Multichip LED, Remote Phosphor - Guess who it is.

Good to have you back around!....Get that other XPG panel in! I counted around 4 of us using these or the XP-E's now...

Awesome! The more Merry panels we can track grow progress of the better! I recently PM'ed jimjim to find out what his panels have been up to (you all can see his progress a few posts back) and now this. That's three Merry panels that I know of (apart from Astir panels, they use the same "heatsink core," but where they sourced their LED's, Idk) so we're just waiting on me, I guess. Looks like these Merry panels can hold their own for low wattage, low investment lighting which is all we ever expected/hoped for, really. Glad to see it.

As for my Chiesel, I could snap some photos, but I don't think I will. Not much difference between week 3 and 4, imo, just a little bulking up. I decided her "leaf claw" was getting out of control so I flushed her (over nitrification in super soil as predicted). I should have flushed her a lot earlier... Like, a LOT earlier, I'm just lazy. Also, I made a little "activated yeast CO2 supplementation jug." I believe that is the clinical name for such a contraption. I guess I'll see if the added CO2 does anything for me. I've also been having some really high RH at night which I'm trying to get a grasp on. Seems like I eased the situation a bit today. I've yet to decide if I'll buy or make a thermoelectric dehumidifier and/or buy a new exhaust fan. I'm actually not sure if either are even necessary, it'd be awesome if they weren't -money is tight- so I'll just be scoping the situation out for the next few days. I'm a little worried Chiesel isn't producing enough crystals for where she is in flowering right now, but I'll play that off as ridiculously high RH (literally 99% last night) and solving the matter will bring her right back on track. Wish me luck, guys.

Found this technique on another forum. Looks like a really cool method for cloning.

jon705 said:

Looks like the air layering was a success. I started them on the 13th so 8 days ago and theres 2 than can be cut right now and the other 2 arent far behind. I really like this tecnique and because I only need 4 clones at a time for my indoor im going to stick with it. space is at a premium in the veg room, with this tecnique I dont need a dome
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I'll probably try this method at some point in time. I definitely feel this guy when he says space is limited in his veg tent. This would allow some one to root clones while they are still on the plant, cut the branch once it's rooted, and immediately plant into a 12/12 environment. I only really have enough room for one mother in my veg tent so up 'til now I was thinking I'd just have to constantly trim her back to a height that would allow ~3 clones to still receive light. With this method I don't need to worry nearly as much about trimming, and the overall size of clones that I can take into flower is greatly increased without needing to "veg" each cutting.

Basically, he shaves the skin off the branch where he wants the branch to begin rooting, he paints a coating of rooting hormone gel over the shaved area, cuts a rapid rooter in half, soaks it, and "claps" it onto the branch. Then he takes some saran wrap, or whatever, and uses electrical tape to keep moisture in. Every few days he uses a syringe to inject some water into the rapid rooter sites.

I've never heard of this technique and it's definitely pioneering/innovative if you ask me. Awesome stuff. Hope you like it, too.

I'd love to, after this harvest I''ll be going with a SoG grow most likely, so I could definitely put this technique to use. I've got three rooted clones right now that are looking good (topped two of them already) and another clone that might make it, but I should probably just pull it. I planned on having 9 plants altogether -3 in 3 out- so that means I'd have to wait for this plant to harvest (early 4th week), and then I'd have to wait another 3-4 weeks after the first wave of clones got kicked into flower (which would give enough time/room for my mother to veg up a few branches for testing). That's a ways away.

Still, I wouldn't mind making a new thread dedicated to this form of cloning. I guess I missed a tiny detail, this is called "air layering," and it's just a relatively unknown form of cloning (I had never heard of it!).
http://forum.grasscity.com/advanced-growing-techniques/375063-air-layering-root-clones-without-cutting.html
Looks like the easiest place to go wrong is too much water and/or light leaks which causes the stem to rot. This guy is doing it with cubes of rock wool.

For me, what's so cool about this is depending on the size of your mom you can basically clone a "fully vegged" plant/branch. I wonder what would have to be done in order to get a sizeable root mass going before you chop. The rooting sites all these guys are creating look relatively small, or very comparable to a normal clone. I wonder if anyone has tried rooting, say, a 6" long site.

So the final weights are in. Wet weight was 41g and dry weight was 14g. They have even gone a little bit purple. Got to love leds.

Those look rock hard and tasty. Well played.

Any idea why she didn't yield more? Maybe longer veg, or more plants next time? No idea, just throwing ideas out.

