube where a guy uses a dehumidifier as a chiller. Give it a watch, looked really easy and much cheaper than purchasing a chiller.

Ok, so here is finally the answer. Both Medusa and WW have five nodes each. Tallest so far is Medusa at 10 inches. The WW is still rather short but has the same number of nodes. I will start flowering at the end of the third week if vegetation. I am just amazed at how green and healthy they all look. Will keep everyone posted with how they're doing......

End of week three is tomorrow. Took some pics while the babies were sleeping so their droopie look is because they're sleeping. Back row is WW and the taller front row is Medusa. The two small ones in the back are ww to left and medusa to right. They had a hard time during germination and I've nursed them along. They won't produce much but I always like to see what a little bit of patience will do for them. I'll be topping tomorrow. Oh, and I've decided to let them veg for four weeks afterall.

Hi Illegal,
I saw your thread and gave it a read. A few years back I ran several 3x3 trays steady for a couple of years. I always did 12/12 right away with no veg time. I love Ebb and Flow because of it's simplicity. I never had root issues and plants were always healthy. I had a 400mh on one tray and a 600hps on the other.

I am a little worried that you'll end up with such a mass of bushiness that you'll be risking mold issues. Plus when you have a crowded tray, you can't really inspect things as easily...though you can move the plants around. I did a semi-lollypop sort of thing. New to hydro so I was kind of improvising. The plants I was growing were WW which aren't really the greatest sog plant but I got pretty good colas nevertheless. I had to do a fair amount of side trimming as the grow progressed.

I recently moved and don't have my room set up...but when I do, I'm going with Satori which is a big time single cola plant.
Keep up the good work,
JD

Thanks JD,

I topped the two biggest medusa plants. Do you think I should " Lollypop " them right away?? The Medusa to my surprise is taking off like a rocket and the WW is staying in the DL so short and bushy. I didn't want to top them and promote their bushiness!!! Any advice you have would be appreciated.

BTW the undergrowth is getting crazy even after the third week.... that's why I was wondering about the Lollypop trimming.

You are the best big man and ROL is lucky to have an experienced grower like you at the helm. I truly appreciate you JD and thanks again!!!

Tess

Illegal,
OK, first topping and lollypopping have two different aims. Topping controls height which you may need...but also tends to cause the plant to grow more side branches.

Lollypopping is a whole different thing for when you want to grow many small single cola plants. So you would never top and lollypop on the same plant.

All your plants look fairly indica leaning...which means their natural tendency is to be more bushy.

Here's a rule of thumb and while it isn't sacrosanct...it is something to shoot for. Training should be mostly done by the 12/12 switch...though a little training may be needed during the stretch (first couple of weeks).

So remembering that your indicas may double in height (or a little more)...get out your tape measure and only top the ones that look like height will be a problem.

Like I said earlier, my guess is that bushiness will be more of an issue then height. So don't panic and start snipping...wait awhile and see how things develop as they grow. And as a seemingly nonsense comment regarding trimming...I try to take a Bonsai approach to pruning. Consider esthetics and balance. I'll check in tomorrow.
JD

J.D.

Got the difference between topping and lollypopping, good education! I only topped the first row extreme right and left as they are the tall boys. The room ceiling is seven feet tall. With the three foot table, you can see the head room is getting rather thin.

I think you can feel that I'm all about patience so I'll keep you tuned in with pics along the way. Have a feeling that lollypopping will be the future for the rest of the babies. I am in the last week of vegetation. BTW the babies in the far back are feeling good and letting the others know they finally woke up from their nap!!!

Thanks again Stud for taking an interest.

IlleGal,
Good morning. Glad the plants are doing well. I realized I didn't know what the origin of your plants was. Feminized seeds? Clones? I guess my point is, are you sure they are all female.

Another point that you might consider for the future is that it's always easier to run just one strain in an Ebb and Flow table. Nutrient needs and growth characteristics could vary and cause issues. One example is that your White Widows may need more Mg. I'd usually use 1/4 tsp Epsom salts as a preventative with Widows. But yours may be different.

Keep in mind that there are a variety of training methods. First familiarize yourself with the basic ideas. Some are more complex and advanced. But they all have one commonality which is the purpose...to select where your buds will grow.

Uncle Ben's topping method is a dual topping technique with 4 main colas.

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/151706-uncle-bens-topping-technique-get.html


Then there's LST and supercropping. Two different methods to train plant mainstem sideways to allow side branches to become top colas. Both those techniques would require more horizontal space and so would not be advisable this run.


And a more advanced training method called main-lining. I only mention this one because I have a link for a great tutorial with pictures. There is one here by Nugbuckets...but this one (also by NB) has better pictures. This one may give you some ideas regarding lower branch trimming and such.

http://www.growweedeasy.com/main-lining-technique-nugbuckets

It's always a good idea to allow some healing time but if you try to get most trimming/training done by week one of flower...you should be good.

One thing I used to do is to move plants around...like furniture arrangement. You can sometimes save a few budsites that way. Meaning rather then cut a branch off...find a better place for the plant. Capiche?
Take care,
JD

Good information JD, and that last link has some great articles, well written and understandable. Thanks!

J.D.

I noticed IlleGal, pretty creative!!!! Ok, get you up to date, pics to follow Saturday. I topped two of the Medusa big girls and have left the rest alone. Topped a couple days ago and already good growth on the new tops. I will be playing it conservative this time around.

I have read Uncle Ben's topping, geez a while back I think, but have never seen the nugbuckets literature. Wow, what a great tutorial and just loaded with information. Thank you so much!!

J.D., from your own personal experience, which worked best for you??? Topping seems so easy while Main lining is getting downright serious!!! The Main Lining looks as though the yield will be the best, what do you think????

IlleGal,
Glad you noticed. Just thought it was appropriate and cute.

I will describe to you what I would do if I were managing your grow. You can then make your own decisions.

First off...you didn't answer my question about whether all your plants were known females. The reason this is important is that if a few plants will be removed for maleness...then the crunch is less.

So one thing you need to understand is the concept of sucker branches. Basically (as I understand it) they are side branches that are low down or inside the main branches. They are growing tips but are positioned to where they will never be productive. So clip them off.

And using the guidelines in that mainlining tutorial, I would probably cut everything off at the second node and below. Those branches will not produce much and the fan leaves will just obstruct airflow down below where the moisture will be. More may be needed later...but remember, anything you cut off cannot be replaced.

I like to keep the inside open to allow ventilation and light penetration...so keep that in mind as you prune.

Supercropping is a technique where you bend a stem to where it breaks. You will feel a snap. Plant will form scar tissue and plant fluids will still flow...even if it's a 90 degree bend.

So keeping that in mind, don't worry too much about early topping. Looks like those plants may be of the squat variety. But if height becomes an issue later on...despite what others may say, you can supercrop the main cola in an emergency late in flower. Better that then burned from a light.

So watch the plants as they grow, and act accordingly as the situation dictates. But don't prune them to death in anticipation of problems that may not occur. Wait and watch and correct action will become obvious. Sheesh...I'm sounding like Yoda! lol
Hollar at me anytime...
JD

J.D.

Sorry, I did forget to answer that question !! They are all feminized. Like some people I know!!! LOL

So, I'm going to trim those babies down tonight, below the 2nd node like you're suggesting. All of those leaves are in the shade now anyway. I'll takes some pics in a few and then post them for you to see, before I trim them.

Yoda!!! Not only is he wise but I bet he's crazy under the sheets!!!!

ahhhhh, so frustrating, can't upload pics, something wrong with RIU software, or the NSA must be around snooping!