I think it has a lot to do with being 12/12 from seed and the size of the pot. Here is another one that is going atm, same strain started on the same day as the other one but it appears to be sativa dominate. I want to finish the ones that are going now and start one in either a 3gal or 5gal smart pot but room is the only issue. But definitely more veg time and more training would pay off

Tune for this post
[video=youtube;od3beF-ctTI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=od3beF-ctTI[/video]

Quick flower update (still ~4th week):




Looks like Mag and/or Potassium def. I've thrown some Epsom salt into her water and sprinkled some Green Sand onto her soil. Not much else I can think of past this.

Really... uninspiring thus far. Is it me, or is that not much bud? And I don't see very many crystals. Everyone's free to guess what my yield will be, I'd kinda like to get some opinions on this. Again, ~190W total LED consumption, recently flushed (semi-recovering from N-toxicity), lower leaves yellowing (Mag def? P or K def?), 99% RH at night (with tent flap open, AC left on, 55 degree Fahrenheit at night, fluctuates between 70 and 80 degree during lights on). If that wasn't enough, those are the only "stressors" I can name off the top of my head. I will get some Damp Rid in the near future.

-Edit-
Noticed a low of about 25% RH on my hygrometer. Light's on RH does not approach this. I'm guessing the RH during light's off fluctuates between 99% and 25%. Being able to turn the AC down at night through the use of Damp Rid should alleviate a lot of the problems I'm having.

Bumping Spheda said:

99% RH at night

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EH?!?!?
Do you go in there and find water droplet stains on your lights?
Something sounds weird about that otherwise...

I would FLUSH with plain water after a good dry-out. It's not a Mg or K def, the clawing suggests a toxicity not a deficiency. Did you add a high N source when you noticed your lower growth turning yellow??

heckler: No, I don't see water droplets, or any evidence of it. Right now I honestly think it fluctuates between very low (AC + blower fan on) and very high (only blower fan on), probably at a frequency of maybe 5 minutes, although I'm not sure. It's not crazy humid in my room as you'd expect, I honestly don't know what's up. I think I either need a new extraction fan, or I need to rethink my DIY carbon scrubber to try to increase air flow. Flow rate through the exhaust duct was significantly decreased by the addition of a very thin layer of activated carbon (it still takes care of the odor rather well, but it's really a piddly amount, imo).

PSU: No, I've been feeding her a medium strength solution of the "mid bloom" nutrient pack from Kelp4Less (2-20-20) when I feed her. There's also a little Azomite mixed into the solution. Other than that it's straight water that's been dechlorinated and passed through a Brita filter. The super soil I mixed up was always high in Nitrogen, though. My tomato plant didn't like it, then the Chiesel plant showed N toxicity as I worked her into it via a couple transplants. Once I transplanted her into the ~7gal smart pot she's in right now there were always persistent symptoms. Again, I should have flushed earlier (as well as taken the hint, I knew it was hot with Nitrogen all along). You think I should flush again? It will probably have to wait another day, or two. Thanks for the advice.

Bumping Spheda said:

heckler: No, I don't see water droplets, or any evidence of it. Right now I honestly think it fluctuates between very low (AC + blower fan on) and very high (only blower fan on), probably at a frequency of maybe 5 minutes, although I'm not sure. It's not crazy humid in my room as you'd expect, I honestly don't know what's up. I think I either need a new extraction fan, or I need to rethink my DIY carbon scrubber to try to increase air flow. Flow rate through the exhaust duct was significantly decreased by the addition of a very thin layer of activated carbon (it still takes care of the odor rather well, but it's really a piddly amount, imo).

PSU: No, I've been feeding her a medium strength solution of the "mid bloom" nutrient pack from Kelp4Less (2-20-20) when I feed her. There's also a little Azomite mixed into the solution. Other than that it's straight water that's been dechlorinated and passed through a Brita filter. The super soil I mixed up was always high in Nitrogen, though. My tomato plant didn't like it, then the Chiesel plant showed N toxicity as I worked her into it via a couple transplants. Once I transplanted her into the ~7gal smart pot she's in right now there were always persistent symptoms. Again, I should have flushed earlier (as well as taken the hint, I knew it was hot with Nitrogen all along). You think I should flush again? It will probably have to wait another day, or two. Thanks for the advice.

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Why are you adding synthetic nutrients to super soil? Or adding any nutrients to it?

PetFlora said:

I wonder whether the P- 20 +K 20 is locking something out.

Using high P is one of those myths similar to lot of LED myths. The amount needed is way over sold

Based on K being 20, I would not want more than 10 P

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Yeah.........I think your onto something here, it may well be "phosphorous"leaf clawing showing on bumping's girl. good call pet.....

PetFlora said:

I wonder whether the P- 20 +K 20 is locking something out.

Using high P is one of those myths similar to lot of LED myths. The amount needed is way over sold

Based on K being 20, I would not want more than 10 P

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Judging from my issues with Phosphorous buildup in my tomato, I'd say that's a possibility. I had similar symptoms; dark, clawed leaf, but also smaller leaf growth.
And as noted in my journal, it will cause a systemic problem with other nutes... It really is a tricky, deceptive element...

PetFlora said:

I wonder whether the P- 20 +K 20 is locking something out.

Using high P is one of those myths similar to lot of LED myths. The amount needed is way over sold

Based on K being 20, I would not want more than 10 P

Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll hold off on the mid bloom from here on out.

PSUAGRO. said:

Why are you adding synthetic nutrients to super soil? Or adding any nutrients to it?

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As far as I was aware it was organic. Not sure what you mean. As for why I'm adding nutrients she finished her veg in the 7 gal pot and growth seemed to slow near the end (before I kicked her into flower). I figured her soil had been somewhat depleted.

So flush again and go from there. *sigh*

Thanks guys.

Yes my friend bumping, those P-K #'s are toO high for it to be organic ..........not 100% sure though

Idk about that site, I've done done basic calculationsand their are better and cheaper IMO, I'll give you a couple suggestions /links when I get home......

I would not feed anything else till the end at this point.....the clawing is pretty severe

I have also found bumping that mine will start to claw when the soil is too wet as well. it usually takes a few days to a week to sort itself out i just dont water it. How long has the clawing been going on for or has it just started happening?

Thanks PSU. I've got a bunch of other "organic" fertilizers that I acquired from various places online which I used to create the super soil mix. I imagine it will be a while before I need to restock, but I wouldn't mind the recommendations. It is weird, though, my outdoor tomatoes and bell peppers seem to be loving the bloom packs.

jimjim: She's had clawing leaves for a long time, this goes back to veg. As soon as she set foot in the super soil pretty much, but she'd always have healthy new growth. It never seemed too severe. Her symptoms were exacerbated once I flipped her to flower, though, and then the bloom nutes just sent her completely over the edge forcing me to flush. Kinda sucks on the wet roots + claw 'cause I'm gonna have to drench her soil all over again. Maybe I'll wait for her to droop a little from thirst before I flush.

Alright, just installed DIY Carbon Scrubber V2.0. Seems like there's some alright airflow all around the unit, so I'm hoping that will lower the nighttime RH and I can turn the AC unit down. Will see in a few days once my hygrometer/thermometer has a chance to reset the 24h values.


I also flushed the Chiesel again, it was looking even worse last night and I didn't want to wait. No idea how many gallons I put through her, it seemed like a lot. Hopefully alls clear and my yield won't be damaged too, too, too much. She seems to be bulking up OK right now and there's more and more crystals it seems. Still not a ton, but I like to see the trichome development finally. She's definitely starting to smell nice and rank. Not sure what the smell is -as in Cheese vs Diesel- but it definitely smells good. It's been a few years since I smelled weed so it's a real blast from the past taking a big whiff of her.

The activated yeast jug, on the other hand, smells like what I think bootleg beer during prohibition smelled like. I go in to agitate the jug to get the yeast going (a LOT more bubbles after you shake it) and it immediately overpowers the bud smell. I gotta hand it to the yeast, though, I forgot to mention. The yeast I used expired in 1990!!! I didn't wanna go out and buy yeast and it was all I had. Took a couple days for it to colonize, but damn, it's goin' strong. I'm sure it wouldn't have made bread rise, or at least very little, but for our purposes... Don't believe the expiration date!

Been a while since I showed the veg'un's.

The 9.5W Cree is on Misty, and I've got the 20W NW and 50W WW primarily on the rest. The little burn on Misty are those damn Kelp4Less nutes. I will definitely strictly use them for my tomatoes and bell peppers, the mj isn't diggin' it at all. The little burn on the clones isn't actually burn, their leaves dried and shriveled up during the cloning phase since I wasn't using humidity domes, or anything, I pretty much just shoved them in dirt. All three have been topped already.